During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Whoa, Evil Is Sexy indeed.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
Quinella
Any more thoughts on Shep Lambrick? Currently, he's got 5 votes in favor, 1 against. So, how big of a lead does a character need again?
: Me, Tyk5919, DemonDuckOfDoom, Clown-Face, VeryMelon
![[tdown]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_down_emoticon_3571.png "[thumb down]"){kind=small}
: username2527
edited 9th Feb '16 11:24:40 AM by Pwnisher248
Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
About four or five votes. One or two more votes should do it.
In the event that he's found to qualify, I decided to make a writeup for him:
- Complete Monster: Shep Lambrick is a seemingly-philanthropical corporate executive who invites people in financial trouble to his dinner parties so that he can make them perform unpleasant acts for his entertainment. Determined that Every Man Has His Price, Lambrick offers his guests money to play a game of "would you rather?" with every choice being a sadistic one. He has one man slowly beaten to death over a stress-induced outburst at Lambrick's son, makes another slice his eyeball open, causes a third man to die of a heart attack after having his hand blown off by an M-80 firecracker, and has a woman's head held underwater until she drowns. While Lambrick does make good on his promise to the eventual winner, it's made perfectly clear that she's been badly traumatized by his "game," something he is apathetic to. While he claims to be sympathetic to the financial plights of others, it is painfully obvious that Lambrick is just a sadistic sociopath who takes advantage of the less-fortunate in order to amuse himself.
Shep Lambrick
Quinella
I found this unaroved entry in Providence
- Complete Monster: Moore portrays each Lovecraftian villain as three-dimensional people, with caring sides and human motivations that can come to the fore when appropriate: even Garland Whately's actions are understandable. It helps that many of their more monstrous acts occur off-panel. But Etienne Roulet stands out as a depraved rapist who ruins the lives of everyone around him, gleefully raping Robert while the latter is in a child's body, and casually talking about Elspeth dying in her father's body.
edited 9th Feb '16 11:55:38 AM by Silverblade2
Wild Child
Quinella.
Added Lambrick to the YMMV page for Would You Rather.
Wild Child
- Five Element Ninjas: Cheng Yun Mudou is the teacher of the Five Element Ninjas, and wishes to be the ruler of the martial arts world. Seeking to wipe out the competition, Cheng Yun Mudou collaborates with Chief Hong to defeat Yuan Zeng's class. Mudou kills Zeng's class before burning Zeng to death, with Tian Hao being the only survivor. Mudou then betrays Hong and murders him and his class to take their place as well. When Hao escapes from Mudou's clutches, he has his female spy, Shenji, threatened with execution before sentencing her to hard labor. He later battles Hao and his new martial arts students, and succeeds in killing Hao before his own death.
to Shep since he kept his word and gave her the money.
to Quinella and Shep.
I'll try my hand at another image for Monster.Yu Gi Oh once someone tells me whether or not the uploaded images now go directly to the page.
Wild Child
On images, I'm still surprised it took us so long to find a good Monster.X Men image, since I checked comicvine and there were several pretty good ones, and not just of Selene.
Why so serious?
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
- Satoshi: Recomment here.
- Like what? They can still go to the main image page.
- Only seven pages now needing quotes.
Answered the question myself on a Wiki Sandbox. How's this
◊ for Monster.Yu Gi Oh?
edited 9th Feb '16 3:22:05 PM by SatoshiBakura
That's a good picture.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Eh, it'll do if there's nothing better.
edited 9th Feb '16 3:26:41 PM by ACW
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Wild Child
Shep Lambrick now has 8 yes votes vs. 2 no votes.
: Me, Tyk5919, DemonDuckOfDoom, Clown-Face, VeryMelon, SatoshiBakura, Overlord, ACW
: username2527, bobg
I added my writeup to the Would You Rather YMMV page.
edited 9th Feb '16 3:51:04 PM by Pwnisher248
to Quinella and Shep.
to the Dawn Seeker villains.
Also if a villain torturing a hero is a worthy image for this trope, then I support the image of Dolim torturing Archer as the image for the Star Trek page.
Here is an interesting question, do certain historical settings make it almost impossible to have complete monsters? We have had monster characters in World War 2, the Vietnam War, during Slavery in America, during genocidal campaigns like the Rwanda genocide in 1994. But what about say World War I, where most of the carnage happens on the battle field between soldiers and both sides are equally cynical and ruthless? .Could anyone be a monster in that setting?
edited 9th Feb '16 3:47:45 PM by Overlord
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
If, say, a soldier takes particularly sadistic joy in killing, and goes beyond orders, then possibly.
I'll toss in a for Shep. He does keep his word, but nothing says a CM has to pull an I Lied. And apparently he ends up a damn Karma Houdini 
For Quinella, I can barely understand the effortpost.
edited 9th Feb '16 3:56:08 PM by ACW
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Messenger from another dimension.
Changing my vote on Frenic from keep to cut.
Welcome to the world of greatest media!
to Quinella.
Hello, is a while after my last time where i come here. I have a cantidate from Sword Art Online, is a character from the Alicization Arc, the latest arc of the LN and without a anime adaptation (yet).
The cantidate in question is Quinella, the Highest minister of the Axiom Church and Administrator of the Human Empire .
The most important thing here, is explain about the setting. The Alicization arc is very diferent to the other arcs (also, is the longest).
The Setting (I'm copypasting a lot of term from the SAO wiki....
I´m awful.)
The Project Alicization is a goverment project created for the company RAHT to create Buttom-Up A.I.s (a AI with real intelligence) and use the AI for unmanned weapons to improve Japan’s weak defence technology, and to take the place of soldiers in wars in order to reduce human casualties.
The only known way to create a Bottom-Up AI is through the cloning of a human Fluctlight (the fotons of the human brain, the digitization of the human soul) - creating an Artificial Fluctlight. An Artificial Fluctlight is the cloned quantum field (soul) of a newborn baby, which is later nurtured in a VR world, the fluclight of those babies was almost empty and was easy create a "soul archetype" which could be inserted into the virtual world where it could grow and develop into a new individual.
That VR world was the Underworld, the main setting of the Alicization arc.
The world required for nurturing the Artificial Fluctlights would need to be extremely vast, nearly equal to the level of modern society, but even the machines of RATH wasn´t capable of completely reproducing the world. That is why it was decided to bring the level of the civilization in the virtual world to a past era, when science and philosophy were just being discovered, so that it would be easier to nurture the A.I.s under certain conditions and prevent them from realizing that their world is a fake. Unfortunately, the people behind this project were complete amateurs to the cultural and social norms of the past era, so, instead of recreating a past era, it was thought that limited terrain and customs would be enough to create different settings for the world which could then be adjusted when needed, with all troublesome issues being resolved by the term "magic".
Although creating a virtual world within the STL mainframe would not require any 3D data, creating the model data would be too uninteresting to do, therefore, the free kernel version of the Cardinal System, «The Seed» (used for VRMMO´s, as SAO, Alfheim, GGO and others), was downloaded and used to create the villages and landscape of the new virtual world and then transferred into the STL mainframe using the visual mnemonics feature of the STL, with the Cardinal being left in charge of balancing the created VR world. That is how the world of «Underworld» came to be.
