During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
- Multiple Games: Uminosuke Hachisuka is the insidious mayor of the 24th Ward. Partnering with the programmer Nezu by allowing him to control the city to his liking just as long as he gets elected mayor, Uminosuke was also responsible for the titular Silver Case, having murdered his fellow politicians to acqiure Kamui Uehara’s silver eye for himself, which grants him eternal youth. Heavily complicit in Nezu’s Kamui and Ayame Maspro projects, where thousands of kids were used for experiments regarding severe brainwashing and the replication of the silver eye, Uminosuke allows his kids Tokio and Chizuku to be used as test subjects, later killing his son Kaoru and stealing his identity to extend his reign as mayor. Uminosuke was also involved in the genocide of Lospass Island’s Sundance tribe, solely so that he can acquire their silver-eyed hyenas.
- killer7 comic:
- Kun Lan is the leader of Heaven’s Smile, a terrorist organization who hopes to bring about a new age of destruction. An old friend and enemy of Harman Smith, Kun implants one of his own Heaven Smiles into an IEC anti-missile summit, killing plenty of people. The true leader of the Rising Wind Party, Kun has its elderly leaders killed off, with plans to use their resources to destroy America.
- Andrei Ulmeyda is the sinister leader of the First Life cult, as well as CEO of the First Life Corporation. Once a simple criminal, Ulmeyda turned to terrorism in an attempt to acquire the Yakumo, with even the Rising Wind Party fearing him. Selling out his city to Heaven’s Smile and allowing its monsters to cause havoc, Ulmeyda later blows up an entire Spike Girls concert to get the Smith Syndicate’s attention.
Hachisuka is mainly from the first Silver Case game (the sequel's called 25th Ward). And yes, that's all for Suda candidates at the moment. Well, until a certain game of his
gets fully translated that is, but that'll take a few more months.
Edited by therealjackieboy on Jul 28th 2022 at 9:26:28 AM
It's Spooky Month!Hey discussion date for Kung Fu Panda: The Dragon Knight is now?
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."Is comic!Heaven's Smile Far East Asian Terrorists or South Asian Terrorists?
OK so it's time to talk about Resident Evil (2022) and all the stupid stuff that happened in it. No one counts in it, Evelyn Marcus, the head of Umbrella, is both not bad enough and loved her son and was upset that she had to kill him. Baxter, an Umbrella agent working in the post Apocalypse, is bad enough but he honestly loves his pet dogs. The closest is Billie Wesker who became the leader of Umbrella after the apocalypse but there's way too much ambiguity with her redeeming qualities for me to propose her right now (it doesn't help that the series doesn't explain how she became a villain). I may have some stuff to talk about on the MB thread so keep an eye out for that.
And apparently there was a point when a lady's brainwashed to sing Dua Lipa's "Don't Start Now" for no reason other than the writers believe it's Rule of Funny. They're clearly the messed up ones here. Haha.
Edited by futuremoviewriter on Jul 28th 2022 at 12:42:45 PM
I've got a question regarding shows like Investigation Discovery that have dramatized re-enactments of a person's crime spree. Can someone's portrayal there count for this trope without breaking the "no real life examples" rule? There's at least one episode that could qualify if that's the case.
Edited by Javertshark13 on Jul 28th 2022 at 3:59:11 PM
Like to give you guys a clue how these are formatted. The epsidoes are split between the actual investigators and victims explaining details and re-enactments which is a bit too much.
If it was only the latter it wouldn't be an issue but the fact they alternate.....
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Kakuzawa, Kun, Ulmeyda, Percival, Little Boy, Eald'narche, Uminosuke, Barzini, Raimy, Stevie, Kevin, Scientist, Meat, Infinite, Niddhog, Garut and Agony
Joker
Cut Lovecraft
I am asking once again for more votes on my Hitomi quote
.
Orphan Black is coming back as a sequel series
Has the Big Bad Duumvirate of Sally Face been discussed already?
This is minor but I noticed that Trypticon's entry in Cyberverse has Faux Affably Evil used in 2 different potholes. Should one of them be removed and/or replaced? I suggest replacing the first one with Affably Evil.
Yeah but he was later revealed to be Faux Affably Evil.
Edited by CookieMonster69 on Jul 28th 2022 at 4:40:41 AM
Well since the thread's pretty slow right now, it's a good time to bring attention to this:
- Gran Torino: Spider
(doesn't stand out from the rest of his gang)
I really don't think this argument holds up anymore. Walt outright calls out Spider personally for either taking part in the gang's rape of Sue or putting them up to it, specifically because she's "[his] own flesh and blood for Christ's sake". Spider stands out with all the horrible stuff the gang does because while it's a shared effort, his being Thao and Sue's cousin is what clearly separates him and makes him prominent.
There is definitely an increased disgust factor fully on display that makes you remember him, remember the fact that he's related to them and the fact that he's being so cruel too. It’s because of this that those aspects give him such infamy as a character in this film. As I only mentioned before, Spider directing the gang to Thao to begin with is very important and his ultimately being so utterly detestable to his own cousins—his own family—just because he can be?
The original entry for the record:
- Complete Monster: Spider is a Hmong gangster who, along with his gang, terrorizes his own neighborhood. He starts off by pressuring his cousin Thao to steal his neighbor Walt Kowalski's vintage Gran Torino. When he fails at this, Spider and his gang beat up Thao and continually harass his family. Walt initially scares him off, but he continues to harass Thao afterwards and lets his subordinate put out a cigarette in his face. In retaliation for Walt beating up one of his gang members, Spider performs a drive-by shooting on Thao's family and kidnaps his cousin Sue to subject her to a violent gang rape, leaving her bloodied and traumatized. When Walt finally confronts them in the climax, he and his gang riddle him with bullets when they think he might have a gun.
How do we want to play this? New EP or just vote now?
Edited by futuremoviewriter on Jul 28th 2022 at 9:32:14 AM
I'm saying no... I don't think he's heinous enough, as Stell and Ravok detailed quite well. What changed future? We don't just reinstate candidates because we accounted for him being related to his victims when he was downvoted and I don't like that the "new" argument to put him back is just rehashing the old thinking that had him up until he was re-evaluated, we want to move forwards, not backwards and this suggestion concerns me a bit unless something was actually missed.
A film can have a protagonist call someone a psychopath all they want, we evaluate based on our criteria, not the author's opinion put in the words of their hero.
If the confusion is caused by the note comparing him to his gang then just change it to say he fails baseline.
Edited by 43110 on Jul 28th 2022 at 12:37:40 PM
Little things like that have gotten candidates approved recently though, so that's why I thought standards since then may have changed and it would allow for it now. It's not that I was trying to rehash an old argument, it's that I was bringing something up that we treat with more prominence nowadays than we did back then. I legit thought this was something where we can actually dive into the idea that an argument that was considered too weak before would hold up better presently under closer observation and scrutiny.
If I was mistaken and it really isn't any stronger now than it was then, I apologize. Again, not my intention to try to force a change of consensus, but rather present something with what I thought was a new filter—even though it doesn't actually seem to be.
Edited by futuremoviewriter on Jul 28th 2022 at 9:42:54 AM

Snowy: Personally I would put them in Pre crisis. Like not to give spoilers an upcoming Flash keeper who is the same in both, it makes more sense to list him in Pre Crisis.
Edited by Bullman on Jul 28th 2022 at 8:49:18 AM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread