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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Shin Megami Tensei IV
#306076: Mar 18th 2022 at 7:38:55 PM

Well, I got permission of the other troper to do a re-EP to solve some doubts.

Setting

Juujika no Rukunin is a series following Shun Uruma's revenge on the bullies who killed his parents and left his brother in coma, armed and trained for his grandpa, a former a torturer of the IJA.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

Daichi Kuga is one of Uruma's bullies.

In the first chapter alone, Kuga participates into causing the accident that killed Shun Uruma's parents and left his brother in a coma.

Now grew up as a tall strong man and skilled Judoka, he brutalizes his rivals by breaking the fingers of the losers in sadistic plays and forces his the team to bring girls that he can rape, doing this for a time and terrifying the students into submission, going as far as to force the other judokas to give their girlfriends to him.

Kuga also forces one of his teammates to burn down Uruma's house, leaving his elderly grandfather injured. Sure, the old man is Uruma's accomplice on his crusade and a war criminal, but Kuga doesn't know or care, to his eyes, he burned the house of a old man just to hurt Uruma.

Kuga is also a abusive boyfriend to Anna, Kyou's cousin who is trying to redeem him. Initially, they look like friendly rivals, but as soon they're alone, Kuga vents his frustations in the form of beatings and rape in her for both her resemblace to Big Bad Kyou and her physical resistance.

Kyou seemingly kidnaps Anna and convinces Kuga to fight him in a judo duel, which Kuga accepts believing he would win. Defeated, Kuga is tortured by Uruma, but he is saved by Anna. A confused Kuga then proceeds to rape and kill her because he mistook her with Kyou

Its also revealed that Kuga actually did try to rape Kyou as well, but Kyou defended himself by terrifying Kuga with his manipulation skills proper of a cult leader.

Uruma is outraged at Kuga being a Ungrateful Bastard who killed someone who saved him, leading to a fight where Kuga tries to rape Uruma before Uruma is able to beat Kuga to death.

Heinous standard?

Teenage Gregor Clegane is genuinely a good summary. Kuga is a brute who uses his strenght to constantly brutalize everyone near him and induge on rape and beatings, with any supossed loved one being brutalized as well. He literally starts the series by helping to cause a deadly accident that kills two adults and leaves a child in coma.

His only actual rival on heinousness is Kyou, who is a cult leader and The Corrupter for other villains, and the grandpa of Shun Uruma, who was a actual war criminal (who simply doesn't count, he obviously loves his grandson and wants to avenge his child).

Kyou is the Big Bad who is apparently in his final plan, so nothing EP-ed yet.

Uruma is obviously a screwed up avenger antihero who loves torturing, but he targets exclusively asshole victims and his only innocent victim is a cop who discovered his secret.

All other villains have rape and injuries on their rapsheet, but Kuga takes it to a new level by having many victims to his name by creating a pseudo dictatorship in the Judo club where he humiliates the other Judokas to give them their friends and girlfriends.

Mitigating traits?

None. His loyalty and obsession with Kyou is peak Stalker with a Crush framed as lust for power. Kyou is a fairly attractive bishonen that hits Dude Looks Like a Lady easily, but ultimately, what Kuga wants is to enjoy the pleasure of breaking him using rape as the tool.

He is obviously a terrible boyfriend to Anna, eventually killing her is a mistake and never showing any regret, unlike other villain who actually felt awful when his victim commited suicide.

Yeah, not redeeming.

Verdict?

Yeah.

Edited by KazuyaProta on Mar 18th 2022 at 9:46:26 AM

Watch me destroying my country
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#306077: Mar 18th 2022 at 7:58:03 PM

Yup. Thank you for clarifying on that one.

therealjackieboy from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
#306078: Mar 18th 2022 at 8:04:54 PM

[tup] Kuga and Idore

[tdown] Commander

It's Spooky Month!
KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Shin Megami Tensei IV
#306079: Mar 18th 2022 at 8:24:38 PM

  • Juujika no Rukunin: Daichi Kuga is one of the terrible bullies who caused the accident that killed the parents of protagonist Shun Uruma. Now as a tall and strong teenager, Kuga torments the Judo club by playing sadistic games where he breaks the fingers of the losers and forces them to lure many woman so he can rape them, including their own girlfriends. When Kyou orders Kuga to get rid of Uruma, Kuga burns Uruma's house and leaves his elderly grandfather hospitalized. When Uruma investigates him, Kuga appears to seemingly be in love with Anna, Kyou's cousin, before being revealed to be a abusive boyfriend who vents his frustrations on her, constantly beating and raping her. When Uruma finally captures and tortures him, Kuga is saved for Anna, whom Kuga kills in a mistaken rage that he doesn't regret after confusing her with Kyou. Revealing that he actually desires to rape Kyou to break him, Kuga fights Uruma with the intention to rape and kill him as "training".

Edited by KazuyaProta on Mar 18th 2022 at 10:24:55 AM

Watch me destroying my country
Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#306082: Mar 18th 2022 at 8:51:31 PM

Sure to Kuga. I'm gonna reiterate my question about Kamen Rider OOO's tenth anniversary movie one more time, but otherwise, barring dissension, I'll have that up tomorrow.

