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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

MiraiYuji Since: Dec, 2015
#71276: Nov 6th 2016 at 3:18:01 PM

Hello guys.

I'll write the effortpost for Dragon Ball Xenoverse 2 in the day (preferably in the afternoon) and, at best, it will be ready for tomorrow in the morning.

EDIT: [tup]The Devil and Seikura

edited 6th Nov '16 3:20:41 PM by MiraiYuji

Clown-Face Wild Child from Canada Since: Dec, 2015 Relationship Status: In another castle
Wild Child
#71278: Nov 6th 2016 at 4:25:19 PM

[tup]Seikura.

Why so serious?
DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
Morgenthaler Since: Feb, 2016
#71280: Nov 7th 2016 at 10:27:05 AM

New write-up for the Devil.

  • The Dark Side of the Moon: Satan is a Fallen Angel who has pledged to one day become more powerful than God and turn Heaven itself to ash while destroying as many human lives as possible. He has used The Bermuda Triangle as a portal to pull unsuspecting vessels and planes onto the dark side of the moon, killing hundreds if not thousands of innocent people. When the crew of a deep space mission travels close to his Derelict Graveyard, he possesses and slowly kills them off one by one while turning them against each other for nothing more than his own sick amusement. Even the last crew member blowing up the ship does nothing to stop him from continuing his MO unabated.

edited 7th Nov '16 10:30:53 AM by Morgenthaler

You've got roaming bands of armed, aggressive, tyrannical plumbers coming to your door, saying "Use our service, or else!"
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#71281: Nov 7th 2016 at 10:29:47 AM

Oh, Morgen. Did you ever write up Sigrid and Harry?

Morgenthaler Since: Feb, 2016
#71282: Nov 7th 2016 at 10:32:57 AM

Will check if they got enough votes later. Folks seemed to be pretty split on them from what I remember.

You've got roaming bands of armed, aggressive, tyrannical plumbers coming to your door, saying "Use our service, or else!"
PhiSat Planeswalker from Everywhere and Nowhere Since: Jan, 2011
Planeswalker
#71284: Nov 7th 2016 at 10:51:26 AM

Hey guys, back again with a bit of a strange example. Mostly Just for Fun.

Who is he?

King Silias from Ludo's Broken Bride Rock Opera is the King over what remains of civilization at the end of time.

What does he do?

Not content with ruling over what remains of the world, King Silias made a Deal with the Devil to turn his dead troops into zombies by somehow burning/boiling them alive. He then sends his living armies against the dead, creating more zombies presumably for the lulz.

As seen in the Save Our City music video, he brainwashed the loyal mayor of a town to go mad and kill himself not only for fun, but to make the rest of the living despair and give in to the zombie horde. When instead of all dying, the rest of the living are rallied into properly defending themselves against the zombies and him, in his dying breaths he curses the world and summons a giant dragon (implied to be Satan) to destroy the world entirely.

Redeeming Qualities? Motive?

None and none.

Heinous Standard?

Satan himself plays a very small role, more like a MacGuffin than an actual character. Silias causes most of the suffering by far in the tale.

Final Thoughts?

The only reason I'd say no is that he's not all that fleshed out, but I think him being amused at forcing someone to commit suicide in front of a child pushes him out of Generic Doomsday Villain and into this trope instead.

edited 7th Nov '16 10:52:04 AM by PhiSat

Oissu!
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#71285: Nov 7th 2016 at 10:55:34 AM

Morgen, please add The Devil to the Drafts page. FYI, I think I voted [tdown] Harry and [tup] Sigrid.

G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
FriedWarthog Since: Jun, 2014 Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
#71287: Nov 7th 2016 at 2:26:36 PM

Wow, things have really slowed down to a crawl on this thread. o_o

Anyway, I wanted to touch up on a Criminal Minds entry real quick: JB Allen. I was originally doubtful about him, but after seeing his episode I'm far more confident in him counting. But yeah, it's one of those cases where his entry doesn't really do him justice. So here's the original...

  • J.B. Allen from "Foundation" is a construction foreman who targets little boys who watched his employees at work. He abducts Angel Suarez, rapes and tortures him for years on end, and when he escapes he is found with dozens of bite marks; the fact that Allen had to get his teeth recapped is further proof of his brutality. He then finds another victim, Billy Henderson, who he tries to murder by burying alive. He had also done these things to a previous victim, and the trophies he gives his daughter implies that he had dozens more.

And here's the rewrite...

