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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#277201: Aug 29th 2021 at 9:15:32 PM

Yes to Iruel. Is this our first NGE? Ever?

Edited by Scraggle on Aug 29th 2021 at 10:15:56 AM

therealjackieboy from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
#277202: Aug 29th 2021 at 9:23:47 PM

[up] Not counting fanfic... yeah. Strange to think that, but it's true.

It's Spooky Month!
MasterN Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button from Florida- I mean Unova Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#277203: Aug 29th 2021 at 9:30:21 PM

[tup] film!Sauron and Iruel, the first NGE keeper. After so long, we finally found one. Any others coming up?

One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.
ASghhrv6ub Best Smile from Second star to the right. Since: Jun, 2020 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
RobertTYL Since: Oct, 2019 Relationship Status: Holding out for a hero
papyru30 from Colorado for summer break Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
DrScavenge27 Since: Jul, 2020
#277208: Aug 29th 2021 at 10:02:34 PM

[tup] to Sir, Hush and Sauron. Am I the only one, who thinks that TCM's page quote is kinda lame?

DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#277209: Aug 29th 2021 at 10:07:33 PM

[tup] Sauron, Hush, Randar, Madison, Jeff, Terl and Iruel

[tdown] Sir

Mediawatcher Since: Dec, 2015
Bugfragged Since: Nov, 2012
#277211: Aug 29th 2021 at 10:10:37 PM

[tup] to Terl and Iruel.

What is the work?

Soma Spirits (released Apr 13 2017) is an RPG Maker game where the planet of Soma and its people are split into the World of Joy and the World of Sorrow. The World of Joy focuses on personal happiness while the World of Sorrow focuses on societal responsibilties. Despite this split, everyone's joy and sorrow versions are still capable influencing each other to some extent, meaning people from the Joy side can still worry about responsibilities and people from the Sorrow side can still have their own personal desires. Heart and Soul, the guardian spirits of Joy and Sorrow respectively, are tasked by their mentors to maintain Soma's balance by extracting joy or sorrow from certain citizens, but it later becomes clear that their mentors aren't what they seem.

The candidates for this EP are Form and Dissonance, but while the majority of their crimes take place in Soma Spirits, the sequel Soma Union (released Aug 12 2021) sheds some light on their past.

Who are Form and Dissonance?

Form and Dissonance were once human aristocrats disputing their parents' inheritance, but each had differing Knight Templar visions for the world. Form wants to create a joyful world where everone will pursue their personal happiness without worrying about long-term societal consequences. Dissonance wants a sorrowful world where everyone puts aside their personal happiness in favor of seeing the realities of the world and acting solely for their societal responsibilities.

Form uses her legalese to win this dispute, but Dissonance refuses to give up on the inheritance and his goals, though it's unknown what else happened in the time between the inheritance issue and their deaths.

Unfortunately, a boy named Bright is granted godlike power by Absolution and accidentally revives Form and Dissonance as spirit-like beings in the process of magically remodeling their manor.

What have they done?

After Sun King Bright conquers the world, Form and Dissonance each try to convince him to implement their "utopia." They attack when Bright refuses, but are driven off. They then form an Enemy Mine with each other and start a world war against Bright, intending to steal the power of Absolution for themselves. They overwhelm Bright and his friends due to his reluctance to continue using Absolution's power, resulting in Bright shattering and scattering Absolution to prevent anyone from using it. Form and Dissonance continue fighting, killing Bright's friends, though Bright continues fighting back and manages to permanently weaken them. The intense battle causes Soma to split into the Worlds of Joy and Sorrow, with Form taking over the former and Dissonance taking over the latter. Bright's friends are reincarnated as Heart and Soul, but lack their memories, which Form and Dissonance take advantage of so they can influence the two.

Form and Dissonance later discover that Absolution's fragments infected certain people and caused them to have emotional conflicts. They want Heart and Soul to extract the targets' emotions as orbs, and Form wants six orbs of sorrow while Dissonance wants six orbs of joy, which will leave the targets with only joy or sorrow respectively. Each of these orbs contain small fragments of Absolution's power, which Form and Dissonance plan to use to destroy each other's worlds while ruling over the remaining one. Worse yet, Form plans on infecting Heart with the power of Absolution while Dissonance plans to do the same to Soul, which will result in their respective proteges going insane and destroying the world they oppose.

