During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
OUAT spoilers for two characters to keep an eye out for:
1. Peter Pan is back as a dead spirit residing in the Underworld due to him having unfinished business, that business being to make amends with his son Rumple and get a new start. Remember when I said he might possibly have remorse for what he did in life? Yeah, turns out that's not the case at all - he's still depicted as being evil and is acting as selfishly as ever because now he wants Rumple to trade out one of the good guys' lives for his own life so that he can escape the Underworld and return to the world of the living alongside Rumple. And that "new start" he wants to make with Rumple? Spoilers for future episodes suggest that he wants to share a life of evil with his son, whom he'd obviously want subservient to him. So as of now there seems to still be no truly redeeming features to be found in Pan, but we'll have to wait and see how he fares in future appearances since this arc is still ongoing.
2, The arc's Big Bad, Hades, is worth watching. We don't know what his aim is, but he apparently does not want the souls he has living in his Underworld to resolve their unfinished business and move on to the afterlife beyond the Underworld. He coerced Cora into aiding him and made her carry out a plan to get Regina, Henry, and Robin out of the Underworld that involved Cora threatening to send the soul of Regina's father to Hell if they didn't leave. When this plan ended in failure, Hades, out of pure petty spite, demoted Cora back to a miller's daughter so that she'd suffer an eternity in a role and status she hated. And clearly, he got off on giving her this punishment.
edited 7th Mar '16 8:12:25 AM by ANewMan
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If they do add him, his description should be this:
Despite his Laughably Evil nature, everything about him is taken seriously and easily passes the henious standard.
Okay with 7
and 0
I give you the write up for the "Fan Zone Killer"
Dying Light: "The Fan Zone Killer" appears in the side quest "Fan Zone" and while he only appear in that one side quest, he manages to represent the worst that the zombie filled city of Harran has to offer. He makes broadcasts at the Old Town Broadcast station to people that there are women and children in the broadcast station who need food and water. When Kyle Crane hears this and goes to investigate, it is soon revealed that this was a lie. In reality he is a Serial Killer who ever since the time the zombie outbreak first started and used the broadcast station to lure people in and kills them himself with dead bodies lying all over the station as evidence. He even brags to Crane he has so many people he lost count of how many, even saying he killed women and children! When Crane faces off with him, the Killer promises he'll make Crane suffer as much as possible, starting by cutting off his ears so he won't hear a thing while saying his screams won't go to waste. It is implied that this is how many if not all of his victims died and that the only reasons this is for pure enjoyment.
edited 7th Mar '16 10:49:26 AM by G-Editor
My sandbox of EPs and other stuffOk, I'm prepping up my effortposts for Gellidus, and the Lich Caeldor from the Key of Destiny trilogy. Just a bit longer. My glances through my old stuff reveals a few other guys who may count, but Gellidus is impressing the heck out of me. For a guy who was a footnote for Team Evil for a long time, he vaults over the heinous line when he gets time to come into his own.
BTW, after giving it some thought, I think I'm gonna have to vote
on Dark Rider.
I've also started 2000 AD. Feel free to work on the header.
edited 7th Mar '16 10:01:55 AM by ACW
I still have a hard time understanding signature (bottom of the post). I don't see signature at the bottom of the post
edited 7th Mar '16 10:05:20 AM by G-Editor
My sandbox of EPs and other stuffYou know how some Complete Monsters have witty personalities that you'd expect to see in Laughably Evil characters but aren't actually considered Laughably Evil? (Randall Flagg, Dick Hardly, King Boo, AM, etc.) Why do you think this is?
Cause it makes them seem all the more evil. I mean if a villain is an openly psychotic mad man, or a sick sadistic bigot from the start we can be appaled by them, but where not so suprised when they do evil deeds. On the other hand if the villain comes across as charming, likable and funny, we're initially going to assume there going to be a softer or at least fun villain, as such when they do things that are outright terrible they hit a lot harder. I believe one writer described the way to write a good Joker comic as "first he should make you worry, then he should make you laugh, then he should make you feel sick when you realise what you were laughing at." The blend just doesn't feel right, cause it causes us to adopt to completely opposite opinions about the villain.
It equally works in reverse, if the hero is introduced as seemingly cruel and unkind, it makes there true noble side seem a lot more noble and grand, its one of reasons anti-heroes or heroes who start off as jerks are popular.
edited 7th Mar '16 11:41:09 AM by MGD107
Just to clarify, the CMs I mentioned have witty attitudes but no comedic traits.
Dick did pass off as a Bitch in Sheep's Clothing however.
edited 7th Mar '16 1:12:24 PM by superboy313

Definitely
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