  • Construction foreman J.B. Allen from Foundation is a sadistic pedophile who targets little boys who he draws in by letting them play with his construction tools. Once he has a boy in his grasp, Allen continuously rapes and tortures them over the years before killing them. One of his victims who was lucky enough to escape, a boy named Angel Suarez, was covered in bite marks and was mentally destroyed by Allen's torture. When he finds another victim to replace Angel, a boy by the name of Billy Henderson, he subjects him to the same torture and attempts to bury him alive. His daughter repressed memories of Allen doing the same to another unnamed boy, and all the trophies he'd pawn off on her in the guise of gifts show that he had dozens of other victims.

In an unrelated note, it looks like my "niche" on this thread is to touch up on old rewrites. :I I blame that on most media I take part in either has no qualifiers, already has some, or isn't out yet.

k410ren Since: Jan, 2016
#71288: Nov 7th 2016 at 2:34:45 PM

I gotta agree with the case for Obadiah Hakeswill, the loathsome Sociopathic Soldier. As a rundown of his heinous crimes from the two episodes he appears in Sharpe (I haven't read the books, so what I'm drawing from is what I've seen in the episodes):

  • From Sharpe's Company:
    • Had Sharpe sentenced to 2000 lashes years ago, which was considered a death sentence (of which 200 were performed)
    • Tries to rape Teresa Moreno in the first few minutes he shows up onscreen
    • Frames Sgt. Harper for the theft of Colonel Wyndham's wife's portrait because Harper knows what Hakeswill is doing
    • Threatens Clayton to keep his mouth shut about Hakeswill's lust for Clayton's wife Sally
    • Unrepentingly shoots Ensign Matthews (the only thing Hakeswill regrets is that he missed Sharpe)
    • Stabs one of his own men in the assault on Badajoz
    • Shoots Price when he tries to stop Hakeswill raping Teresa
    • Rapes and murders Sally Clayton

  • From Sharpe's Enemy:
    • Captures two women, Sarah Dubreton and Lady Farthingdale, threatening to rape and murder them if there is no ransom or if a rescue attempt is made
    • Throws the maids to the other deserters to be raped
    • Murders Teresa when she tries to stop him raping Lady Farthingdale, laughing as he does so

Hakeswill hits all the hallmarks, being despicable by the standards of the story, his actions evoke revulsion and hatred, and shows no remorse for his crimes.

In the words of Sharpe after Hakeswill is finally caught at the end of Sharpe's Enemy:

"A liar. A thief. A rapist. A murderer. That's not a man. Take it away."

edited 7th Nov '16 9:30:16 PM by k410ren

"I'll show you the Dark Side." CM actors and kills
G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
The 47th President
#71289: Nov 7th 2016 at 2:38:05 PM

[up][up] Say I have a question. When will you be able to do the write up for John Curtis as well as the effort post of that other candidate?

My sandbox of EPs and other stuff
FriedWarthog Since: Jun, 2014 Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
#71290: Nov 7th 2016 at 2:46:37 PM

I'm not pursuing Curtis any further. Same with the other character (Izzy Rogers from Season 7): I've been debating whether or not to do it, but at the moment there's just one potentially mitigating factor regarding her that I just feel is too ambiguous for people to comfortably vote yes. For what it's worth I feel that she counts, but at the same time don't think others will and thus, I won't even bother. I don't like wasting my time like that.

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#71291: Nov 7th 2016 at 3:15:01 PM

Now, obvious yes to Seikura and the Devil.

As for King Silias, that, uh, seems..interesting. He seems to hit every point from where I'm standing.

Now...Obadiah Hakeswill...my own personal white whale of this trope who just barely got disqualified in the books. However...it seems the show version actually...counts? His redeeming qualities aren't present or diminished (in the books, he spares Lady Farthingdale from being assaulted because she claims she's there to pray for her mother...in the show he tries to rape her later anyways, and just wants the ransom)

So, yeah, the show version is equally evil to the book's version, if not worse. I'd say we have ourselves a keeper, folks.

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#71292: Nov 7th 2016 at 3:20:56 PM

Seems Seikura has enough approval. One of my shorter writeups, but if there's no contention...

The Octagon: Seikura is the resentful half-brother of Scott James and the leader of a powerful, multi-national terrorist syndicate. Training aspiring terrorists in the way of the ninja to become assassins and dispersing graduates to commit terrorist actions worldwide, Seikura holds his disciples to a code that, if broken, ensures the death of both them and their entire families. Seikura proves his ruthlessness when he has the family of Nancy, her diplomat brother, and her family - among them a child - slaughtered by his assassins. Seikura later captures Scott's friend AJ and forces Scott to participate in the titular lethal fighting course, and defiantly slits AJ's throat anyways when Scott passes the test.

edited 7th Nov '16 3:37:21 PM by Scraggle

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#71293: Nov 7th 2016 at 3:21:24 PM

edited 7th Nov '16 3:50:33 PM by ACW

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
k410ren Since: Jan, 2016
#71295: Nov 7th 2016 at 3:41:34 PM

@71291 As I said, I drew Hakeswill's examples from the show, since I haven't read the books.

edited 7th Nov '16 3:42:20 PM by k410ren

"I'll show you the Dark Side." CM actors and kills
Nithael (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#71296: Nov 7th 2016 at 3:42:50 PM

Two weeks ago I proposed Zeus from Turbo Kid and since most people voted that he counted (only ACW wasn't sure due to possible agency issues) I've finally done a writeup for him.

