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Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#324201: Sep 18th 2022 at 8:52:27 AM

yeah, gotcha, fam:

  • El Nino is a Satanist mob boss who is the benefactor to Luc Crash's gang. Aiding them in committing all the murders they want over the southwest, El Nino is sought to complete the ritual to manifest Satan in Luc. Not even caring about the ritual, el Nino fully intends Luc to die for it, only to be delighted when it actually works. El Nino is then revealed as a serial sex slaver and pimp who once forcibly prostituted out Luc's girlfriend Lola, a fact he enjoys rubbing in Lola's face at every opportunity.
  • Amilyn is Lothos's right-hand vampire and just as cruel as his master. Having served Lothos with immense bloodshed for centuries, Amilyn proceeds to convert numerous humans into vampires to build Lothos a "new family," also having them kill multiple other humans while bringing victims to Lothos himself. Harboring an intense grudge to the human Pike for ruining his jacket and left arm, Amilyn intends to kill him slow and eventually leads a vampire attack on prom, with orders to kill everyone inside while he lures Buffy to Lothos.
  • John Carter: Sab Than is the ruler of Zodanga, a mobile city of Barsoom that drains energy wherever it goes, killing countless innocent residents of Barsoom. Upon being granted a new weapon by the mysterious Therns, Sab Than personally slaughters entire border cities and vows to spare the land of Helium should they give him princess Dejah Thoris in marriage. When forcing a marriage to Dejah Thoris, it is revealed Sab Than is lying and intends to wipe out Helium and all who live there regardless.

MGD107 Since: Feb, 2015
#324202: Sep 18th 2022 at 9:00:56 AM

[tup] to Kuo-Ho-Tchan, Ganondorf, Lily Weatherwax, Freddy Kruger and Sab Than.

Agentofchaos A God Am I from Somewhere in the Universe Since: Dec, 2021
Libraryseraph uu~ from Canada (Handed A Sword) Relationship Status: Raising My Lily Rank With You
uu~
#324204: Sep 18th 2022 at 9:05:53 AM

[tup] to Freddy and Sab

I think Lillith is too firmly convinced she's genuinely doing good for me to upvote her, but I won't die on this hill

HAPPY HALLOWEEN FOR MARIA
Misry6 Imperfect Disgrace from the Eternal Nothingness Since: Nov, 2021 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Imperfect Disgrace
#324205: Sep 18th 2022 at 9:07:50 AM

Also, I have big plans regarding the Tolkien's Legendarium section, specifically the addition of special characters into certain terms. For example, changing "Nazgul" into "Nazgûl" and "Iluvatar" to "Ilúvatar".

In fact, the very quote in that section has "Ilúvatar" spelled as "Iluvatar".

Edited by Misry6 on Sep 18th 2022 at 9:08:58 AM

Just an empty void…
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#324206: Sep 18th 2022 at 9:08:23 AM

Is someone doing Matai, or can Sab go this week (and I assume it goes to Live-Action Films and not the Disney page?)?

G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
The 47th President
#324207: Sep 18th 2022 at 9:10:01 AM

I think Ravok is going to do Matai since Lighty said he and Ravok are watching John Carter together (though I could be wrong)

Anywho [tup] to Freddy and Sab

My sandbox of EPs and other stuff
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#324208: Sep 18th 2022 at 9:13:27 AM

Oh, and Misry, that's fine, but a few things.

  • Please make the changes here.
  • Please let me know when you're done so I can swap the Sandbox.
  • Don't forget the change the YMMV pages if applicable.

SumDumNerd LOCKDOWN PROCEDURES ENGAGED from [REDACTED] Since: May, 2017 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
LOCKDOWN PROCEDURES ENGAGED
#324209: Sep 18th 2022 at 9:20:38 AM

[tup] Ganon, Kuo, Lily, and Sab

[tdown] Candyman, Mary-Sue, Jacques

Edited by SumDumNerd on Sep 18th 2022 at 10:20:52 AM

Read Slender Man vs Siren Head 2: The Foundation here
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#324210: Sep 18th 2022 at 9:26:44 AM

