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Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
VeryVileVillian Since: Dec, 2017
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#300429: Feb 6th 2022 at 1:19:42 PM

Yes to Darkest Minds duo.

Powermaster201 The Emperor of Evil! Since: Apr, 2019 Relationship Status: A cockroach, nothing can kill it.
The Emperor of Evil!
#300430: Feb 6th 2022 at 1:21:24 PM

I remember watching that movie years ago and tried reading the book (never finished it)

Anyway cut the President Evil and yes to Clancy and Mc Manus (never liked that guy).

Edited by Powermaster201 on Feb 6th 2022 at 4:21:39 AM

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#300431: Feb 6th 2022 at 1:21:56 PM

Zero issues to either of those, thanks for bringing that up again!

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#300432: Feb 6th 2022 at 1:22:37 PM

What a WEIRD end for Clancy. Were they planning a sequel that just never got made?

AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#300433: Feb 6th 2022 at 1:23:24 PM

The movie bombed.

therealjackieboy from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
#300434: Feb 6th 2022 at 1:24:54 PM

[tup] Darkest Minds duo

It's Spooky Month!
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#300435: Feb 6th 2022 at 1:25:40 PM

Yeah… lemme just head off here. The story did not conclude because of poor performance. The writers did not intend for that and they did not mean to affront you with a villain not being punished for his crimes because they initially planned more works.

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#300436: Feb 6th 2022 at 1:27:01 PM

That's a sign, ACW, to stop with this about villain ends. We get it, you don't like karma houdinis or inconclusive ends, you've told us hundreds of times.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#300437: Feb 6th 2022 at 1:28:42 PM

Oh, I'm not asking here because I'm annoyed; I'm just curious if it was supposed to be a Sequel Hook if the film had done better.

Edited by ACW on Feb 6th 2022 at 4:28:52 AM

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#300438: Feb 6th 2022 at 1:30:12 PM

Well I don’t think they planned to end it just as Ruby was teaming up with the faction fighting Clancy and he was preparing his armies to go out on a slaughter fest.

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#300439: Feb 6th 2022 at 1:32:18 PM

ACW....please normalize googling or using W Ikipedia on this if it pertains to a question beyond just the EP

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#300440: Feb 6th 2022 at 1:32:32 PM

Actually...I can see why they didn't do a sequel:

  • Box-Office Bomb: Budget, $34 million. Box office, $12.6 million (domestic), $41.1 million (worldwide).
Not great [lol]

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#300441: Feb 6th 2022 at 1:33:23 PM

Uh I've seen worse. Check Hellboy (2019)'s one. [lol]

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Tyk5919 Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin Since: Mar, 2011 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin
#300442: Feb 6th 2022 at 1:37:08 PM

God, this film. I'm so happy this film bombed and killed the whole "Let's adapt every dystopian YA novel to the big screen" craze going on in the 2010s. >__> I'm curious what made you wanna watch this, 43110.

[tup] for Clancy and Captain McManus. Scrap President Gray.

And also [tup] for Chak Ek.

@ACW: Yeah, long story short? The movie sucked ass. It made little money so the intended sequels were scrapped. And then everyone forgot about it and moved on to better things.

Edited by Tyk5919 on Feb 6th 2022 at 4:37:52 AM

I write stories and shiz. You can read them here.
PurpleEyedGuma Since: Apr, 2020
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#300445: Feb 6th 2022 at 1:42:12 PM

Bradley Whitford still has Dean Armitage.

Oh, and sure to Chak Ek.

I'll chop the President when the other 2 get written up.

Here's what's pending minus Dragon and Vice:

Ordeaux, any luck with Yoshi?

Edited by ACW on Feb 6th 2022 at 4:43:43 AM

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#300446: Feb 6th 2022 at 1:43:00 PM

Okay, so real quick, because now we're getting off topic:

What's the work?