The first 16 A.I.s were created and nurtured in 2 farming families with NP Cs filling in the role of other villagers. However, the first A.I.s could not be nurtured by another AI, so 4 Rath employees volunteered to enter Underworld and raise the first A.I.s to the age of 18 (with the FLA rate set to 1000, meaning that only 1 week had passed in real life), after which, they were logged out by simulating their death via an “epidemic” and their memories of their time in Underworld being suppressed. As the children were raised and eventually formed families of their own, the number of Artificial Fluctlights in Underworld quickly multiplied and gradually replaced the NPC villagers. In 3 weeks of reality or 300 years of simulation, the population of Underworld reached 80,000 and the Artificial Fluctlights expanded from a small village to occupying most of Underworld and even created a central government structure and their own religion. A feudal system started to develop in Underworld, with royal families and the Axiom Church ruling over the world. Although there is no logical need for this kind of system in Underworld, it most likely came about because one of the original four Rath workers sent in to create a society had different intentions than the others. It is most likely that they had less ethics than the other three and wanted their children to rule the world. These thoughts and feelings were then passed on to their children and thus the feudal system started to take shape. (The consequencies for being pure soul, your feelings and emotions will be heredated to your souls, thus the nobles, especially the most powerful were almost Always Chaotic Evil -not absolute, some nobles are nice people-)
However, even though the A.I.s were growing with the same level of intellect as humans, a problem (from RATH´s perspective) was discovered. In the 300+ years of simulation there hasn't been a single war, not even a single killing, due to the Artificial Fluctlights being overly obedient and not being capable of breaking any laws or rules set upon them.
Then RATH create tragedies in orden to force the people to kill others but even then, they people of Underworld can´t kill, even for their own survival.
They tried to put volunteers with their erased memories in the world but even them can´t break the law of the Taboo Index (the main law of Underworld).
Finally, it was decided that a new test subject, who is used to living in a VR world and would not feel discomforted while living in Underworld was required. Kirito, the main character, was selected for this role due to his experience with living in virtual worlds for extended amounts of time, namely the game «Sword Art Online». He was also chosen because of the level of proficiency he displayed and capability to adapt within the game. Unlike the testers from Rath, Kirito (with his memories of the RL blocked) exhibited an unseen level of curiosity and activity, being on the verge of breaking the Taboo Index many times, although he never actually broke any of the laws. However, Kirito's influence did make Eugeo and Alice Schuberg, the people closest to him, more likely to break the Taboo Index, until one day, Alice finally broke one of the clauses of the Taboo Index by touching the soil of the Dark Territory in an attempt to save the life of a dying Fluctlight.
(Kirito don´t know about the exact motives of RATH, he believe who they are doing this for more noble reasons and don´t know how fucked up is the project).
A time later, Kirito is attacked by Jhonny Black and is put into the Underworld to save his life. Kirito awake in Uderworld and the plot start.
Who is the cantidate.
Quinella is the Bigger Bad of the first part of the Alicization arc, and the Big Bad of Vol 14.
She was a woman who born of a political marriage between strong noble families (who in the Alicization world -Underworld- is almost Always Chaotic Evil, is kinda hard to explain) at that time. Her father was the lord in charge of the town of Centoria, and was the one who gave the Sacred Tasks (a eternal job). To maintain power in the family he created and bestowed upon her a new Sacred Task: Sacred Arts Research (magic, she had the work to investigate the magic and arts relateds).
She discovered new Sacred Arts that the other Underworld Residents had not known. By studying the meanings of the words used in the commands (who are in english, the people in Underworld talk japanese and they think who the english is a sacred lenguaje), she was able to form the first offensive command, the «Thermal Arrow» and with it, she discovered that killing any other living being, will increase the person's stats, so she sneaked out of home every night to hunt nearby animals and rose her stats at an incredible rate. (She can´t kill humans, because is her programmation). And yes, she was grinding
Taking advantage of her knowledge, she made people believe that she was gifted by gods, and took the opportunity to start creating the Central Cathedral, and with it, the Axiom Church. She created the Feudal System in Underworld by making the lords into nobles and thus, creating a structure to control the entire Underworld. The restriction imposed by the Axiom Church on lowering the life stats of living beings was created by Quinella to prevent other humans from elevating their authority levels.
Her power grown and she create the Tower in the Cathedral, she become anxious when she discover who her death was near (by old age) and try to find a way to become inmortal, until one day, in the merge of death she discover a command that allowed her to see the list of all commands accessible in Underworld, because she raised her System Control Authority level to the maximum and granted herself the authorities that were reserved only for the Cardinal System, including terrain manipulation, item generation and even the manipulation of the durability of dynamic units, including humans.
