During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
I'll just say I'm withdrawing Pandemonium because I didn't think about the agency issues (and my sleep schedule has been going wacky because I'm an idiot and tried doing an all nighter in a game, so I'm not exactly in the right state of mind to untangle the logic), plus that's really damn complicated considering everything we see of her suggests she is of her own mind (albeit we only see her present, not her past) but her old self seems to be forgotten so it's hard to be sure what she was like before.
I will offer a brief explanation on human errors, though, just because a few people asked. Basically, when people are pulled through to the world of The Executioner And Her Way Of Life, they get a pure concept attached to their soul, like null (effectively makes things not exist any longer, not so much destroyed as removed from reality), time (screws with time), evil (what pandemonium has), etc. (which makes me wonder what someone wielding the pure concept of good would look like, but that's neither here nor there) and the more they use it the more of their memories (and possibly identity, I'm not entirely sure, because it's not super clear (or my memory is failing me because I'm tired)) they lose, eventually having the concept seemingly just run rampant through them, creating vast disaster zones. Our friend, Menou did suffer at the hand of a human error, basically losing all of herself but her name and her physical form before the error was killed, which makes her a rather... unique individual (basically the boundary between herself and that outside herself is only there in a physical sense. It's complicated, like all the concepts unique to the story).
Also, it was made in good faith. I just screwed up on one aspect.
My troper wallAlright, everyone just saw the finale of Sunset Paradise, which, unlike Meta Runner, actually does take place in the SMG 4 universe. PM to discuss any potential keepers.
I love how the movie itself was going like "This is gonna be the finale-finale for finally for real finally!" and then not even a month before the film comes out, the producer is all like "lol, I Lied"
Then again I still throw out money whenever a new Saw movie comes out, even though it should've ended two...six movies ago.
I write stories and shiz. You can read them here.I had heard the Big Bad Al-G being brought up as a potential CM on other sites but looking into it more it seems there is a lot of exaggerated villainy and I seriously doubt he is serious enough.
Has anyone discussed Dr. Death here yet? Haven't actually watched the series, I'm just asking.
Ah, right: No one counts in Die in a Gunfight. The Big Bad Terrence is utterly reprehensible and the worst in the film, being a murderous crime boss with heavy Yandere vibes to lead Mary. But he ultimately just murders two, maybe three, people personally, tries to have two others killed, and menaces a wedding with a gun in an attempt to first kill Mary's Love Interest Ben to take her for himself, then tries to kill Mary herself when she continues to refuse his advances. He's a creepy, hateable piece of work, but it's a pretty average rapsheet and bodycount for a crime villain, leaving his only standouts the very light implications of rapeyness towards Mary, and the fact that he's willing to wave a gun around and threaten several wedding guests with it, but even then his only real, stated targets are Mary and Ben, so yeah, not quite there methinks.
Edited by Ravok on Jul 30th 2021 at 7:56:55 AM
No! That is NOT Solid Snake! Stop impersonating him!Hey, did I hear we were talking Fear Street?
What's the work?
Fear Street is a trilogy of films based on the Fear Street novels by RL Stine of Goosebumps fame. Fear Street was his somewhat more adult series and I wish to reveal these mean a lot to me,...I got into horror on the basis of Goosebumps and used to sit in the library with Fear Street books, reading the hell out of them. The films were released one week apart apart...
Now, Shadyside is a town in Ohio known for one thing: it's the murder capital of the world, all but rotting as the neighboring Sunnyvale prospers....this is beleived to be the result of the curse placed on the town by Sarah Fier, an executed witch, hanged in 1666. Enter Deena Johnson, a Shadysider who has some issues with her ex-girlfriend Samantha "Sam" Fraser...Sam is afflicted by the witch's curse and seemingly hunted by her undead minions. Deena learns only one other person has ever survived the curse and while they think they can cheat the curse, the witch is not so easily bested...
Movie 2 is a flashback to the 70s when the killers slaughtered Camp Nightwing...and then Deena flashes back to 1666 where she learns the truth of Sarah Fier and we learn of the true villain...