In the two bad endings, one of them succeeds in their plan and has their protege destroy the opposing world, but also gets killed in the process because of how uncontrollable their protege became.

In the two normal endings, one of them is exposed as a villain and slain, but the other hides their true nature and continues their plan in secret.

In the 5th and canon route, the Heart and Soul gather an equal amount of each orb, causing the Worlds of Joy and Sorrow to merge into the original Soma. This causes the people of Soma to merge into their original forms too. Form and Dissonance are angered, since this prevents them from easily picking and choosing who to kill or spare for their utopias. They then team up one last time, deciding that a world of complex emotions is doomed to conflict and therefore deserves to be destroyed.

In the Sun King's citadel, they fuse into Quietus and take in the six fragments of Absolution's power while attempting to suck all of Soma into a rift in space. They start a Hopeless Boss Fight and taunt Heart and Soul for their shaky teamwork, but Bright uses the last of his power to remind Heart and Soul of their brotherly bonds, giving them the confidence and power to win. Quietus is slain and the recompleted Soma is saved for now.

Mitigating factors?

Form and Dissonance claim a world of only joy or sorrow respectively is for the good of Soma's citizens, but they want to kill the half of Soma's people that don't have the emotions they want. When the population returns to their original forms and have both joyful and sorrowful emotions, Form and Dissonance want to kill them all, showing that they're NSWIEs who care more about controlling Soma than helping their people.

Dissonance had standards during his human life, since he didn't mind sharing half of the inheritance with Form and originally wanted to achieve his goals peacefully through education. However, he lost all of these standards by the start of the game, since he has no problem trying to destroy the World of Joy and his sister with it.

While too much of Absolution's power can drive people mad, Form and Dissonace had their genocidal goals in mind before they infected themselves with Absolution, so there are no agency issues here.

In the non-canon endings, whoever loses out on the orb plan will assist the party in going after the other, but this is only to maintain control over their own domain. They still intend on betraying the protagonists and destroying the opposite world afterwards.

The biggest concern is their relationship with their family in Soma Union. Form's first diary is the only one that mentions her parents, showing that she used to take care of them. Meanwhile, Dissonance's diary implies that he solved a crisis that was harming their family.

Form's diary: "After months of ridiculous formalities, we have finally settled our parents' estate. It is absolutely despicable that they would try to leave half of the manor to my brother! After he left our family for YEARS to learn the art of swordplay like a rogue! Do they not care for their sweet and perfect princess?! The one who stayed here to take care of them while he traveled the world as if his whole life was an adventure?! It's unfair! COMPLETELY unfair!"

Dissonance's diary: "If my sister thinks she can keep me from my home, she is sorely mistaken. She wishes to use our inheritance to make the world just as she knows it. A world where she never had to leave the comfort of this manor. Yet who was it that ventured out into the world when a crisis befell this family? Who was it who saw the world for what it really is, with his own eyes?! I cannot imagine building a world based upon such a simple worldview! A world of such hollow joy! And as long as I remain here, far underneath the manor...I will not allow these delusions of hers to become true."

Dissonance's wording is more ambiguous and doesn't specifically mention their parents, showing that he likely had a weaker relationship with them. Form mentions her parents, but also words her diary in a way that holds them in contempt and acts like they owe her. They never mention their parents outside of these diaries and instead only talk about their ideologies and evil plans.

As for whether the setting is considered appropriate for having CM candidates, Soma is initially set up as Sugar Bowl with chibi anthropomorphic beings, but the introduction of Absolution as a destructive and corruptive being darkens the setting considerably, making the series closer to a Sugar Apocalypse. Form and Dissonance are treated seriously, with the closest thing they have to comedic moments being their hypocritical finger-pointing towards each other and their deadpan exasperation when the protagonists deliver the orb types they don't want.

Heinousness?