Quinella immediately used her new powers to completely restore her own Life, halt its natural degeneration and recovered her former appearance from her years as a youth. However, Quinella was not yet satisfied. She could not permit the existence of one that had an authority level equal to hers - the Cardinal System. While recklessly trying to decipher the complex syntax of supervisor-level commands via a reference list created for Rath employees, she devised an extensive complicated command in hopes of stealing the powers of the Cardinal System. However, a single yet enormous error with reciting the command led to her burning the core principles of the Cardinal System onto her own Fluctlight. Turning herself into the Adminstrator of Underworld.
What she does?
She take the desire of the Cardinal System and mixed it with her own greed, she had a desire for regulate the world, she want keep the Human Empire the same forever, and to do it, she must take the control of the people. She turn the four biggest lord and become them into Emperors (the corruption into the souls of the nobles become worse after it). She create a inmortal wall to create barriers between nations, she create barriers as the Gigar Cedar (a tree imposible to cut).
However, the Cardinal System try to take control over her in her moments of emotional weakness, so she take people who questiones the rules of the Axiom Church and experiment with their memories, turning them into Integrity Knights, her biggest warriors.
She experiment with her own memories and elimate her emotions as anger and fear.
After 150 years she discover who her Fluclight has reacher its limit, she take a human little girl of 10 years and overwrote her memories in her, when the process was complete both Quinella and her clone was shocked and fall into a psychological breakdown. Cardinal allowed to take control of the clone, after this Cardinal ended in the body of the girl and Quinella in her own body.
They fight and Quinella win but Cardinal run away and survive, that is in the backstory.
In the plot, she turn not only rebelds against the Taboo Index as experiment subject to turn them into Integrity Knights, but also the winners of tournaments to turn them into her servants after erase her memories who she lock.
She also made experiment with other peoples,as Fizel and Linel, two 10-years old litte girls who was forced to kill each other for five years (the process started when they was five years-old), other childs was forced too but Fizel and Linel were the only survivors. They desire be Integrity Knights and Quinella turn them into it, becase they were so badass little girls who kill even other Integrity Knights.
Around the Light Novels Kirito and Eugeo, discover a lot of her experiments.
Quinella made a lot of experiment with the memory of other people, including her "Senate" who is people put in a I Must Scream status, constantly monitoring the world.
She also brainwash Eugeo into a Integrity Knight, when she fail she try to put Kirito´s group into a Fate Worse than Death or outright try to kill them, when Cardinal surrender, she kill her showing a lot of sadism after a beatdown. Then she kill Eugeo when He try to attemp a heroic sacrifice and finally is hurted by Kirito, she dies after her loyal servant, Chuldelkin try to help her...when he is in fire form. Also, that was after Quinella left him die. Also, she made a Golem made of human bodies turned into swords and souls, and plan made more to serve as her guardians.
She made the Heinous Standart?
Yes. She has the longest list of crimes of SAO´s villains, she made experiments equal of worse than Sugou´s, she kill more people than Death Gun (or put them into a Fate Worse than Death) and she totally wreck with the society of Underworld.![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]")
Of course, i don´t want cut the other villains, she has more resources than them.
Positive Traits?
None, she is just a ambituous sefish bitch who want control all, she try to make the golem of human souls to "protect the Human Empire" for the Invation of the Dark Territory (RATH´s last stage is start the end of the world to test the habitants) but isn´t for altruism, she want protect the human Empire because is her empire.
She show a huge Lack of Empathy, sure, this is partially because she mess with her own emotions, but she made it consciously and purposely.
Lack of good traits![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]")
, she lack of a Freudian Excuse, sure, she is a noble and her soul is corrupt but other nobles can show at least one good moment, and a good bunch of them are nice people. Eldrie, the 31 Integrity Knight is a decent guy and is a Noble.
So, i give Quinella a
edited 9th Feb '16 10:16:34 AM by KazuyaProta
Watch me destroying my country