HUGE spoilers follow. Enter Sheriff Nick Goode.
Who is Nick goode?
Scion of the Goode family line, Nick's brother is the mayor, he's the sheriff of Sunnyvale...to discuss this, I need to talk Sarah Fier...Sarah wasn't a witch at all. The horrible curse wasn't her doing, but that of her suitor Solomon Goode who made a pact with the devil for sacrifices...after having discovered a sort of eldritch location, you write down a name in the wall and the devil possesses that person to kill a victim...Solomon framed Sarah as a witch, who vowed a curse on him: that one day, his sins would be exposed and she would be there, to avenge all the blood spilled...
The Goodes have continued the evil practice. One son to carry on the curse, ending as Nicke...during the 1970s, Nick is behind the massacre at Camp Nightwig, though he saved Ziggy, the girl he had a crush on, using a spell to revive her through apparent CPR...most counselors and attendees were slaughtered, but Nick escaped detection. As sheriff, Nick is dirty and frames Shadysiders for various crimes while feigning being a morally upstanding cop...but in truth, Nick is likely the worst of the Goode line since Solomon, with him having one victim kill his friends in the intro before being gunned down by cops. The latest of many such Shadysiders who end up such.
Upon Sam being infected by the 'curse' of Sarah Fier, in truth Sarah trying to communicate with Sam, Nick rises up undead killers to slaughter their way through everyone to get to Sam who gets around the curse by having Deena drown and revive her. On the other hand, their friends are killed horrifically and Nick decides to just frame them as the killers conveniently...and then writes Sam's name on the wall to have her possessed and murder Deena. Deena survives and fights back, subduing Sam before she meets the adult Ziggy and using Sarah's power is sent back to experience Sarah's life through her eyes...realizing Nick is responsible, they bait a trap for him...initially surprised to see Ziggy, Nick simply uses her as a hostage and tries ti kill her should he be in danger, trying to have his undead kill the heroes as he furiously rants over how everything belongs to him first and foremost, before trying to murder Deena or having Sam kill her...
Deena however, exposes him to the power of the location, forcing him to see all the spirits of his victims, and Sarah Fier herself who repeats the curse she laid upon Solomon, she and Deena dispatching him by stabbing him in the face, finishing him and the curse as well, which stops Shadyside's misfortune and balances the scales. Nick is exposed as a killer and the Goodes disgraced, while at the end, Sam and Deena have a picnic at the grave of Sarah Fier, who was secretly buried by the people who loved her most (including her beloved Hannah), with her memorialized as "Sarah Fier: the first Shadysider."
And post-credits...a pair of hands snatches the grimoire used to contact the devil...
Heinousness?
I'd say so. Now, next to his ancestors...Solomon's probably among the worst as he began the curse and had his first victim slaughter a bunch of kids. Nick however, seems to crank this up worse than most others of the line. His body count is absolutely fucking enormous through the curse, in addition to a touch of a number of petty, cruel and utterly awful crimes to go with it. Every death in 1978 and 1994 is pretty much right on Nick.
Pass.
Mitigating issues?
Solomon, while awful, seems to have loved his dead wife and child . Nick on the other hand? He did care about Ziggy and seems affected seeing her in present. Seconds before he uses her as a hostage, tries to kill her and screams that if he dies, so does she without a hint of love or concern. Beyond that, nothing at all. Nick has a rant where he reveals it is all about himself and nothing else. He's selfishness incarnate, a complete bastard willing to have countless people slaughtered for his own prestige and prosperity. He even slips in his rant he only cares for himself and not his family at all.
Conclusion?
Keeper. One of two slasher throwbacks coming
Edited by Lightysnake on Jul 30th 2021 at 8:31:43 AM
Al-G's issue is that ultimately the shock of being deleted is not really explored in depth to be bad enough and Bugs comes out fine at the end without any further dialogue.
Also

Oh, God, that was...an ordeal
Edited by ACW on Jul 30th 2021 at 5:48:18 AM