Their plans amount to genocide of half the world in the non-canon routes and the entire world in the canon route. This puts them on par with Absolution and Zeta in the sequel, who also want to wipe out everyone on Soma for different reasons. Form and Dissonance also have rather personal crimes in trying to corrupt Heart and Soul into fanatical living weapons and ruining their sibling relationship.

Verdict?

I'm not so sure on Form because she mentioned her parents in her diary, but I'm leaning yes due to how she seems to care more about getting the inheritance than actually honoring them. Dissonance could still qualify because he didn't mention his parents personally.

PurpleEyedGuma Since: Apr, 2020
#277212: Aug 29th 2021 at 10:14:12 PM

Yes to Iruel (first Evangelion keeper, yaaaay). Leaning yes on Form and Dissonance.

EDIT: Yes to the films’ Sauron.

Edited by PurpleEyedGuma on Aug 29th 2021 at 1:16:52 PM

Mediawatcher Since: Dec, 2015
CloisterTheStupid from Oop North Since: Jan, 2019 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
#277214: Aug 29th 2021 at 10:45:00 PM

[tup] Jeff, Terl, Iruel, Form and Dissonance.

WatTambor Since: Oct, 2020
#277215: Aug 29th 2021 at 10:47:46 PM

About the fanfic this is an AU and it doesn't take place during the events of the canon lore and all the characters are created by the author. The Horus Heresy is mentioned once but it was mentioned in regards to measuring time and it has happened long before the events of the story. The horrors that happened during the Horus Heresy are never mentioned. The slave empire of the Dark Eldar is also not delved upon even though we do see one Dark Eldar Lord. Azariah Kyras is mentioned once but his plan to destroy the Aurelian Sector is not. All the horrors that regularly happen in 40k could be attributed to offscreen villainy.

There might some other fics that take place in the same continuity but as far as I know, those are the only ones.

Tbh, I have a few more chapters left and even though I don't think anything would change, I could holdoff discussion.

Edited by WatTambor on Aug 30th 2021 at 10:59:19 PM

AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#277216: Aug 29th 2021 at 11:05:34 PM

Yeah, hence why I'm more lenient in that case.

Snoketrope Barb / Temporary Kylo from California Since: Oct, 2020 Relationship Status: Waiting for Prince Charming
Barb / Temporary Kylo
#277217: Aug 29th 2021 at 11:06:36 PM

Alrighty, Here's a RWBY one I kinda wanted to get out of the way, not definitive But....Looking at all the Info, I kinda think it's atleast worth discussing, Planned to get to it awhile ago, But Stuff happened.

Who is Tyrian Callows?

As Explained by his Bio in Volume 7, Tyrian was once a Serial Killer in the Kingdom of Mistral with murders and other Crimes across Across the Continent of Anima, eventually a Combination of Atlas and Mistral forces led by the Huntsman F. Pickerel allowed for him to finally be captured. Pickeral, having a history with Tyrian, begged them to Give him more security when he was being transported, only to be Ignored and removed from the mission for a refusal to cooperate. But the Ship he was being Held on was attacked by Grimm, led by Salem herself who broke into the Ship, killing Tyrians guard. Tyrian screamed how 'Beutiful' She was afterwards. At some point Pickarel himself was killed(Hinted to be Tyrians work)

He was thus given the chance to become something even worse, joining Salems inner Circle, being the only one who knew and Shared Salem's true end goal. He became fanatically devoted to her considering how Vile she was and her endgoal to Destroy all life Beautiful, viewing her as a Godess.

At some point, After the Traitorous Headmaster Lionheart sold out his allies to Salems forces, they got the Location for every Huntsman in the Kingdom. With Tyrian and Hazel finding and killing the Entire Kingdoms worth of them. Later we finally see him at a meeting with the Rest of the Inner Circle. Getting assigned to Hunting down Ruby Rose, and bringing her back alive(To his disappointment). Along the way finding a Waitress when tracking them, licking his lips saying how he was hoping she could 'Help him find someone', cackling at her before the screen cuts to black…

And of course later on he ends up confronting Ruby and the remains of Team JNPR, engaging in a Fight with them. Engaging with some Banter along the way, hinting at who he works for and mocking the team along the way. Eventually Qrow comes along and Saves his niece before they fight Tyrian together. He is able to Poison Qrow but ends up getting his Tail sliced off by Ruby. This forces him to Retreat back to Salem.

