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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#309176: Apr 11th 2022 at 8:59:36 PM

Tbh Sky I really like the Plutonian picture and I'd much rather go to the effort of finding another pic of him for his character section.

SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#309177: Apr 11th 2022 at 9:02:21 PM

Once the thread is open, 43, you can bring suggestions for a new Plutonian character image.

[down] Ordeaux, I don't think 43 needs to be talked down to.

[down][down] I was about to ask the exact same thing about blanking.

Edited by SkyCat32 on Apr 11th 2022 at 12:13:12 PM

Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#309178: Apr 11th 2022 at 9:03:10 PM

[nja]

Edited by Ordeaux26 on Apr 11th 2022 at 9:08:44 AM

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#309179: Apr 11th 2022 at 9:05:58 PM

Thanks for the usual polite response Ordeaux...

Is something not registering about how to talk to people man?

Edit: What have we asked you about post blanking? Strike function, admit your mistake, stop trying to bury and hide things like you weren't rude.

Edited by 43110 on Apr 11th 2022 at 12:09:48 PM

magnumtropus Since: Aug, 2020
#309180: Apr 11th 2022 at 9:10:47 PM

Speaking of Irredeemable, is anyone aware of the planned Netflix adaptation of the comic? I'd be interested in taking a look at it for this thread (and MB)

Same with Nimona, which was just revived

Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#309181: Apr 11th 2022 at 9:12:23 PM

[up][up] Oh ops I had ninjaed my post and noticing Sky already responded to you I did not intend to blank it to cover anything up. Sorry about the comment didn't intent be rude I apologize.

Edited by Ordeaux26 on Apr 11th 2022 at 9:13:49 AM

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#309182: Apr 11th 2022 at 9:13:37 PM

That's an extremely convenient circumstance but if you're not gonna own up not much I can do.

[up][up] I wasn't but I'm interested in the Irredeemable adaptation.

Edited by 43110 on Apr 11th 2022 at 12:14:10 PM

magnumtropus Since: Aug, 2020
#309183: Apr 11th 2022 at 9:20:43 PM

Would you like to team up for it?

STARCRUSHER99 The Moron from one of my unhealthy obsessions (Captain) Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The Moron
#309184: Apr 11th 2022 at 9:35:54 PM

Though speaking of Irredeemable (it's hilarious hearing about this adaptation right as I'm getting into the comic [lol]) how's about a quote from our old friend the Plutonian? It's long, but if there's a section from it that works on its own I'm 100% down for it because god damn it sums him up perfectly..

"Do I have everyone's attention? If you're using a television, a computer, a radio or a phone anywhere on the planet, I suppose I do. So if the translator module is working correctly, let's answer some viewer mail. Lei Hujun of Harbin, China wondered aloud last week how I "could possibly be the same Plutonian everyone once loved." Trick question, Lei. How could I really have been with you that eager to turn on me? Also, Lei, you shouldn't have called me a "monster." I've never done anything to you. Or to your children, Yan and Zhang. Ages five and... what, about eight? Eight. Ricky Mitchell of Tupelo, Mississippi asked the college girl he's been sleeping with if she knows how many bodies I've left in my wake. Well, let's see. Figure three and a half million in Sky City... four-point-six in Singapore... sporadic global damage elsewhere... wow, population is really down... And finally, Caleb Albright of Vancouver, BC — and, by the way Caleb, yes, it is cancer — wrote in his journal "who does he think he is?" Funny you should ask. You know what they used to say about the gods of myth. That they would disguise themselves and walk among you as ordinary men. I confess. I do that. It's enlightening. But... who am I? That guy down at the end of the bar? The new recruit? The foreigner who just moved in upstairs? I know what you're thinking. That at least in this moment, I can't be standing next to you. There is that. But I should add one thing. This has been a pre-recorded message. Sleep tight."

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#309185: Apr 11th 2022 at 9:37:11 PM

[up][up]Would love to!

[up] Nice, there are lots of mini quotes I can see getting from that!

Edited by 43110 on Apr 11th 2022 at 12:38:31 PM

STARCRUSHER99 The Moron from one of my unhealthy obsessions (Captain) Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The Moron
#309186: Apr 11th 2022 at 9:46:35 PM

Good point - if we wanna not do the whole chunk and instead break it apart, these seem like the best way to do it:

1.

"Lei Hujun of Harbin, China wondered aloud last week how I "could possibly be the same Plutonian everyone once loved." Trick question, Lei. How could I really have been with you that eager to turn on me? Also, Lei, you shouldn't have called me a "monster." I've never done anything to you. Or to your children, Yan and Zhang. Ages five and... what, about eight? Eight."

2.

"Ricky Mitchell of Tupelo, Mississippi asked the college girl he's been sleeping with if she knows how many bodies I've left in my wake. Well, let's see. Figure three and a half million in Sky City... four-point-six in Singapore... sporadic global damage elsewhere... wow, population is really down. On the upside, however, this is a boom time for mapmakers."

3.