  • Turbo Kid: Zeus played by Michael Ironside is a vicious tyrant who fancies himself a grandiose emperor who rules over the post-apocalyptic Wastelands with an iron fist and enjoys brutalizing as many people as possible. Flashbacks show him violently murdering the kid's parents for refusing to tell him where they got their water, which he considered stealing from him, and letting the kid to die in the desert. Years later, Zeus has cemented a monopoly over potable water in the Wastelands and has his henchmen bring back on a spike the head of anyone who has angered him. His warriors also regularly abduct people in the region and force them into bloody Gladiator Games where the losers are put into a machine that crushes them to death and extracts the water in their body, which is the real source of Zeus' water. When the heroes manage to win in the arena against his champions, Zeus tries to have them executed anyway and send his men after them when they escape. Zeus later tortures junk dealer Bagu for information, only to slowly disembowel him to death anyway after he learned everything he wanted to know. In the final confrontation against the protagonists, Zeus reveals that he is a robot who killed his own creator and that he considers human beings as nothing more than pests to be eradicated.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#71297: Nov 7th 2016 at 3:51:13 PM

Lighty: Yes, after I posted. Hence the [nja].
[up] How is that movie anyway? Regardless of Zeus's agency issues, the movie still seems pretty fun.

DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#71299: Nov 7th 2016 at 5:11:22 PM

First off:

  • Black Cat: Hjalmar Poelzig is a depraved Satanist who plumbed depths almost unheard of in 1930s horror cinema. Having served in World War one, Poelzig betrayed his comrades to have them slaughtered and condemned the survivors to torturous death camps, including his closest friend Vitus Werdegast. Seducing and marrying Vitus's wife, Poelzig murdered her and kept her preserved corpse- before marrying her and Vitus's daughter when she was of age. Running a Satanic cult, Poelzig captures hapless travelers and sacrifices them to his master, intending to sacrifice the female lead of the film. Finally, Poelzig murders his current wife, adding her preserved corpse to his macabre collection.
  • Alien Nation: Koulak, a sadistic Overseer guard, is infamous for having created a special 'game.' Since salt is corrosive to the skin of his species, Koulak designs a device that randomly fires out steam, water or salt water, forcing 'players' to press buttons that blast them, with none knowing what will hit them until it's too late. Reveling in his authority, Koulak frequently taunted the series hero, George (Then known as Stangya), with the knowledge his turn would come to join the game, even selecting George's brother to play, resulting in his death. Upon the arrival on earth, Koulak becomes a crime boss who continues his game in illegal underground betting rings, forcing those who owe him money to play, or just abducting others off the streets. In a series focusing on tolerance and equality, Koulak stands apart as the darkest the Overlords had to offer.
  • American Vampire: The Gray Trader, or the Great Traitor, was once humanity's greatest hero Hurin. Joining the monstrous Beast, the original source of all monsters, Hurin became its protector and greatest servant. Attempting to revive the Beast to bring about hell on earth, the Gray tortures and kills countless innocents, often using the voices of their loved ones to torture them or convince them to allow him to devour them and convert them into soulless demon servants of the Beast. The Trader converts an entire mining community into soulless husks of themselves while 'seeding a Woman with the Beast, forcing her to give birth to it in an agonizing process that lasts weeks. Torturing his victims for information, the Trader locates multiple vampire children and feeds them to his master as well before unleashing his monsters on America, resulting in mass slaughter. Devoted only to the Beast and bringing about the end of days for humanity, Hurin demonstrates how far even humanity's greatest hero can fall.
  • Bedlam: George Sims, the master of Bedlam house, is a ruthless, greedy man who runs the asylum with an iron fist. Manipulating the political system to have any rivals thrown into the madhouse, Sims rigs the window outside their cells so that when they try to escape, they inevitably fall to their deaths. Starving, beating and torturing inmates, Sims has a young woman thrown into Bedlam when she attempts to have the inmates treated better. Sims frequently attempts to break her faith in humanity and tries to have her thrown in a cell with a murderous inmate. When he learns she is going to testify before a parole board, Sims attempts to force her to take a 'solution' that will leave her dead or insane.
  • Hell House: Emeric Belasco, The Roaring Giant, was a short man who wished to be 'bigger' by sawing off his legs and replacing them with lengthy prosthetics. Becoming an occultist, Belasco turned his house into a den of depravity and horror, eventually murdering his guests during a particularly horrific evening to channel their energy and allow himself to become a powerful ghost. Haunting what is now known as Hell House, Belasco murders or drives those who set foot in his home insane, possessing others and using them to rape and murder their companions. Belasco rapes a spiritualist, also forcing her to experience acts she finds deplorable while forcing her to enjoy them, before murdering her and leaving her corpse in a profane position for her companions to find, before trying to murder them all as well.
  • Dog Soldier: As a manga that owes a great debt to American action films, Dog Soldier has some very nasty villains.
    • Zardoz, foudner and leader of the New Revolutionary Army, is a vicious terrorist responsible for countless attacks, including one that claimed the lives of hero John Kyosuke Hiba's parents. In present, Zardoz's men bomb a jumbo jet that is filled with passengers to kill Ronald Reagan and when this fails, Zardoz has them hijack another plane to fly it, with all passengers, into Reagan's meeting place. When he learns Reagan is in Tokyo, Zardoz and his forces attack an airbase and slaughter all the soldiers before taking the President hostage, planning on seizing control of a nearby nuclear arsenal with no compunction in burning Tokyo to ash
    • Muammar Gaddafi himself, dictator of Libya. When a plane is downed in his country, Gaddafi takes the crew hostage, including a nuclear scientist who desires to continue making nuclear weapons. When Hiba and his friend Fudo go on a rescue operation, Gaddafi has all three hundred passengers massacred and tortures Hiba by carving a grid into his back and ripping off chunks of his skin. Having designed an ICBM hundreds of times stronger than the nuke, Gaddafi plans to nuke the entire West, not caring that this will result in the destruction of Libya as he can simply hide out in his nuclear bunker. When he and Hiba engage in a duel to the death, Gaddafi boasts of consuming the entire West in nuclear fire, not caring that he'll sentence his own people to death in the process.

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#71300: Nov 7th 2016 at 5:22:07 PM

  • Once Upon a Time in China II: High Priest Kau-Kung, master of the White Lotus sect, leads a crusade against anything even vaguely western. Having his followers burn every Western item they can find, Kau-Kung even has western dogs burnt alive before sending his men into the streets to attack and murder those with western items, technology or clothing. Kau-Kung has his followers attack multiple institutions, including a school for children to learn foreign languages with Fei-Hung barely saving the lives of the children. He then has the foreign embassies besieged, intending to have every Westerner within massacred along with any Chinese citizen seen as a 'collaborator'
  • Pure Hate: In this novel by Wrath James White, Malcolm Davis is a terrifying, dark-skinned giant with platinum fangs who never managed to get over his former best friend and his girlfriend cheating on him in High School. Becoming a serial killer to 'practice' his revenge, Malcolm started on gay men, before killing couples and graduating to entire families. Finally attacking his old friend Reed, Malcolm kills his young children before raping, mutilating and murdering Reed's wife, leaving reed alive to suffer. Malcolm goes on a killing spree of those in his way, killing cops, security guards and anyone who recognizes him before abducting and raping his ex-girlfriend, before allowing his accomplice to do the same, later killing her as well. When he and Reed encounter eachother one last time, Reed attempts to talk sense into Malcolm before Malcolm firmly rejects all attempts and blows Reed's head off before being gunned down himself.
  • White Zombie: The evil voodoo practitioner Murder Legendre runs his sugar plantation with the zombies who are corpses of former rivals or those who got in his way. When he forms an obsession with the heroine Madeleine, Legendre ostensibly promises her admirer to help win her own by poisoning her and turning her into a zombie, before poisoning him as well and coldly rejects his plea for help. When her fiancee shows up to save her, Legendre attempts to have him murdered, intending to claim Madeleine as a mindless shell of herself as he has done to so many others .
  • Tower of London: Richard III and the clubfooted executioner and torturer Mord are partners in evil. Seeking to ascend the throne, Richard plots the murder of his family with Mord happily serving as his accomplice and willing instrument. Introduced happily torturing helpless victims in his his chambers, Mord and Richard eliminate several problematic lords, drowning Richard's own brother George of Clarence in a cask of wine. When a rival escapes with treasure to bring to Richard's rival to the throne Henry Tudor, Richard has Richard's child nephews murders, with Mord carrying the deed out. When Henry Tudor arrives to stop Richard's tyrannic reign, Mord happily takes to the field to 'kill in hot blood' alongside his equally wicked master.


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