One I want to get up tonight because...this is my first candidate from any kind of mythology or religion, specifically from Malay mythology...

What has the Orang Minyak done?

The Orang Minyak—"Oily Man"—is a mythological creature who, depending on the version of the legend, is either a human who brokered his evil powers with a bomoh (witch doctor), or a genuine demon himself. Covered head-to-toe in vile, inky grease, the Oily Man preys upon Malaysian villages with a singular goal in his mind; virgin rape. The Oily Man targets young girls and rapes them, using his greasy body to slither out of the grasp of vengeful, pursuing men. The Oily Man, no matter his origin, is described as pure evil, with countless victims to his black name.

Any mitigating factors?

I tread around myth and religion carefully for a reason (it's hard to quantify a Complete Monster when in many cases you can't even be sure of the precise origin of the legend) but the Oily Man is a frighteningly simple case. No iteration of the myth ever gives him redeeming qualities and his universal description as a vile Serial Rapist with a predilection for the young and the innocent (even, in some cases, children) I think make him an easy qualifier by our standards.

Conclusion?

Keeper.

Tangential to the effortpost...this myth transcends reality in that there's been many real life copy-cats of the Oily Man. Actual, human rapists who douse themselves in grease and try and prey on women. It's the kind of fact that ruins your day.

From me to you!

MrInk99 Fernando David Páez Contreras from Mérida, Venezuela Since: Jul, 2021
Fernando David Páez Contreras
#306083: Mar 18th 2022 at 8:51:56 PM

Thoughts on this video for the Lord Commander? (Between 0:17 and 1:30)

KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#306085: Mar 18th 2022 at 9:04:28 PM

Yes to the Orang Minyak, good for discussion too Scraggs!

MrInk99 Fernando David Páez Contreras from Mérida, Venezuela Since: Jul, 2021
Fernando David Páez Contreras
#306086: Mar 18th 2022 at 9:06:02 PM

A mythological CM? I’m all for it!

[tup] Orang Minyak

therealjackieboy from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
Ravok Son of Liberty from Big Shell Since: Jun, 2015 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Son of Liberty
#306088: Mar 18th 2022 at 9:34:18 PM

Yes to the Oily Snakey Slimey Man and Kuga with the added detail, and I'm def game for you to discuss that one at your leisure, Scrags!

Edited by Ravok on Mar 18th 2022 at 9:34:40 AM

No! That is NOT Solid Snake! Stop impersonating him!
ReddishGuy1 Since: Jul, 2014
#306089: Mar 18th 2022 at 9:35:29 PM

Since I already proposed Mezalord, I figure I may as well get Gulver out of the way too.

What is the work?

Choujin Bibyun is the sequel series to Akumaizer 3. It follows three college students who get imbued with the souls of the Akumaizer 3. After having their powers awakened by local paranormal expert Dr. Daima, the three become the Choujins to defend humanity against evil Youkai who have suddenly started popping up.

Who is the villain?

Great Demon King Gulver, the wirepuller behind the Akuma Clan in Akumaizer 3 and the ruler of the Youkai in Choujin Bibyun.

It turns out midway through the series that "Great Demon King Gulver" is actually an alias used by both Gulver and his right-hand man, the Great Demon King, who acts as figurehead of the Youkai while his boss leads in secret.

What does he do?

Gulver first appears in the final two episodes of Akumaizer 3, where he's revealed to be the superior of Mezalord and the one secretly behind the Akuma Clan's surface invasion. He tasks his followers Mezalord and Geberu with leading an all-out attack on the surface, but while they are away the Demon Peace Party rises to power in the Akuma Clan and makes peace with humanity after ousting the warmongering regime, leaving Gulver's henchmen as the only remaining members of the pro-war side. After Mezalord falls, Gulver equips Geberu with the virtually indestructible "Immortal Shield" and sends him on a rampage with it with the goal of taking out the Akumaizer 3, something that leads to the Demon Peace Party dying in a failed attempt to stop him. The Akumaizer 3 are able to penetrate the Immortal Shield and kill Geberu, but because of a curse Gulver placed on the Immortal Shield the Akumaizer 3 lose their bodies in the process and have each of their souls sealed in three capsules.

With his three most troublesome foes out of the way, Gulver makes another attempt to conquer the surface by sending Youkai to terrorize humanity. When the Choujins are awakened and starting battling the Youkai, Gulver sends Goldfish Poop Gang Shindo and Birin to keep tabs on them, but the Choujins quickly persuade them to turn good.

After sitting back and letting the Youkai mostly do their own thing, Gulver eventually steps in to take direct command of their operations. He sends the Great Demon King to kidnap children and bring them to the Youkai Castle, where their souls can be extracted as a sacrifice to him. He also forces Shindo & Birin to fire arrows at the Choujins from afar. When the Choujins learn that Gulver is making the two attack them, Gulver has the Great Demon King execute Shindo, as a particularly brutal way to Shoo Out the Clowns.