"And finally, Caleb Albright of Vancouver, BC — and, by the way Caleb, yes, it is cancer — wrote in his journal "who does he think he is?" Funny you should ask. You know what they used to say about the gods of myth. That they would disguise themselves and walk among you as ordinary men. I confess. I do that. It's enlightening. But... who am I? That guy down at the end of the bar? The new recruit? The foreigner who just moved in upstairs? I know what you're thinking. That at least in this moment, I can't be standing next to you. There is that. But I should add one thing. This has been a pre-recorded message. Sleep tight."

If we wanna go this route instead, I can go either way on the first and third ones but I definitely like the second one.

Edited by STARCRUSHER99 on Apr 11th 2022 at 12:46:55 PM

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#309188: Apr 11th 2022 at 9:48:06 PM

Quotes work.

Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
DrUnknown Since: May, 2020
#309190: Apr 11th 2022 at 11:16:23 PM

[tup] to the Johan Liebert video, Megatron, Dorian Chase/the Crossdress Killer, and the Plutonian quotes.

@G-Editor: Good luck on your trip.

WetFlannels Classy, Refined, Unstable from Nearby, on a cosmological scale. Since: Oct, 2021 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Classy, Refined, Unstable
#309191: Apr 12th 2022 at 1:43:19 AM

[tup] Megatron, Crossdress killer

Prefer the 2nd Plutonium segment out of the 3

Edited by WetFlannels on Apr 12th 2022 at 10:05:15 AM

What's wrong D-16? Rise up!
WatTambor Since: Oct, 2020
#309192: Apr 12th 2022 at 2:18:43 AM

Looking at the video, I am slightly leaning towards cut for Theodore Maddox. He does mention that he wants to create a new world where people like his mother can thrive free of the patters of the broken world and if he also looks sad while looking at a picture of his mother, that's a bit too much for me.

That and the guy seems genuinely insane which also doesn't fill me with a lot of confidence about him qualifying.

EDIT: And [tup] to Star's quotes.

Edited by WatTambor on Apr 12th 2022 at 2:34:22 PM

MacronNotes (she/her) (Captain) Relationship Status: Less than three
(she/her)
#309193: Apr 12th 2022 at 4:11:08 AM

Re:crowner I think I'll wait until at least tomorrow (if it's still stable by then) to call the crowner.

Macron's notes
mariogalaxy Since: Feb, 2022
#309194: Apr 12th 2022 at 4:19:38 AM

[tup] script megatron and late [tup] Danny maxwell, if I hadn’t vote already.

Abstain on Maddox

Edited by mariogalaxy on Apr 12th 2022 at 4:20:03 AM

WetFlannels Classy, Refined, Unstable from Nearby, on a cosmological scale. Since: Oct, 2021 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Classy, Refined, Unstable
#309195: Apr 12th 2022 at 5:24:55 AM

Would a confirmed rapist who brags that he raped others yet its just a statement just be offscreen villainy? I ask, because in Catch 22 there's a character called Aarfy who raped and murdered someone but also claimed he raped others prior.

What's wrong D-16? Rise up!
SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#309196: Apr 12th 2022 at 5:33:21 AM

What's the specific claimed target count? What else backs up the pattern of rape?

For example, the Pulp Fiction guys have a rape dungeon and a current captive in addition to claiming to have kept another captive and intending to sexually abuse two more people. They stand out next to a generic mob boss who has an attempted 7 victim body count and intended offscreen torture.

Keep in mind, Aarfy is also competing with a guy who's profiteering from an (on page) war that will cause upwards of hundreds of deaths, so there's that.

I mean, I'll hear Aarfy out. I just think it's gonna be a steep sell.

Then again, Johnny 23 from Con Air was recently approved.

[down] Fair enough. That's what I figured.

[down][down][down] Hope things go better for you, Mir.

Edited by SkyCat32 on Apr 12th 2022 at 8:54:03 AM

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#309197: Apr 12th 2022 at 5:50:21 AM

Please don't try for Aarfy, he's been discussed to death here.

Libraryseraph uu~ from Canada (Handed A Sword) Relationship Status: Raising My Lily Rank With You
uu~
#309198: Apr 12th 2022 at 5:51:12 AM

Cut Teddy, I like the second Plutonian quote best

I think that, when Catch-22 gets serious, it's too goddamn bleak for Aarfy to stand out, is the problem

HAPPY HALLOWEEN FOR MARIA
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#309199: Apr 12th 2022 at 5:52:40 AM

The issue with Aarfy isn't offstage villany so much as baseline. He only has one rape and murder.

Also Well not great news. The roads in my city got flooded due to rain so me and my family are hunkering in today.

None of us can go to work since it's all closed. So I probably won't be here much today.

Edit : [up]And that. Than the entire work becomes really cynical.

Edited by miraculous on Apr 12th 2022 at 5:53:37 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#309200: Apr 12th 2022 at 5:57:31 AM

I think this may be the second time in two or so years Aarfy has come up, actually.

Edited by SkyCat32 on Apr 12th 2022 at 8:57:54 AM


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