Onmyoji is a 2001 Japanese historical fantasy film set during the Heian Period. The hero is Abe no Seimei, the famed Onmyoji who protects the imperial court, and his wicked rival Doson who plots against the Emperor.

Who is Doson?

The evil Doson is a ruthless, ambitious fellow. The head Onmyoji of the Imperial Bureau, Doson sows evil and destruction, including having the Emperor's newborn son possessed by an evil spirit to kill him, which Seimei prevents. Doson intends to gather enough evil energy to awaken the wicked spirit of Prince Sawara who was framed for treason and killed himself. Foiled, Doson resorts to trying to frame Seimei for enchanting the royal family to see him and his allies executed, including the mysterious woman Aone...

Thanks to Doson, Aone is mortally wounded, but survived. Back to the drawing board, Doson twists a woman jealous of Seimei into an Oni, killing several people before Seimei helps to free her from the spell, whereupon she kills herself to stop the rampage. Seimei uses a spell to strike back at Doson, destroying his secret lair and familiars, prompting fury from Doson...

Marchin to Prince Sawara's tomb, Doson calls upon Sawara's rage, offering his body and soul as a vessel to destroy the Heian capital. Awakening Sawara, Doson marches there with a horde of evil spirits and Prince Sawara, advising him to annihilate everyone.

It is revealed Aone is Sawara's old lover, and Seimei faces Doson...Seimei fights not by force of arms, but with Aone, he convinces Sawara to give up his hate. Realizing he is tired of hatred and rage, Sawara and his beloved pass into the afterlife...

Seimei warns Doson he is no longer of any match for him, but Doson opts to fight and is defeated. Bound by Seimei, Doson uses Sawara's old sword to slash his throat rather than be taken alive.

Mitigating issues?

That's a nope. Doson is a ruthless, cruel man. The only time he shows emotion is when his lair is destroyed and he seems genuinely freaked out. His emotion about his familiar dying is...admittedly ambiguous, as he seems pissed, but he only answers this with sadism later and says he cares for nothing but his own ambitions later, so I think we're okay here.

He jumps over the heinousness line at the end. The only one who compares is Prince Sawara who turns out to just be tired of hatred and evil and wants to move on while Doson...yeah.

Conclusion?

Yes to Doson

therealjackieboy from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
#300447: Feb 6th 2022 at 1:43:03 PM

[tup] Doson

Edited by therealjackieboy on Feb 6th 2022 at 1:43:22 AM

It's Spooky Month!
Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#300449: Feb 6th 2022 at 1:45:10 PM

[tup] The Darkest Minds duo and Doson.

He hasn't responded to my DM yet so unless something changes somebody else will need to do the writeup.

Edited by Ordeaux26 on Feb 6th 2022 at 1:45:34 AM

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#300450: Feb 6th 2022 at 1:46:27 PM

Yes to Doson.

Anyone from the sequel? Onmyōji makes the demon seem pretty bad:

Onmyoji 2 is set some time after the events of the first movie and touches a bit more on Japanese Mythology, namely the gods and goddesses and the Izumo and Yamato clans. A demon is running loose in the captial, killing members of the nobility at random. What sets these murders apart from others is that one body part (an eye, the nose, a leg, etc...) on each victim is devoured for some unknown purpose. Fujiwara no Yasumaro, the current Right Minister to the Emperor, is worried about his daughter, Himiko, being possessed by the demon, as she started sleepwalking at night at the same time the killings began. The Emperor tasks Seimei with finding and exorcising the demon. Meanwhile, Hiromasa finds a new friend in Susa, a peasant boy, after following the sound of the latter's biwa melody. In the middle of all of this is the story about an Izumo village that was destroyed 18 years ago and the mysterious sword, Ama no Murakumo.

Behind the scenes, a mysterious man named Genkaku is employed by other members of the Emperor's court due to his "god-like" powers in a political gambit to bring disfavor to Seimei. However, Genkaku seems to be interested in other things....


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