He apologizes to Salem, trying to say how he Managed to poison Qrow, pathetically asking if he pleased her. She responds by saying how he disapointed her. Which is enough to send him into a Breakdown, letting off his steam by disabling a Grimm that nearly attacked him, and slowly maiming and torturing it to blow off steem, cackling hysterically, even Cinder seeming horrified.

Later on he gets a new Mechanical tail from Watts, And mocks Emerald when she Merc and Hazel return from The failed mission at Haven. Warning that Cinder wasn't there to protect them anymore.

After Salem is informed of Oz having already reincarnated, he is deployed with Watts to Go to Solitas to 'Prepare', as someone getting James to see reason could Foil their entire plan.

And of course at Atlas he helps with Watts plan to cause mayhem in the Kingdom. At one point massacring a Building while talking with Watts, leaving the Building before we see a Pool of Blood pouring from said building…

He goes on to Kill James critics across Mantle to Frame him for it. The 3rd in a Week being happy Huntress Ally Forrest, who he confronted in an Alley before brutally dispatching him.

And after that, he sneaks into Robyn Hills premature 'Victory party', and when Watts shuts off the power giving him the Go Order, Tyrian proceeds to brutally murder several people at the Party, and use his semblance to Tear at Fionas stomach, wounding her. He then sneaks away when the power is reactivated, making it seem like Penny did it. The negativity from the Massacre ended up causing a Grimm attack in the City.

Later Watts meets with him at an Ally after Watts turns off Mantle's heat to freeze the City to death and cause a larger Grimm invasion. But thanks to Ironwood finally listening and making good decisions(Doesn't last) James and Robyn tell the truth to the City to Ruin Watts and Tyrians plan, with people uniting and going towards the Ships to evacuate them to Atlas. Tyrian has a Villainous Breakdown screaming how "The Grimm were supposed to DESTROY our enemies! not make them friends!. Before Watts makes a backup plan, telling Tyrian to cause some Mayhem To keep them Focused on Mantle while he goes to Amity tower.

Tyrian:You want to cause more Chaos than a Grimm invasion?

Watts:If there was anyone on remnant who could deliver that wouldn't it be you?

Upon hearing of Robyns location, he chuckles saying that he 'Had an idea'. Going to where Robyn was planning to Kill her to Crush the Hope she inspired in people, thus instigating the aforementioned Chaos.....But it turns out to be a Trap. With Qrow and Clover being there as well, they are able to Defeat Tyrian and arrest him….

Til, after a number of events, James screws everything up again and Ruby Broadcasts how he was declaring martial law and abandoning Mantle, James giving Clover orders to Apprehend Qrow, trying to arrest him and Robyn being furious at James betrayal and preparing to fight Clover. Tyrian helps fan the flames of conflict before they then break into a fight, Tyrian uses them being distracted fighting to escape and kill the Pilot (In a Darkly humorous moment, putting on said Pilots hat), Before crashing the Aircraft they were on screaming about doing 'The will, of our Godess!'

He's able to wake up from the Rubble, and gets out of his cuffs, before using his darker strategic side. Offering Qrow help in fighting Clover so when they defeat him they could settle there own Grudge, wich Qrow initially rejects in favour of trying to take him down, but when Clover keeps getting in the way and fights Qrow, Qrow is forced to take Tyrians offer as they fight Clover together. When Clover's aura is broken, Tyrian grabs Qrows weapon and brutally Impales him, wich frames Qrow for the deed. He then flees abandoning Qrow when Atlas ships come ("Looks like our score will have to wait! You know my track record with the Authorities! Hahaha!") As clover then bleeds out.

Tyrian returns to Salem as she arrives in Solitas, getting on her Grimm Mothership Monstra. Engaging in some Brief Banter with Cinder when she herself returns, dismissing Watts as a 'Necessary sacrifice' when Cinder brings up that He was captured. But Tyrian is later Contacted by Watts over how he hacked Penny and tricked Ironwood again, informing Salem of this. He's also shown briefly smirking over Cinder being tortured by Salem.

