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Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

ANewMan A total has-been. Since: Apr, 2013 Relationship Status: Don't hug me; I'm scared
A total has-been.
#46126: Oct 21st 2015 at 9:48:36 PM

Forgot to mention [tup] Cob. I saw that movie earlier this year - the guy's basically Lord Voldemort, ultimately pitiful in his fear of death but not doing a single decent thing or possessing any redeeming features whatsoever.

I would've kept Tao, though - I feel he is an example of an irredeemable villain who's low on resources and operates on a small scale but manages to be Not So Different from the likes of Frieza anyway due to what a ruthless, pitiless, and vile Knight of Cerebus he is. (And it should be noted that he resented his brother Shen over the tiniest of things, and their current relationship was strictly professional and for convenience.)

bobg Since: Nov, 2012
#46127: Oct 21st 2015 at 10:03:01 PM

Final creepypasta keeps are Peter, Red, X, Shannon, Mr Bear, Lester, Alice Killer, and Bobby.

jjj
Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#46128: Oct 21st 2015 at 11:22:34 PM

...Actually, re-reading Patient 88 (it was deleted on the Creepypasta Wiki but a link is here) there's more of a plot than I took it for. The horror of Richards' crimes isn't glorified and said story has actual characters who aren't just there to be tortured. Albeit it's not a great story, but quality isn't what we're measuring and the story isn't mindless Torture Porn and has a fairly sympathetic main character, so I might actually have to reconsider Richards.

Aside from that, everyone not mentioned on the post above? Burn 'em.

edited 21st Oct '15 11:23:37 PM by Scraggle

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#46129: Oct 22nd 2015 at 12:22:43 AM

Anyone got a good quote for the Creepypasta page? If Sonic.exe still counts, we can use the one on the quotes page.
P.S. Don't forget, One Piece gets swapped this weekend.

Kookosbanaani Since: May, 2015
#46130: Oct 22nd 2015 at 12:30:08 AM

Most evil CM?

That's a hard one, but I'd say Captain Vidal from Pan's Labyrinth is the worst of the worst, which is saying a lot. He's also among the most chillingly realistic CM's out there.

edited 22nd Oct '15 12:30:52 AM by Kookosbanaani

Kookosbanaani Since: May, 2015
#46131: Oct 22nd 2015 at 1:32:52 AM

OK, so another effort post here, this time from anime/manga series Kaiji (Gambling Apocalypse Kaiji) and in my opinion, is one of the worst CM's out there. Again, sorry for the poor English, this entry here is probably the clunkiest of them all.

Who is he?

Kazutaka Hyodo is the Big Bad of parts 1, 2 and 3 and is a seventy-year old wealthy socialite and president of the financial consulting firm Teiai and the sponsor of numerous underground gambling tournaments.

What has he done?

Hyodo is a man driven mad by power and wealth whose only leisure time activity is to fund gambling tournaments and watch the destitute of society struggle for their lives and money. In part 1, Hyodo has a group of people, owing thousands of dollars at him, forced to gamble in a ship with cards to collect badges from each other. Those who lose all their badges are transferred in an underground mine where they are forced to work for their money in horrible conditions, most of them dying for work-related injuries or breathing problems caused by the smoke. In part 2, Hyodo forces another group of men to walk a narrow plank 15 meters up the air while his colleagues cackle with glee watching them lose their balance one after another. But here comes the Sadistic Choice: those who enter the plank in a second row (there are about four planks and twice as much contestants) are forced to push down the leading players who slow them down, whether they intend to win the race, breaking their bones while doing so. Hyodo's absolute worst act? After Kaiji and a fistful of other contestants actually manage to win the first part of the game, they are then forced to enter a similar plank which is hundreds of meters up the air, rigged with electricity (getting extra balance via touching the plank is out of the question) and this time, those who fall down don't just break a couple bones, but die. Kaiji is the only one who survives this time, the others start panicking and falling down one after another. In the second part of part 2, Kaiji duels against Hyodo's right-hand man, Tonegawa Yukio in a card game and has to choose either his eardrum or eye as his stake. After Tonegawa loses, Hyodo proves how cruel he is to his subordinates, forcing Tonegawa as an act of punishment to kneel down at a burning hot platform, while having his forehead and palms of his hands be in touch with the said platform, and keep that position for a minute. Tonegawa is thus in horrible pain and gets severe burn wounds. Hyodo becomes Kaiji's next opponent in the said card game and manages to win using dirty tricks which costs Kaiji his left hand fingers and a return to the starting point. Hyodo also appears shortly in part 3, where he is seen doing one of his sickest hobbies: drinking the blood of his victims, while watching with glee when Kaiji duels against his young subordinate, Ichiro.