After the Choujins defeat the Great Demon King for a final time, Gulver opts to confront them himself and reveals his true form as a grotesque Blob Monster. He steals the Choujins powers and locks them away in the Youkai Castle, leading the Choujins's living airship Benishark to ram the castle in a heroic sacrifice and return the powers to the Choujins. With their powers restored, the Choujins slay Gulver and finally, after 36 episodes, avenge the Akumaizer 3.

Heinous Standard

In Akumaizer 3 Gulver was out-heinoused by his own minion Mezalord, but in Choujin Bibyun he stands out a lot more. There are spooky moments each episode, but for the most part nobody dies and the Youkai of the Week's actions are undone at the end of the episode, making the series overall Lighter and Softer than its predecessor (though Akumaizer 3 at its wackiest is much lighter than Choujin Bibyun). Gulver is much more sinister than any of his underlings and most of the grislier moments in the series happen because of him or the Great Demon King acting on his orders.

Mitigating Factors

Gulver does resurrect the Great Demon King after his first defeat against the Choujins, but that was out of little other than pragmatism, as the Great Demon King is a key asset for Gulver. Apart from that, there's nothing that would disqualify Gulver. It's not clear if Gulver is an Akuma Clan demon or a youkai, but youkai in the series are also shown to have moral agency, as seen by Shindo and Birin's defection, so it doesn't really matter which one he is.

Final Verdict

[tup] Also, it's worth noting that if approved Gulver would be our third Goro Naya CM after the Great Leader and Doctor Satan.

Just imagine something here.
nwotyzal Since: Sep, 2019
#306090: Mar 18th 2022 at 10:01:19 PM

[tup]Minyak & Gulver

Just came out of Batman. Holy shit.

NonoRobot Since: Sep, 2010
#306091: Mar 18th 2022 at 11:52:54 PM

As a Triangle Strategy player, I can only concur wholeheartedly with finalsurvivor1 regarding Idore Delmira. Apparently Archibald (a former Saintly Seven and essentially the White Sheep of the group) has an unique dialogue with him that I am not aware of if you take him with you during the final battle, but I guess said dialogue doesn't suddenly make Idore a better person.

[tup] Idore

Sorsley Ende is despicable, but can't rival with Idore (he lacks the "exceptional" requirement imho) and is killed early in the story, though I would be curious to hear your case. I do agree he could qualify, it is just that Idore is that bad in comparison.

And yeah, Erika and Thalas certainly don't count, as you yourself (Scraggle) pointed out. They are petty as fuck, but don't really fulfill most criterias (and Thalas shows concern/love about her sister, whereas Erika doesn't care if he dies first).

Gustadolph doesn't count indeed, for all the reasons listed by finalsurvivor1.

Edited by NonoRobot on Mar 19th 2022 at 12:02:35 PM

Michealthehero21 Since: Jan, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#306092: Mar 19th 2022 at 12:29:36 AM

[tup] Kuga. My god, what a bastard. I could tell that he was gonna be an easy keeper just from reading the character page. He takes bullying to an whole new level of evil. And I can only dread on what crimes that Kyou plans to commit in the manga's finale.

Also, I agree that the Batman has no keepers. Kinda disappointed that Falcone doesn't keep, considering how vile he was in the film, but ah well, I won't complain about it.

AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
ReddishGuy1 Since: Jul, 2014
#306094: Mar 19th 2022 at 12:50:42 AM

[up][up] What exactly is mitigating about Falcone?

Just imagine something here.
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#306095: Mar 19th 2022 at 1:05:43 AM

Hey guys its my birthday. I'm now 24.

[up]The issue is that we'll Falcone doesn't have redeeming qualities.. riddler who's just a dude with 4Chan minions tries to destroy the city which is way worse than anything Falcone tries with way less resources than Falcone to boot.

[tup]Minyak, Idore, Great Demon King Gulver and Kuga.

Edited by miraculous on Mar 19th 2022 at 1:09:24 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
emperors Messenger from another dimension. Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: It's complicated
Messenger from another dimension.
#306096: Mar 19th 2022 at 1:21:09 AM

[up] Happy birthday!

Yes to Gulver and Kuga.

Edited by emperors on Mar 19th 2022 at 4:21:43 AM

Welcome to the world of greatest media!
CloisterTheStupid from Oop North Since: Jan, 2019 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
#306097: Mar 19th 2022 at 1:30:02 AM

[tup] to Idore, Kuga, the Orang Minyak and Gulver. [tdown] to the Commander.
Happy birthday Mir!

DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#306098: Mar 19th 2022 at 1:57:26 AM

[tup] Creeps, Hinata, Idore, Kuga, Minyak and Gulver

[tdown] Commander

Cut Athalie

TotemGenitor Bye Since: Apr, 2021 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Bye
#306099: Mar 19th 2022 at 1:59:35 AM

[tup] Hinata Hyuga, Mayor Creeps, Gulver, Daichi Kuga, Idore Delmira

[tdown] Guard commander

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#306100: Mar 19th 2022 at 2:49:47 AM

Yes to Kuga, Oily Man, Gulver.

Happy b-day Mir.


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