Ultimately when Salem is able to Breach Atlas shield, Tyrian is Ordered to go with Merc to Vacuo so they could bring down that kingdom next. And when he overhears a Conversation between Emerald and Mercury, Emerald having discovered Salem's true motive being to destroy everything, trying to tell Merc about it but he expresses doubt, before Tyrian gleefully confirms Emeralds words, revealing that he knew of the plan. Gleefully telling Merc how she wanted to bring about the End of Days, saying that nothing was more 'Beautiful' Than that. He then takes Merc over to an Aircraft, flying him to Vacuo for there 'Date with the Desert'

Mitigating Factors?

For a long time his Fanatical loyalty to Salem was considered, rightfully, to be Mitigating….Volume 8? Clarifies this bit. His love for Salem is because of how Damn evil Salem herself is, with him saying there was 'No ideal more beutiful' Then bringing about the end of all things. Aside from that...God, Hell no, unlike Even Watts, Callows was an evil Bastard long before Salem found him.

He gets along fine enough with Watts but casually Dismisses him as a 'Necessary sacrifice' The next Volume before they begin the Invasion.

He's unhinged certainly, but nothing indicates a Fully mitigating Insanity, being firmly in the Joker-Zone. Quite the opposite, Word of God is that he actually plays up his unhinged persona to make people think he was just a Beast, so they underestimate and don't expect his More strategic and insightful mind, with a few instances displaying this in the show.

Frankly, He's a pretty straightforward charachter all things considered, He's a Sadist who disturbs even Cinder, described by Word of God as 'Iredeemable' and was a Murder who was offered a chance to help blow up the world and kill lots of people doing it, Jumping at the chance.

Heinousness?

The main thing worth discussing RN.....At this point, the Standard is friggin Jacked, featuring characters with Epic bodycounts, or attempted body counts. For just a Couple There's Watts who helped with the Fall of Beacon, Replicates it but arguably worse, tries to freeze thousands while directly causing Salems invasion of Solitas, and then hijacking James plan to nuke a City, Minor baddies like Torchwick blowing up airships, EU baddies like Jax.....

Honestly, I think he's worse then previous discussions made him out to be

For one? Unlike the rest of Salem's minions, who think it's a simple Take Over the World gambit, Tyrian shares Salem's End goal of wanting to bring about the Annihilation of everything, wich is already a damn good Push.

He and Hazel killed Every Huntsman In Mistral, which was called Offscreen villainy before, But...I really don't see that? We see a bunch of Holo-Boards with their names, we see Qrow Visiting some of their loved ones, I think there's more then enough To serve as Evidence.

While Watts is the Mastermind, Tyrian is an active assistant in Setting up the Invasion of Solitas and his involvement is given Responsibility for it along with Watts. Aside from the Horrific Massacre at Robyn's Rally? (Which, notably, also caused a Grimm attack) He sets a Pattern for Killing Ironwoods critics across Mantle(Killing three in a Week) and kills a Buildings worth of people.

And in addition to all that? He has has minor Crimes or Bonus murders that Help him(Killing the Pilot on that ship, crashing it with him and 3 others inside, the Waitress from Volume 4. He brutally impaled Clover causing him to bleed to death, Tortured a Grimm to death to blow off some Steam) Even Generic-on-paper stuff like trying to Kill Robyn or Wounding Qrow to poison him has some meat to it, as Killing Robyn was his way of Instigating 'more Chaos than a Grimm Invasion', and poisoning Qrow ends up causing him Days of Delirious pain wich would have killed him if Mistralian authorities didn't come.

Another thing is that, I heard STAR bring up Watts, but from what we see Watts seems to be Higher on the Totem pole, us seeing Watts giving Tyrian orders and such. Tyrian, at least so far, hasn't been shown as being in Charge of Masterminding things like Watts and Cinder and more acting as a Glorified Stooge doing physical work, Like Hazel(Who he's MUCH worse then). We don't see him with Legions of Mooks like Adam or Cinder back at Beacon, Watts hacking skills and intellect also….Really shouldn't be downplayed as a Resource, it allows him to do a lot of stuff, particularly in a Technology based kingdom like Atlas.

