Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

Yea, I misread that. In that case to John Herod, so far, I'm not all that familiar with that continuity.

Also about mislabled generic doomsday villains, I'm gonna go ahead and write The Fallen and Shan Yu off that page.

edited 1st Aug '14 2:22:23 PM by Beast

@28407 The Guardians put Volthoom in lesser restraints so they can use his power to create the Third Army, one that is supposedly used to combat the evils of free will and emotion all over the universe. This is all in the previous storyline Rise of the Third Army, which I haven't read.

The Guardians of the Universe, what a bunch of a-holes.

Apparently he also made a habit of torturing and killing millions. Volthoom that is

Sure seem to be...[1]s or more Darkseid-like?

Write ups for my nominations!

• From Lupin The Third The Hemingway Papers we have Mash, a sadistic Sociopathic Soldier and Psycho for Hire who works for the rebel forces on Colcaca Island in the Mediterranean Sea. He routinely leads his men to Rape, Pillage, and Burn innocent people all along the countryside. He is also a former comrade of Jigen's...and he betrayed Jigen and his entire group, gunned them all down and left Jigen for dead. Ultimately a Dirty Coward, he is unable to fight the superior Jigen one on one and wants to corner him in traps or when he's in a group.

• From Lupin The Third The Castleof Cagliostro, the Big Bad, the unnamed Count leads a Religion of Evil cult which wants the secret treasure beneath the Castle's lake. To do this he intends to marry the underage heiress of the Castle, Princess Clarrise. He also has a penchant for locking people in the Castle's dungeons to let them starve to death, which Lupin and Zenigata discovered by seeing the bodies given him a death count in the dozens. And ultimately he is a liar who guns down Lupin and Clarrise after promising to her that he'd let Lupin live, purposely missing them to show the power he had over her.

• From Highschool DXD we have the first Big Bad of the series, the Fallen Angel Raynare. While all fallen angels are generally evil, none are as sadistic and manipulative than Raynare. When she spots a target she wants to kill, she poses as their crush and asks them out on a date, which when finished...she kills her date and tries to take their power. Issei, the main protagonist was her second to last victim and was only saved by the devil Rias. However, when she wanted the healing power of Asia's gear power, she had her tortured and killed slowly, giving a No Holds Beat Down on Issei while giving him a Breaking Speech, mocking him on how bored she was on their date and how he was powerless to save Asia. Beautiful, sadistic, and sociopathic, Raynare represented some of the worst evil the series had to offer.

They sound like keepers.

@28379: I'll vote yes on Vulture 2099.

@28383: Also yes on Go-Jaraji-Da.

@28390: For Chytrine, I'll vote yes yet again.

@28391: You might want to clarify that Korugar is a planet, but other than that the entry looks good.

@28405: Good idea, thanks for doing that.

@28406: I'll wait to hear more on what you find before voting on Herod.

@28418: Those Lupin entries should be italicized only instead of giving red links, and it should be No-Holds-Barred Beatdown in Raynare's entry, otherwise the entries look good.

New candidates:

-Brainiac, Imperiex and Dr. London in "Western Animation: Legion of Super Heroes"

and Three versions of Loki.

-Loki in "The Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes"

-Loki in "Ultimate Marvel"

-Old Loki in "Loki: Agent of Asgard"

If you're proposing them, then you're going to have to provide a lot more information than just their names. You gotta describe them to us as if none of us here have ever seen the series before (because I'm sure some of us haven't). You should do an effort post explaining who they are, what their crimes are, what the heinous standard of the work is (aka the crimes committed by everyone, protagonists and villains alike), and whether or not they have redeeming qualities or Freudian Excuses.

As for Loki in The Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes, I don't remember him being exceptionally heinous. He kind of just wanted power and then went nuts when he got it. Also, I'd argue his Fate Worse than Death makes him too pitiable to qualify.

edited 1st Aug '14 5:18:42 PM by OccasionalExister

Aren't most versions of Loki a Woobie, Destroyer of Worlds?

I don't remember any versions of Loki being exceptionally heinous. Not even in the Avengers.

I think Sympathetic Loki is actually a fairly recent interpretation, but he's rarely been played as utterly unambiguously unsympathetic.

Something I find amusing regarding the already discussed/approved Unalaq from Legend of Korra. The one thing that seemed slightly sympathetic about him was some of his talk about Good Old Ways and desire to unite the human and spirit worlds- which the protagonist herself thought was a good idea.

Well, this season of the show has a group of Well-Intentioned Extremist villains, and they reveal that Unalaq was a member of the group, and he suggested the idea of kidnapping the protagonist when she was a baby (note, this is his niece), but then betrayed them both in helping to imprison them and in hijacking their ideas for restoring the natural order into a plan to empower himself. The rest of the group disapprove.

