During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
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Thank you. Can you also add this
sentence by Occasional Exister, to the end of the Horrigan entry.
So, Lost God 2000, what do you have to say about Black Wolf?
For a potential write up...
- The Flight Before Christmas: Black Wolf is the alpha of a bloodthirsty pack of wolves who open up the movie attempting to kill and eat the young Niko. Black Wolf, stressing over the lack of food, attacks a completely harmless poodle who strays into his territory, who accidentally gives him the idea to kill and eat Santa Claus and his reindeer. Black Wolf then gets the idea to pose as Santa's reindeer in the process so he and his pack can sneak into the houses of humans. The plan was to slaughter every child in the world to curb his hunger. Black Wolf tracks the reindeer down, proclaims himself the new Santa Claus, and prepares to eat the reindeer. Interrupted by Niko, Black Wolf attempts to murder him too out of frustration, going as far to pursue him on top of a flying sleigh miles in the air. Even as he fell to his inevitable Karmic Disney Villain Death, Black Wolf dragged Niko's best friend Julius down with him, stating his joy that at least he wouldn't die hungry.
edited 24th Oct '17 8:46:58 PM by Scraggle
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(BTW, is BW just hungry, or is it more than that?):
- The Flight Before Christmas: Black Wolf is the alpha of a bloodthirsty pack of wolves who open up the movie attempting to kill and eat the young Niko. Black Wolf, stressing over the lack of food, attacks a completely harmless poodle who strays into his territory; the poodle, to save his own life, gives Black Wolf the idea to kill and eat Santa Claus and his reindeer. Black Wolf then gets the idea to pose as Santa's reindeer in the process so he and his pack can sneak into the houses of humans. The plan was to slaughter every child in the world to curb his hunger. Black Wolf tracks the reindeer down, proclaims himself the new Santa Claus, and prepares to eat the reindeer. Interrupted by Niko, Black Wolf attempts to murder him too out of frustration, going as far to pursue him on top of a flying sleigh miles in the air. Even as he fell to his inevitable Karmic Disney Villain Death, Black Wolf dragged Niko's best friend Julius down with him, stating his joy that at least he wouldn't die hungry; he would have killed Julius if not for Niko saving him.
edited 9th Jul '14 7:46:16 AM by ACW
Yep, ~zxynoxia added it. I'll ask them to come here and explain.
Also, since this thread can probably use it - the ~Tropers/TroperName or ~Tropers/{{Tropername}} markup can be used to alert people to posts which contain the markup. Works only in the addpost not the editpost function, though.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard FeynmanI already added Metal Face to the YMMV for Xenoblade, so all that needs to happen is he needs to be added to the main video game page under Zanza.
It looks like, despite the fact he only got a few votes, we're all in agreement that Metal Face is "worthy" of complete monster status.
We probably should look over Dickson too, since he's Zanza's top enforcer, and it is him who is responsible for Zanza's return. Personally, as big of a douche as he is, I'm going to say no to Dickson because even though he readied Shulk's body to be possessed by Zanza, he lacks the onscreen murders that Zanza and Metal Face have.
ACW@ Good edits to the writeup, though once more, a little detail wrong. The poodle giving Black Wolf the idea to eat Santa Claus was completely accidental. He just took the idea, ran with it, and then added the little detail of all the children of the world to his bucket list. His primary motivation is pretty much pure savagery and gluttony. And for any and all positive qualities, he had a pack, but he thought them an incompetent lot. He wasn't exactly a Bad Boss, but it's obvious he didn't think too highly of them. And as for White Wolf, we've seen Avenging the Villain before, and knowing Black Wolf's opinion of his pack, we can also infer he had similar thoughts about his sister. I could be wrong, because the relationship isn't exactly put into any kind of focus.
edited 9th Jul '14 1:33:37 PM by Scraggle
Accidentally gave him the idea? And again, hunger doesn't strike me as a motive. Now, if it's A God Am I that everyone else is just food to him, that's different.
He has moments resembling A God Am I when he proclaims himself the new Santa Claus. It's not exactly enough to be stretched out to his entire motive, but Black Wolf isn't a Generic Doomsday Villain.
edited 9th Jul '14 1:53:11 PM by Scraggle
Seems that Black Wolf is an even bigger monster than I remember.
BTW, remember those Lion King Adventures examples from a few months ago? I checked out the fanfic, and I actually think The Writer might count. He is very similar to the Nibiru Entity. He is an evil god who created the world Simba and his friends live in, and he had been responsible for every bad thing that ever happened to them, and thus everything bad that happened in the fanfic. He had been trying to ruin their lives and kill them just for fun, and at the end of the story, he enters the world to kill them himself and rule the world as a god so he can spread death and destruction.
I know That the original post was pretty messy, especially since it listed so many examples, but I can tell you he is the only possible candidate.
jjj

About the Gregor Clegane entry on Monster.A Song Of Ice And Fire: I'd like to change the sentence: "Gregor is introduced in the Hand's tournament where he murders another contender via splintered lance" to "Gregor is introduced in the Hand's tournament where he kills another contender via splintered lance without an ounce of remorse."
Despite WMG there isn't any indication that he intended to kill the contender, but he sure as hell didn't care that he did.
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