Final Verdict?

He's not destroying Cities but I feel like Tyrian is a Unique case where there isn't one big 'Holy Fuck' Crime that puts him over the Line as much as a bunch of things that Pile up. The Omnicidal Maniac thing already gives him a decent push, add that to Heaps of Murder, Massacering people causing a Grimm attack, and Bonus Bullcrap like Torturing a Grimm to death, Impaling Clover causing Him to bleed to death and Poisoning Qrow, trying to instigate 'More Chaos then a Grimm Invasion' by killing Robyn? ECT? I think the Combination of Crimes and other stuff Pile up to help Push him over.

It's by no means a Slam Dunk case and I'm prepped for us to still decide waiting on him, but I figured it was Atleast worth discussing. Given a ton of Extra bits of Evil stuff I noticed looking into him.

Edited by Snoketrope on Aug 29th 2021 at 11:11:08 AM

Bow to the Prototype
AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#277218: Aug 29th 2021 at 11:08:48 PM

I'll probably wait for other people knowledgeable on RWBY to comment on that.

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#277219: Aug 29th 2021 at 11:11:09 PM

That a potentially redeeming quality has been revealed to be questionable now does not mean the character will not develop other redeeming qualities in the future. And considering Lighty and Jackie reserved future discussion for RWBY and Tyrian is literally right smack dab in the middle of his arc? I'm not voting on this.

Snoketrope Barb / Temporary Kylo from California Since: Oct, 2020 Relationship Status: Waiting for Prince Charming
Barb / Temporary Kylo
#277220: Aug 29th 2021 at 11:16:15 PM

I'm sorry, was this a mistake?

Bow to the Prototype
DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#277221: Aug 29th 2021 at 11:16:55 PM

[tup] Form and Dissonance

Hold off on Tyrian.

Ravok Son of Liberty from Big Shell Since: Jun, 2015 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Son of Liberty
#277222: Aug 29th 2021 at 11:38:31 PM

Tyrian's in the middle of an arc as far as I know, and while Cinder going up back after Volume 3 was one thing, it was because she easily passed the bar then and had squat in even potential redeeming features (plus standards being different back then). Tyrian has heinousness to contend with, a questionable redeeming feature, and unlike Cinder at the end of 3, hasn't really tied up any sort of "major" arc in a neat bow. Don't think he should be discussed right now, personally. I'd say save the effortpost for possible future use, however.

'Yes' to Iruel however (awesome job!), and Form and Dissonance sound it as well.

I'm not the biggest fan of the current TCM quote myself, but let's not stoop to just snarking off it's "lame" and then not contribute to any sort of replacement.

Edited by Ravok on Aug 29th 2021 at 11:44:22 AM

No! That is NOT Solid Snake! Stop impersonating him!
LoreDeluxe Since: May, 2013
#277223: Aug 29th 2021 at 11:40:07 PM

Yes to Form and Dissonance, the Evangelion angel, and Jackson's Sauron. As for Tyrian, I still don't personally see him as heinous enough. Maybe in future seasons.

As for the reservation issue, they should only really be good for reserving discussion on talking about brand new content as it's released. Permanently reserving discussion on an entire series even when the content is inactive feels like abusing the system. Any discussion on past content should always be free and open, in my opinion.

Edited by LoreDeluxe on Aug 29th 2021 at 11:42:02 AM

Think you're tough because you made it through Lord of the Rings? Real men survive The Silmarillion.
AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#277224: Aug 29th 2021 at 11:48:43 PM

I mean, Lighty partnered up and reserved the season; you can see that on the discussion dates page. But it does go into having to make it a practice to announce on the forum when you intend to reserve a work.

MasterN Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button from Florida- I mean Unova Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#277225: Aug 29th 2021 at 11:55:46 PM

Was wondering about Form and Dissonance. [tup] to them.

One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.

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