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Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

nwotyzal Since: Sep, 2019
#269776: Jul 6th 2021 at 1:25:08 PM

[tup]Munakata

[tup]to the Zombozo image

Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
YobabyColin Since: Apr, 2021 Relationship Status: A cockroach, nothing can kill it.
DrUnknown Since: May, 2020
#269780: Jul 6th 2021 at 1:48:43 PM

[tup] to Owen Forster, Maximilian von Castrop, the Reggie Donovan rewrite, the Belfast leader, the Akunin leader, Magnitude, Siegbert Ansbach, Master Mage, the Vilgax tree, Yuji Katsuura/Bridge, the Vilgax quote, Georg Roseburg, the Unalaq rewrite, the Wataru Sakuma quote, Wilheim Gehbert, the Zombozo image, the Prince Sincline rewrite, and Seishiro Munakata.

[tdown] to the Emperor Nefarious quote (kind of sounds like a generic "conquer the world" quote), Vincent Cadby, and the Vilgax image. Cut Bernkastel.

If discussions about Hot Coldman are rare, then he could be removed from the NA list.

Between the two Made of Evil rule proposals, I prefer STARCRUSHER99's write, but I'm down for either one.

RIP Richard Donner.

Atlantis1930 Since: May, 2012
MGD107 Since: Feb, 2015
#269782: Jul 6th 2021 at 2:48:40 PM

[tup] to Yuji Katsuura, George Roseburg, Wilheim Gehbert and Seishiro Munakata.

Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#269783: Jul 6th 2021 at 3:27:21 PM

So there is something I noticed that we might need to do, we currently have the DC keepers under DC Universe but the thing is that the title is not what is used for the DC universe as a whole currently Creator.DC Universe is for the streaming service and Franchise.DC Universe is a redirect to Franchise.The DCU. Most example subpages for the DC Universe are listed under that title so it would make more sense for us to have the main page be Monster.The DCU.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#269784: Jul 6th 2021 at 3:34:41 PM

I wouldn't be opposed to making it DC Comics either (like we do for Marvel).

Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#269785: Jul 6th 2021 at 3:40:17 PM

That isn't standard across the rest of the site though a majority of the other subpages buts it under The DCU.

Though actually Marvel Universe is used the most often as well so that might be another one to change.

Edited by Ordeaux26 on Jul 6th 2021 at 3:44:10 AM

TellAll111 Since: Jun, 2010
#269786: Jul 6th 2021 at 3:43:35 PM

[tup] for the Belfast Leader, the Akunin leader, Magnitude, Siegbert, Master Mage, Yuji, Roseburg, Gehbert, and Munakata.

[tup] also for the Zombozo image and the Unalaq and Siciline rewrites.

[tdown] for Cadby for all reasons stated. There are CMs that have suffered comedically humiliating defeats, Steele, Trunchbull and Dag spring to mind, but they at least tend to be cathartic and satisfying, gorilla rape... isn't. I like the Ace Ventura movies, but they're the sort of comedies where the antagonist's comeuppance is somehow the least comedic aspect.

Cut Bernkastel.

Edited by TellAll111 on Jul 6th 2021 at 3:56:59 AM

Ravok Son of Liberty from Big Shell Since: Jun, 2015 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Son of Liberty
#269787: Jul 6th 2021 at 3:54:52 PM

I'm suffering some bad food poisoning folks so I won't be around much for the next day or two but until then, here's a proposal I had waiting to post before the roughness began. With all thanks to miraculous for suggesting this one to me, the comic miniseries Sherlock Holmes vs Harry Houdini.

Who is Rasputin? What has he done?

Ra-Ra-Rasputin, lover of the Russian queen!

A Russian mystic who believes that Russia should reign supreme over all the lands, Rasputin uses advanced hypnosis techniques in his scheme to punish London for its lack of artistic vision and hand in a Russian war defeat.

Rasputin hypnotizes a man to kill himself with an axe during a show by Harry Houdini as a mockery of Houdini's "magic." When Houdini refuses to cow in gear to Rasputin, Rasputin causes the glass ceiling of another of Houdini's shows to shatter and kill several people down below, wounding Houdini's wife Bess in the process. Rasputin then hypnotizes his own partner, Houdini's turncoat stage assistant, into killing himself by jumping from a rooftop.

Eventually hypnotizing Houdini and trying to force him to murder several of Sherlock's friends, Rasputin hypnotizes Sherlock to kill himself (he survives of course) and then reveals his master plan to use bombs and hypnosis to cause mass chaos, sending a massive street of London into death and destruction as he bombs the place and hypnotizes the crowd into believing it's wartime. For an extra sadistic kick, Rasputin reveals he's brought Houdini's wounded wife Bess to the middle of the chaos in her wheelchair and attached the last bomb to it.

Luckily, Rasputin's plans are thwarted and the man himself apparently killed in an explosion, however the ending implies he faked even this and still skulks about with new devious schemes...

Freudian Excuse or other redeeming features?

Nah, he claims to love Russia and want to put it on top but it's total fanatical insanity, he outright brags he murdered his favorite Russian composer, Tchaikovsky, because he "didn't love Russia enough", and the way he behaves it comes off as Knight Templar without any actual scenes of caring for fellow Russians or whatnot, just a psychotic "we're the best and most powerful, all the rest should cow to us."

Heinousness?

Multiple cases of Psychic-Assisted Suicide, kills several people with a shattered glass ceiling, then bombs a populated London street to kill and cause chaos to hundreds. Plus what he does to Houdini's wife is extra dickish.

Final Verdict?

Eyep to Rasputin, insert "In the Dark of the Night" joke here

No! That is NOT Solid Snake! Stop impersonating him!
ImperialMajestyXO Since: Nov, 2015
#269788: Jul 6th 2021 at 3:57:40 PM

[tup] to Rasputin the crazy good time party monk (I saw this description in a YouTube comment, and it's too good to not share)

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#269789: Jul 6th 2021 at 4:02:33 PM

[tup]Ra ra Rasputin

Sorry to hear about that ravok. Get better soon.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Enid Sinclair
#269790: Jul 6th 2021 at 4:02:38 PM

Yes to Rasputin.

Ravok: Sorry to hear that. Get better soon.

ACW: Both Batman: Arkham Series – Batman and Batman: Arkham Series – The Joker are now things.

Edited by Bullman on Jul 6th 2021 at 6:03:16 AM

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
CelestialDraco from Florissant, Missouri Since: Jan, 2014 Relationship Status: Singularity
#269791: Jul 6th 2021 at 4:03:45 PM

I'd like to know how many Complete Monsters a franchise needs to have its own page. Ratchet and Clank page have a total of 8, but from what I gathered I thought it was 9.

Edited by CelestialDraco on Jul 6th 2021 at 6:08:51 AM

Awesomekid42 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: It was only a kiss
#269792: Jul 6th 2021 at 4:07:41 PM

It varies, but I think 8 is fine. One Piece only got it's 9th CM a few weeks ago, but it's had a page for a while.

Edited by Awesomekid42 on Jul 6th 2021 at 7:07:54 AM

Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Enid Sinclair
#269793: Jul 6th 2021 at 4:09:19 PM

It varies. To my knowledge 8 is the bare minimum, but we try to take it case by case.

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#269794: Jul 6th 2021 at 4:12:08 PM

7 is the bare minimum actually but usually, we only make one for seven, under rare circumstances like if its spread out across three to four mediums or they are all part of a single show or video game (somehow), same with eight, if a franchise gets 9 then it gets a page basically always.

CelestialDraco from Florissant, Missouri Since: Jan, 2014 Relationship Status: Singularity
#269795: Jul 6th 2021 at 4:15:32 PM

OK, thanks for letting me know. And by the way, was there a write up for Zs'Skayr? Because last I checked it was blank on the Ben 10 page.

Also, [tup] Ra ra Rasputin.

Edited by CelestialDraco on Jul 6th 2021 at 6:17:53 AM

therealjackieboy from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
#269796: Jul 6th 2021 at 4:22:59 PM

[tup] Raz, and get better Ravok

It's Spooky Month!
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#269797: Jul 6th 2021 at 4:25:26 PM

[up][up] Not yet.

[up][up][up] Important note: The franchise has to have a work page. That's why Maciste doesn't have a CM page, despite having 10 entries.

Bullman: I'll take care of that stuff. I wondered how long it would take for that Joker to get a page.

Edited by ACW on Jul 6th 2021 at 7:26:01 AM

Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#269798: Jul 6th 2021 at 4:25:49 PM

Ben 10 technically has 9 Keepers with every incarnation of Vilgax taken separately, 10 if you count his main writeup as well.

[up] That as well.

Edited by Ordeaux26 on Jul 6th 2021 at 4:26:45 AM

Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#269799: Jul 6th 2021 at 4:28:53 PM

Though DC Literature, Marvel Literature and Marvel Video Games don't have a work page.

Edited by Ordeaux26 on Jul 6th 2021 at 4:29:19 AM

G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
The 47th President
#269800: Jul 6th 2021 at 4:28:56 PM

[tup] Wilheim Gehbert, Rasputin and Munakata.

Cut Bernkastel

My sandbox of EPs and other stuff

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