I find it amusing because the previous season did so much already to undermine his initial somewhat sympathetic image, and now he is revealed to be an even bigger asshole after his death.

We'll let someone else add it Unalaq's write-up, if it doesn't violate our offscreen villainy rules.

Betraying the Red Lotus probably isn't worth mentioning given his other crimes eclipse it. Plus I think it would be a violation of the "no Offscreen Villainy" rule.

edited 1st Aug '14 7:33:30 PM by OccasionalExister

Yeah. I agree there. I was more commenting on him being even less nuanced than he appeared, but I guess the meat of it is the fact that the reason why some of his sentiments sounded like those of a Well-Intentioned Extremist is basically because he stole the idea from the genuine article and turned the plan from restoring the natural order to making himself a god on earth.

Apparently there is an unwritten rule that caring about even one person invalidates a character from the trope, regardless of how evil they are in all other respects. I don't see that as an "altruistic quality," necessarily, because having a specific exception to your otherwise total lack of morals doesn't mean that you have morals. It's not a general limitation on evilness. Kills people, but not puppies—not a total monster. Kills people and puppies, but not his own puppy—still 100% monster, as far as everyone except his puppy is concerned.

If that's meant to be a requirement, they must only care about themselves, it probably should actually be written somewhere.

It is, in fact, written somewhere: the FAQ cited at the top of this page.

Again, the reason we exclude characters with even the slightest redeeming quality from this trope is that it is defined as "the worst possible villain, without redeeming qualities, whose death or defeat is lamented by nobody".

edited 1st Aug '14 7:52:18 PM by Fighteer

Just saw Guardians of the Galaxy and about Ronan, despite his high kill count and him admitting to killing Drax's family, I don't think he's heinous enough compared to the Red Skull. And the thing about his fathers? We really don't know if he truly loved his ancestors.

The villain would only count of the care they have for one person was not genuine. It's been covered before with Bellatrix and Volgin. I feel Hopper could have counted too had the film gone into more detail about his promise, but as it is, he seems to have cared about his mother enough to not harm Molt.

I didn't even read the spoiler tags for that fanfic Ghetsis entry way back because the non-spoiler parts told me absolutely nothing about him I didn't already see in canon Ghetsis. When his name came up, I thought it would be about him in Pokemon Special given his actions in volume 51. But the thing is his arc isn't over yet. We still have a whole new Team Plasma to go through. He and Colress might actually be friends here for all we know.

for Gideon, for Ronan, and for now, for Giselle.

I actually do have a cosmic marvel one we can discuss. Captain Marvel, AKA Lord Mar-Vell of The Cancerverse. Once one of earth's great heroes, Mar-Vell ended up on his death bed, dying of an unknown illness. Out of refusal to die, Mar-Vell opted to kill death itself. He tricked the Avengers into performing a ritual that annihilated Death's avatar and killed Death herself...it also unleashed the Many Angled Ones onto his universe. Everything save Mar-Vell was enslaved, made a twisted parody of life and bound to the Many Angled Ones as their slaves...unable to ever die.

To spread this cancer to our uuniverse, Mar-Vell has the Magus set up a chain reaction that wipes out multiple worlds, along with all line to open a fault line. When he arrives, he learns the Magus has failed to kill Death's Avatar, Thanos, and subsequently exterminates him on the spot, musing a world where people can die will take getting used to. He then unleashed the horrible abominations from the fault to the point where Galactus and every other cosmic abstract has to join the fight. He also tortures Nova's girlfriend, Namorita, for info (And amusement).

When he's stopped? He's about to kill Thanos to kill Death in the 616 universe and enslave every living thing to the Many Angled Ones. So yeah, a bodycount in the billiosn and enslavement in the quintillions?

Apologies if I start a fight here, but there's a character I think might merit re-examination, and that's Spandam from One Piece. He was cut in the early days of the thread for being too much of a small fry, but the thing is, I think that was before we decided that characters at different "scales" can count if they're sufficiently different. Spandam I see as sort of OP's equivalent of Tarkin: the commander of one, albeit important, base, who can't reach the scale of misdeeds the head of state does, but under the "scale clause" I'm not sure he needs to. My only quibble? I think his ultimate fate might be too comedic, being, last we saw him, stuck in a cartoony body cast with cartoony swellings and bruises all over his body.

Thoughts?

Lord Mar-Vell

Unfortunately, while I can't say with authority, I think we did discuss Spandam with that criteria in mind. However, I remember I did vote for him.

Not in the posts I found, you didn't.

edited 1st Aug '14 9:12:09 PM by KyleJacobs