Any redeeming qualities?

No. Hyodo is simply a disgusting old man with no redeeming qualities, whose only enjoyment in life is to see people struggle for their lives and kill each other for their own victory. It's also worth mentioning that Tonegawa, Hyodo's right-hand man first appears as the monster, but is eventually revealed to be just another pawn in Hyodo's cruel games. His demonic appearance and Slasher Smile is indeed, reflecting his true inner self.

Final Verdict

[tup]

edited 22nd Oct '15 6:21:47 AM by Kookosbanaani

DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
BigglesTh9 Since: Jul, 2011
#46134: Oct 22nd 2015 at 5:57:44 AM

My picks for most evil CM would be Johan Liebert, Judge Holden and AM.

If I had to pick just one, though, I'd say Holden. Between genocide, raping children and scalping children, there's not much that guy doesn't do.

[tup] to Hyodo.

edited 22nd Oct '15 5:58:25 AM by BigglesTh9

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
Kookosbanaani Since: May, 2015
#46136: Oct 22nd 2015 at 6:49:09 AM

[up] As far as I've seen the anime, yes. The main antagonist of part 4 is his son.

edited 22nd Oct '15 6:49:55 AM by Kookosbanaani

ST89 Since: Feb, 2015
#46138: Oct 22nd 2015 at 8:09:03 AM

[tup] for Mason. Looks like a cross between Dennis Crim and Katz in his first appareance where he runs a Hell Hotel.

edited 22nd Oct '15 8:09:51 AM by ST89

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#46139: Oct 22nd 2015 at 10:17:39 AM

If y'all are bored, here are the CM pages still in need of quotes.

DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#46140: Oct 22nd 2015 at 11:03:45 AM

We're my rule proposals accepted? If so, I would like to motion to cut Dr. Heiter, unless that film has more plot than it seems to

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#46141: Oct 22nd 2015 at 11:37:29 AM

I created a Creepypasta sandbox at Complete Monster Stuff, for the changes to be made.

LordXavius Doesn't even like this username from many fandoms Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
Doesn't even like this username
#46142: Oct 22nd 2015 at 12:22:27 PM

[up][up][up]

[tup] for the second Highlander quote that was already suggested.

Potential Conan quote: "Infidel defilers. They shall all drown in lakes of blood. Now they will know why they are afraid of the dark. Now they will learn why they fear the night." -Thulsa Doom ('82 film)

Potential Godzilla quote: "Centuries ago, the monster appeared in the skies of Mars. Within a month, the culture of Mars had been wiped out completely. The civilization on my planet had reached a stage of development which you people will not achieve for a long time. Centuries, at least. Today, because of the space monster, it is a dead world. Dead and unpopulated." -Princess Salno (possessed), about King Ghidorah (Ghidorah, the Three-Headed Monster)Note 

Surprisingly hard to find a good Dragon Age quote, but I'm sure they exist...

edited 22nd Oct '15 12:24:05 PM by LordXavius

hamza678 Red Like Santa from Christmas Beacon. Since: Apr, 2013
Red Like Santa
#46143: Oct 22nd 2015 at 12:38:25 PM

I found a quote for The X-Files:

->"You can kill a man but you can't kill what he stands for. Not unless you first break his spirit. That's a beautiful thing to see. " —>—The Cigarette Smoking Man: "The Beginning"

edited 22nd Oct '15 12:46:50 PM by hamza678

Now known as Cyber Controller
Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#46144: Oct 22nd 2015 at 1:21:38 PM

We going to use the Doflamingo picture for One Piece, or...?