  • Wicked Prayer: El Niño is a Satanist mob boss who is the benefactor to Luc Crash's gang. Aiding them in committing all the murders they want over the southwest, El Niño is sought to complete the ritual to manifest Satan in Luc. Not even caring about the ritual, El Niño fully intends Luc to die for it, only to be delighted when it actually works. El Niño is then revealed as a serial sex slaver and pimp who once forcibly prostituted out Luc's girlfriend Lola, a fact he enjoys rubbing in Lola's face at every opportunity.
  • Amilyn is Lothos's right-hand vampire and just as cruel as his master. Having served Lothos with immense bloodshed for centuries, Amilyn proceeds to convert numerous humans into vampires to build Lothos a "new family", also having them kill multiple other humans while bringing victims to Lothos himself. Harboring an intense grudge to the human Pike for ruining his jacket and left arm, Amilyn intends to kill him slow and eventually leads a vampire attack on prom, with orders to kill everyone inside while he lures Buffy to Lothos.

Edited by ACW on Sep 18th 2022 at 12:26:52 PM

nwotyzal Since: Sep, 2019
Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#324212: Sep 18th 2022 at 9:33:13 AM

Alright so I am going to be doing a relitigation, I am pretty sure I have a pretty solid new argument to make.

What is the Work?

Mega Man 8-Bit Deathmatch is a Mega Man Game Mod primarily based on the Mega Man (Classic) series. The plot of the game is pretty long so I will jump straight over to the final chapter where a brand new threat emerges and well that is who we will be talking about.

Who is Terra and What Has He Done?

Terra much like his canon counterpart in Mega Man V is the leader of the Stardroids. However, unlike his canon counterpart, Terra is a sadistic monster with no loyalty to Doctor Wily who seeks to enslave all life in the universe.

Terra is first introduced after Dr. Wily is defeated again. Terra would first murder Duo off permanently and then kidnap Dr. Wily to enslave him to use him for his ultimate plan. Terra states that he plans on enslaving all of humanity. Terra would then force Dr. Wily to build the Wily Star for him which he would plan to use for his ultimate evil plan.

Terra would send his Stardroids off to enslave various robot masters with promises of a cure to the Roboenza virus. Terra uses them to collect energy for his ultimate plan. Terra's ultimate plan is to revive his master Sunstar and use him to wipe out all inferior beings in the entire galaxy.

Terra would eventually come to deal with the heroes himself blowing a hole in Dr. Cossack's ship and then kidnapping the Player Character Maestro. Terra would attempt to kill Maestro and then planned to finish off everyone on the ship but he loses so he tries to use the Wily Star to blow up the asteroid that Maestro is on. Maestro is nearly killed and is only saved at the last second.

Terra would be able to stall the heroes long enough though to continue his plan of reviving Sunstar and is actually able to do so. Maestro manages to defeat Sunstar though and Sunstar nearly redeems before he is corrupted by the Evil Robot energy. Terra's last appearance is him laughing manically thinking that his omnicidal plans are about to come to fruition and relishing in watching the despair of Maestro thinking that he won't be able to stop it, before Terra is crushed by falling debris and killed for good.

The merged version of Sunstar and Evil Robot Eclipse ends up nearly destroying the entire universe including Earth but Meastro is able to stop it.

Does He have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Terra unlike his canon counterpart completely lacks any redeeming traits at all and is simply a sadistic asshole who wants to wipe out the entire universe and cleanse it of all inferior life forms. Terra shows no care for his fellow members of the Stardroids and he only sees Sunstar as a tool for his omnicidal aims.

Does He meet the Heinousness Standard?

Alright, so this is probably the one that you guys were waiting for. So Terra was previously proposed and rejected for his plan not being explicit enough and him being too generic as a result. Based on the information that was given, I can see why people came to this conclusion. But having watched the game myself I can tell you that this could not possibly be further from the truth.

Terra's line that was brought up in the proposal "bring judgement to [the] wretched universe," is not even the whole story when it comes to that scene. Right after Terra uses the Wily Star on Maestro which shows that the machine has the capability of destroying entire planets with Maestro only barely being saved in time. Right after Cossack confirmers that the weapon can destroy entire planets and “reign death and destruction” among it.

The biggest ones though come later. Right after Dr. Wily is rescued he gives a full detailed description of what Terra plans he wants to awaken Sunstar and merge him with the Evil Robot so that he can cleanse the galaxy of all inferior life, and says word for word “If [Sunstar] wakes up, Earth and every other planet is doomed.” Terra's final moments are him laughing at Maestro knowing that every single world will be destroyed and revelling in the fact that he won't be able to stop it (or so he thinks).

The game fully treats Eclipse (the merged version of Sunstar and the Evil Robot energy) as a world-ending threat that needs to be stopped at all costs. The situation is so dire that Dr. Wily ends up teaming up with the heroes to stop Terra and later Eclipse from destroying the entire world.

So yeah in all the narrative makes it perfectly explicit that Terra is aiming for the absolute destruction of the entire universe and everyone in it that he deems an inferior life form (which is basically anyone that isn't him and maybe his followers). There is no Never Say "Die" involved as it is outright said that the Wily Star will reign death and that he plans on purging the galaxy of lifeforms and the threat of complete destruction is made explicit. His permanent murder of Duo is simply the cherry on top.

If you guys want proof you can check out this video the 11:30 timestamp for Wily's speech about what Terra plans to do and the 27:50 mark for Terra's defeat where he laughs at the destruction of the universe. You can also check out this video at the 29:00 mark for Terra showing of the destructive powers of the Wily Star and then Cossack saying how it can reign death and destruction on planets.

When it comes to the in-story standard Terra passes it easily, while Wily does get up to some pretty terrible things he never even got close to the scale of attempted omnicide that Terra went to. The Evil Robot did have omnicidal aims but he is a Generic Doomsday Villain with beyond that and Terra is both not as powerful and has the extra murder of Duo, so I would say that Terra is the worst in the story.

Final Verdict?

I am giving a solid yes with this new info.

Edited by Ordeaux26 on Sep 18th 2022 at 9:33:30 AM

Siegfried1337 Calabash. from The Eastern Luminant Since: Sep, 2018 Relationship Status: Will you go out with me to the End?
Calabash.
#324213: Sep 18th 2022 at 9:44:22 AM

[up] Since this Terra is basically his Megamix version, [tup]

Eh, good enough.
Agentofchaos A God Am I from Somewhere in the Universe Since: Dec, 2021
SumDumNerd LOCKDOWN PROCEDURES ENGAGED from [REDACTED] Since: May, 2017 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
LOCKDOWN PROCEDURES ENGAGED
#324216: Sep 18th 2022 at 10:01:43 AM

[tup] Terra


Both the "Other Media" and Nightmare on Elm Street subpages, I'm guessing?

Edited by SumDumNerd on Sep 18th 2022 at 12:27:51 PM

Read Slender Man vs Siren Head 2: The Foundation here
Misry6 Imperfect Disgrace from the Eternal Nothingness Since: Nov, 2021 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Imperfect Disgrace
#324217: Sep 18th 2022 at 10:15:23 AM

@ACW: Thank you for that sandbox page; I needed that.

Just an empty void…
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#324218: Sep 18th 2022 at 10:32:56 AM

No problem. Don't forget the YMMV pages.

Ordeaux, I'll read that EP.

CloisterTheStupid from Oop North Since: Jan, 2019 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Ansongc2000 Pensive Wright from Serenity Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: Hit me with your best shot
Pensive Wright
#324221: Sep 18th 2022 at 10:43:59 AM

Found this on Purple Man:

Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#324222: Sep 18th 2022 at 10:47:43 AM

Self-Demonstrating pages are basically Just for Fun so I wouldn't put to much stock in them.

STARCRUSHER99 The Moron from one of my unhealthy obsessions (Captain) Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The Moron
#324223: Sep 18th 2022 at 10:47:49 AM

Yes to Terra

[up][up] Maybe you should check out the same entry on his actual page instead of his SD one?

  • His ex-wife and their daughter Kara, known as Persuasion, though both hate him for good reason. While Killgrave would like to reconcile with them, he's made no real effort to and it's been made clear (via Nate Grey reading his mind) that he prioritizes taking over the world and continuing to do things For the Evulz over them. And while he was initially fond of the Purple Children, that got thrown out the window when they turned on him, leading him to abandon his Evil Is One Big, Happy Family plans for them in favor of just weaponizing or outright killing them.

Edited by STARCRUSHER99 on Sep 18th 2022 at 1:48:01 PM

papyru30 from Colorado for summer break Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
#324224: Sep 18th 2022 at 10:48:38 AM

With Comics!Dogson, we should include his first name in the write up.

Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#324225: Sep 18th 2022 at 10:53:07 AM

[up] As has already been mentioned apparently his first name is never used in the comics.


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