During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Yes to Broker.
spyland2: Trials of Apollo? I called it but haven't got around to it. There is indeed one character I feel has a decent chance at making it but I won't be able to get to him for awhile. If you want to handle I say go for it.
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup threadI will switch to abstain myself on Mercer.
Current tally.
Yes: 14 (Wet, G, Mir, Nwot, Xie, Jackie, New, MGD, Demon, Vile, Crow, Yobaby, Bullman, Tell)
No: 8 (STAR, 43, Sky, Library, Cloister, Dood, Scraggle, Polar)
Abstain: 7 (Totem, Georgie, ACW, Mario, Media, myself, Lighty)
Edited by Ordeaux26 on Feb 24th 2022 at 6:33:44 AM
Having caught up to that discussion, mark me as a slight "nay" for Mercer. "Yea" to broker though.
@username: The spell. MasterN said it best earlier. Don't really mind though.
How 'bout another? This time from somewhere else...
What is the work?
Digimon Ghost Game is the latest work in the Digimon anime franchise. Quoting the work page: "Thanks to advancements in technology, holograms and artificial intelligence have become a part of everyday life. However, there are growing rumors online that glitches in these holograms are resulting in supernatural phenomenons and incidents, caused by so-called "Hologram Ghosts"." Our chose children can see them and have their own Digimon partners, and so they set about solving these mysteries.
Who is the candidate? What has he/she done?
Episode 13 introduces Sealsdramon, a mysterious, robotic Digimon who's interested in reaching one thousand kills, starting off with attaining 992th as the episode begins. Evidently, as part of the Selection D, Digimon evolve into Sealsdramon to commit assassinations, but those shouldn't be happening in the Human World like it's doing. The main characters aspire to seek out and reason with Sealsdramon to put a stop to it and find out the reason for its exploits.
Then... things get dark when one of Sealsdramon's knives hits Bokomon and kills him right in front of Gammamon. Sealsdramon's reaction? Coldly proclaiming "Eintausend" (German for "one thousand") and attempts to make the despairing Gammamon 1001th.
Then, Gammamon Dark-Digivolves into Gulus Gammamon... unlike most Dark Digivolutions in this series, this one's actively sinister and intelligent, demonstrating such by swiftly and mercilessly dispatching Sealsdramon and hoisting him by his neck. Gulus Gammamon interrogates Sealsdramon, revealing the latter's intention is purely to gain a body count—human, Digimon, it doesn't matter. No reason, just obsession.
And here's where Gulus Gammamon just fucking murders him.
Freudian Excuse? Redeeming or Mitigating Factors?
None really. When he's killed, he gives off a "Well done." If anything, this is really the only sole point of discussion. The tone is strained but mechanical and straightforward. The context is two savage killers sussing each other out. Was Sealsdramon complimenting the work of another killer? Was he thanking Gulus Gammamon for helping his number? There's a bit of reading in-between lines there.
Personally, I'm going with the interpretation Sealsdramon is so obsessed with murder and his precious "number" that even his own death meant nothing to him so long as the 1000 is achieved. After all, he outright admits, "It doesn't matter how," and it apparently includes being impaled by a Dark Digivolution.
For the wary, Ghost Game pushes the series horror aspects inasmuch as the kid rating can allow, so there is indeed proper gravitas for how this guy is portrayed.
Heinousness?
A fuck-off Monster of the Week who's acknowledged as a legitimate Serial Killer with a body counting approaching 1000. Punching well above its weight class.
Conclusion?
I'm saying "yea," but what about the rest of you?
Edited by erazor0707 on Feb 24th 2022 at 8:49:28 AM
to Ganelon, Professor Chang, Doyle, the Donquixote Doflamingo image, the dc Universe header, Isaac/Master Logos, Johnny 23, Jacob Arthur Danik, the Robin King image, Shin Clear Seonous/Shin Kuria Seunousu, the Broker, and Sealsdramon.
to the Kraken, the Larvesta image (a little too unclear), Challus Mercer (tentative), High Lord Wolnir, and Shane Powers. Cut Wade. Also, leaning on a
to Count Veger since it sounds like it relies on too much Fridge Horror.
@Bullman and @Ordeaux26: The headers look great. As for quotes, I like the Horned King quote for the Disney fan works page, the second Youbakou Senja quote for the Code Lyoko fan works page, and the Darkseid quote for the DC fan works page.
Unfortunately, not too fond of the Shinnok quote, but I do have another proposal that I found:
Edited by DrUnknown on Feb 24th 2022 at 6:59:12 AM
Shin Clear (only villain from the series besides Zofis and the Mad Scientist from Dufort's backstory that just completely pure evil).
The Broker.
Would like to vote for Sealsdramon, but I feel like abstaining since, if I'm not mistaken, this show is still running so it remains to be seen if he gets eclipsed in heinousness (which is less than likely since a Serial Killer Digimon punching so far above his weight class that he's got a kill count of nearly 1000 is pretty damn heinous.)
@username2527: It's kind of both, since the sentient attack is what makes Clear Note...Clear Note. Without it, he's reborn into an entirely different, much nicer demon. (I'm reminded of Professor Pericles without the evil Nibiru entity now....)
Edited by ANewMan on Feb 24th 2022 at 9:16:27 AM
I say we wait on Sealsdramon. I mean most Digimon series end with a literal universe ending Digimon of sorts. Yes to Clear Note but no to Mercer for reasons of insanity. Isn't that the reason why Amalthus from Xenoblade Chronicles 2 doesn't count? Driven insane by the death of his mother?
Edited by Klavice on Feb 24th 2022 at 7:59:59 AM
Sealsdramon...I feel weird typing this, as I use his evolutions a lot in the games.
The Broker
Clear Note

Oh, I can confirm that one:
Danik is fanatic to the level other Unitologists are "Dude, chill." The Circle is violently fanatical to the level others aren't, and he believes in forcing them into "evolution" for its own sake. The indication is that Danik is less concerned about humanity's betterment and more being the one to force them into it.