Anyhow, two possible quotes- for Redwall and Dungeons & Dragons:

"I do my best to be the worst." -Vilu Daskar, The Legend of Luke (if that doesn't work, I know there are some excellent descriptions of Cluny's atrocities in the first Redwall book)

"Death to all who oppose Cyric. Bow down before his supreme power, and yield to him the blood of those that do not believe in his supremacy. Fear and obey those in authority, but slay those that are weak, of good persuasion, or false prophets. Battle against clergy of other faiths, for they are false prophets and forces who oppose the One True Way. Bring death to those that oppose Cyric's church or make peace, order, and laws, for only Cyric is the true authority and all other authority must be subverted. Break not into open rebellion, for marching armies move the false deities into action. Fell one foe at a time and keep all folk afraid, uneasy, and in constant strife. Any method or means is justified if it brings about the desired end." -Dogma of Cyric, Prince of Lies, Forgotten Realms

edited 22nd Oct '15 1:22:55 PM by Scraggle

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#46145: Oct 22nd 2015 at 1:44:39 PM

  • [tup] Second Kurrgan quote maybe.
  • [tup] Conan quote.
  • [tup] Ghidorah quote.
  • [tup] X Files quote (wouldn't be opposed to a better one, but that'll do).
  • Iffy on the Redwall quote; possible, but a better one has to be out there. It works for Complete Monster though.
  • [tup] D&D quote, if Septimus doesn't rule it as too long.

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#46146: Oct 22nd 2015 at 3:30:55 PM

I may have found a few better Redwall quotes about Cluny.

-"As the hordes of Cluny the Scourge have moved southwards over the past six years, I have gathered intelligence of other incidents: a farmhouse set alight, later that same year... piglets, an entire litter of them eaten alive by rats... sickness and disease spread through livestock herds by Cluny's army." -Brother Methuselah about Cluny the Scourge

-"You, sir, are not fit to command any creature! You are a coward and an evil maniac. Even if my paws were tied I would think twice before soiling them upon the likes of you. Tcha! You are beneath contempt, you... you... rat!" -Basil Stag Hare deriding Cluny the Scourge

-"Who are you to tell me what to do? There is only one law, my word! There is none of you to stop me; not badgers or hares or otters or mice. I will kill you all. Kill, kill, kill!" -Cluny the Scourge

[down] Ostensibly; Redwall is a very violent series for its age demographic and is host to a truckload of heinous villains. Cluny's definitely one of the worst.

edited 22nd Oct '15 4:13:05 PM by Scraggle

DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#46147: Oct 22nd 2015 at 3:36:11 PM

[up] I like the first one best. Jesus, this is from a kids' book?

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#46148: Oct 22nd 2015 at 4:17:04 PM

[up][up] I like the first one best (the other 2 can go to the quotes page). Seems like Redwall is a fine example of What Do You Mean, It's for Kids?

bobg Since: Nov, 2012
#46149: Oct 22nd 2015 at 5:48:15 PM

Here is an attempt at a rewrite for Captain Grumpf:

Solatorobo: Captain Grumpf is one of Bruno's henchmen. Though a minor villain, Grumpf easily proves himself worse than his boss. Grumpf's introduction has him trying to destroy an airship with many of his men onboard just to kill Red after Red taunts Grumpf by calling him a lady. To try and get the Crystal Stones from Red, Grumpf threatens to fire missiles at an orphanage. When Red agrees to hand over the crystals, Grumpf decides to blow up the orphanage anyway, just because Red took too long to agree. After destroying the orphanage, Grumpf intends to fire missiles at Red and his friends to kill them, not caring that Opera (Bruno's right hand woman, and by extension, an ally of Grumpf) is down there at the time and will be killed as well.

edited 22nd Oct '15 5:57:09 PM by bobg

jjj
Animeking1108 Since: Jan, 2010
#46150: Oct 22nd 2015 at 5:58:22 PM

I think Hank from The Gone Series may be a good contender. His role may have been small compared to the true monster of the series (Drake), but out of all the members of the Human Crew, Hank seems to be the most sadistic. While Zil may be bad, his prejudice towards the Freaks was out of fear and he at least had standards (even if it was Pragmatic Villainy). In Hunger, he gets a sadistic thrill during the attempted execution of Hunter that lead to him getting brain damaged. At the beginning of Lies, he apprehends Jill for being a Freak on human territory. He threatens to slice her tongue off if her brother didn't let him take her away, forcing her to fend for herself. Finally, when his comrade Antoine gets wounded by Sam, he seems to assure his friend that he will take him to Lana to heal him, but he instead just leaves him to die.


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