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Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#282401: Oct 7th 2021 at 7:46:47 AM

I don't care that much if it is deleted but at the same time I feel it would be a bit odd if we don't allow this page despite having well above the amount we usually get before making a page. There is also some benefit to doing this beyond just having the page it will help taking a burden off the main DC page which is already quite massive.

YobabyColin Since: Apr, 2021 Relationship Status: A cockroach, nothing can kill it.
#282402: Oct 7th 2021 at 7:51:35 AM

Yes to Ted and Gentle.

[up][up] Abstain on the Wonder Woman page for now.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#282403: Oct 7th 2021 at 7:54:39 AM

Like I said, I'm honestly fine either way.

Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Enid Sinclair
#282404: Oct 7th 2021 at 7:56:59 AM

On the one hand is it necessary. Probably not. But at the same time it's already made and what is the harm. I could go either way.

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Tyk5919 Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin Since: Mar, 2011 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin
#282405: Oct 7th 2021 at 8:00:53 AM

@papyru30: Keep in mind I had to suffer through two seasons of bullshit before I got to the good stuff. I can see why you removed it in the first place.

I write stories and shiz. You can read them here.
Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#282406: Oct 7th 2021 at 8:00:54 AM

Also, I would like to I will admit I may have rushed the page a bit but at the same time these strong objections have only been coming nearly a day later so this would have been an issue even if I did wait like a few hours.

STARCRUSHER99 The Moron from one of my unhealthy obsessions (Captain) Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The Moron
#282407: Oct 7th 2021 at 8:04:47 AM

Again, as someone who doesn't particularly mind it, the strong objections came in part because now the page is already there - now the issue isn't "do we make a page or don't", now it's "do we have to move everything back to where it already was or not", so waiting for more opinions probably would've made the objections a bit less aggressive.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#282409: Oct 7th 2021 at 8:44:02 AM

Well, it seems I am in the minority now I could merge it back then if you want me to. Though I would appreciate it if we don't jump further on my decision and just keep going.

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#282410: Oct 7th 2021 at 9:03:53 AM

I don't think they're so much jumping on you as bringing to attention the page was made, as pap said, before there was consensus and historically this has been a point of contention between us and you. They'd just like the importance that this not be repeated as it has been so many times driven home.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#282411: Oct 7th 2021 at 9:09:37 AM

I've re-merged the stuff, I think I got it all.

BTW, one good thing: Astarte isn't from Vol. 2, so that's fixed.

Edited by ACW on Oct 7th 2021 at 12:11:43 PM

Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#282413: Oct 7th 2021 at 9:16:33 AM

[up] Make sure you aren't getting ahead of yourself by cutlisting the page, Ordeaux.

Yes to Inquirer and Teddy before I forget.

[down] I mean, I've gotten flak for cutting pages before there was consensus, so better be sure.

Edited by SkyCat32 on Oct 7th 2021 at 12:28:14 PM

Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#282414: Oct 7th 2021 at 9:19:14 AM

I mean ACW did just merge everything back so I don't see any reason to not Cut List it now.

DukeNukem4ever Since: Jan, 2017
#282415: Oct 7th 2021 at 9:21:57 AM

[tup] to Gentle and Teddy.

Guess Walking Dead will get it's own page soon enough.

Tyk5919 Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin Since: Mar, 2011 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin
#282416: Oct 7th 2021 at 9:26:20 AM

[tup] for the Gentle Inquirer.

I write stories and shiz. You can read them here.
Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#282417: Oct 7th 2021 at 9:32:59 AM

[tup] Gentle and Teddy.

Yeah I think that makes 7 from the franchise now (unless I am missing one) technically enough but probably not needed unless we get more.

DukeNukem4ever Since: Jan, 2017
#282418: Oct 7th 2021 at 9:40:15 AM

EDIT: nothing to see here.

Edited by DukeNukem4ever on Oct 7th 2021 at 1:56:50 AM

SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#282419: Oct 7th 2021 at 9:45:23 AM

Duke, I don't mean to be rude, but if the discussion date hasn't arrived, why are we speculating on possible candidates?

DrScavenge27 Since: Jul, 2020
#282420: Oct 7th 2021 at 10:26:05 AM

[tup] to Gentle and Teddy. Switching on [tdown] to Terry.

Furygildeman Since: Nov, 2017
#282421: Oct 7th 2021 at 10:34:12 AM

Hey I wanted to see if there could be a sandbox in Monster Sandboxes that presents a list of Characters who are C Ms as a result of Adaptational Villainy. It would also include Adaptational Jerkass. I’d just be interested in seeing all of those characters that aren’t originally but are in adaptations. I know there would have to be some discussion be as Comic Books might be tricky but where would one go about trying to get that started?

SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#282422: Oct 7th 2021 at 10:35:49 AM

Fury: I'm sorry but that sounds a little too commonplace to be worthwhile.

KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
papyru30 from Colorado for summer break Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
#282424: Oct 7th 2021 at 10:41:05 AM

Duke please blank that post, the discussion date means we're not allowed to discuss anything about the show or potential keepers, even in general terms.

[up][up][up]Personally I don't think we need that especially since we already have a lot of sandboxes

Edited by papyru30 on Oct 7th 2021 at 11:42:19 AM

Mediawatcher Since: Dec, 2015
#282425: Oct 7th 2021 at 10:42:06 AM

[tup] Gentle Inquirer and Teddy

Gotta say tyk, based on the write up for teddy fear the walking dead doesn’t like sound like a walking dead story at all. AMC just continues to milk the walking dead for what’s left. Talk about jumping the shark.

Edited by Mediawatcher on Oct 7th 2021 at 10:43:14 AM


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