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Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#278826: Sep 12th 2021 at 10:03:12 AM

I'm fine with looking at the rest of the franchise later but could we at least cut Omar?

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#278827: Sep 12th 2021 at 10:06:13 AM

I… guess? No clue why you need the immediacy especially when it’s been pointed out the entire list will need some re-evaluating and we’re gonna be talking about all of it together though, would be useful to lump it all so people have it all in mind.

Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#278828: Sep 12th 2021 at 10:07:46 AM

Criminal Case is a slow game (with the time energy stuff for instance) to complete so it may be a while before I can look at the rest of the franchise.

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#278829: Sep 12th 2021 at 10:10:02 AM

Fair enough. If it’ll be a while I’m fine with a cut and just making note of Omar flunking the standard to keep in mind for when we do the rest of it.

Powermaster201 The Emperor of Evil! Since: Apr, 2019 Relationship Status: A cockroach, nothing can kill it.
The Emperor of Evil!
#278830: Sep 12th 2021 at 10:10:38 AM

Cut Omar.

nwotyzal Since: Sep, 2019
#278831: Sep 12th 2021 at 10:51:39 AM

I guess cut him for right now. We can go over the whole thing later.

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#278832: Sep 12th 2021 at 11:20:44 AM

Btw since Ravok and I are going through the Code Geass stuff mostly for MB I'd like to call the upcoming Z of the Recapture anime.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#278833: Sep 12th 2021 at 11:20:48 AM

So the other ones who try to start a war have fewer resources than Omar?

Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#278835: Sep 12th 2021 at 11:29:41 AM

[up][up] Yes, for instance Graham Winslow is just some random Senator without much power and he attempts to start a war between the US and Soviet Union.

SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#278836: Sep 12th 2021 at 11:30:03 AM

Yes to Smilas.

Leaning cut for Omar.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#278837: Sep 12th 2021 at 11:42:33 AM

Isn't Omar just some SOMBRA agent though?

Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#278838: Sep 12th 2021 at 11:46:10 AM

[up] He is not just some SOMBRA agent he is the leader of a terrorist cell within the Sahara region, besides my main issue anyway is that means that crime is no longer unique to him with him having no unique niche to stand out with from villains who attempt to start wars on a much larger scale.

Edited by Ordeaux26 on Sep 12th 2021 at 11:46:40 AM

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#278839: Sep 12th 2021 at 11:48:53 AM

Hmm...I guess he can be cut. What about the other 4? Do any of them count?

AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#278840: Sep 12th 2021 at 12:05:28 PM

Ordeaux was going to play the whole game. But personally think Ayush can stay.

DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#278842: Sep 12th 2021 at 1:08:13 PM

[up][up] I meant any of the other 4 who try to start a war.

Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#278843: Sep 12th 2021 at 1:20:31 PM

[up] No, The Demon Queen is easily heinous enough but she has redeeming qualities and agency issues, Graham Winslow also doesn't stand out enough and his attempt at starting a war is all he really has, and the other two fail the insane heinous standard.

Let me make this clear Criminal Case's heinous standard is insanely high in fact I would say its as bad as Criminal Minds.

Edited by Ordeaux26 on Sep 12th 2021 at 1:21:23 AM

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#278844: Sep 12th 2021 at 1:21:44 PM

Are you thinking of proposing anyone else ?

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#278845: Sep 12th 2021 at 1:24:01 PM

I do have one other candidate in mind that being Shweta Noorani, but I doubt anyone else will qualify.

CloisterTheStupid from Oop North Since: Jan, 2019 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
YobabyColin Since: Apr, 2021 Relationship Status: A cockroach, nothing can kill it.
PurpleEyedGuma Since: Apr, 2020
MGD107 Since: Feb, 2015
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#278850: Sep 12th 2021 at 1:56:21 PM

Ordeaux: Damn surprised We'll probably have to evaluate them all at the end, like we did for Criminal Minds.


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