During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Dooku has like three zillion redeeming qualities no matter the continuity.
Also, let's start getting some writeups in. List is way too big.
For the moment:
- The Sorrows: Gabriel Blackwood, first appearing as an innocent boy adopted by the Blackwoods in the Sorrows, is in truth the sadistic god Pan. Affter having slaughtered most everyone in the region, Gabriel waits until the arrival of others at the Sorrows. Seducing the women there, Claire and Eva, Gabriel sleeps with both of them before violently raping Eva and mutilating her. Torturing and killing everything in the castle he can get his claws on, Gabriel later has his daughter with Claire returned to him and proceeds to massacre everyone who comes to the island, using their sins and guilt to torture them further when he can. Even taking control of one woman to kill the baby, Gabriel ends the novel possessing Ben's father in law to murder Ben's family for spite at being thwarted.
- The Book of Lost Things: The Crooked Man a being who achieves immortality by tricking a child in the real world into sacrificing someone they hate to him, usually a younger brother or sister. He feeds upon their heart and their life for as long as they would have lived, while the corrupted child is crowned king or queen of a world built out of their own nightmares, suffering as the Crooked Man glories in their anguish until they wither and die. and the Crooked Man goes looking for another child that's prepared to have their unwanted siblings horribly murdered, the fate that almost befalls 12 year old David as the Crooked Man tries to torment him into sacrificing his brother for the Crooked Man's benefit.
Edited by Lightysnake on May 11th 2021 at 1:25:32 AM
to Grevious.
to the Tortured One. (Story seems high quality but I swear there's a certain... offness to it)
What is the Work?
The first volume of Exiles is a Franchise/Marvel Comics series that lasted from 2001 to 2007, featuring the titular team as they hop from reality to reality correct whatever events went wrong, often fighting a myriad of adversaries, be they recognizable villains or twisted iterations of various heroes.
One of these foes is my candidate: the Spider.
Who is the Spider?
The Spider was an iteration of Peter Parker hailing from Earth-15, diverging from his 616 counterpart by way of being a red-headed, symbiote-wearing mass murderer, similar to Cletus Kasady. Although little is known of his life prior to his first appearance, he accumulated 67 consecutive life sentences throughout his criminal career.
Having been drafted by the Timebreakers onto the Weapon X team, the Spider aids them in restoring realities on the Timebreakers' orders, relishing in indulging in their violent and ruthless means of doing so. He is first seen killing Morlocks along with the rest of the team, all of whom meet up with the Exiles shortly afterwards. When both the Exiles and Weapon X are told that they must kill David Richards, who they immediately before freed in their previous mission, the Spider clashes with the Exiles along with the rest of Weapon X (minus Sabretooth), advocating for David's murder and gleefully admitting to wanting to kill not only the Exiles, but several other people as well. While on a mission to aid the Tony Stark of a reality where he became a dictator ruling over Earth, he takes its version of Wanda Maximoff hostage to enrage a Hulked-out Wonder-Man, and later refuses to save Hulk when she is pulled into the Negative Zone alongside Wonder-Man.
He derides the Exiles for their sense of morality before Storm dies and is replaced by the Hyperion of Earth-4023, later admitting to the rest of the team that he wants them to fail their missions so he can keep killing. Upon receiving word that Weapon X's next mission is to kill all mutants in the reality they are currently visiting, the Spider is delighted at the prospect of taking many mutant lives before he hears that there are only ten. When Hyperion refuses to complete the mission in favor of ruling the world, the Spider happily sides with him when he promises him that he can kill several humans to make up for not murdering the mutants. When Hyperion begins killing the occupants of Asteroid M, the Spider simply asks if he can start killing the rest of the mutants now before stabbing Vanisher through the heart, then jumping to another reality with the rest of the team to conquer it.
He later helps Hyperion and Ms. Marvel stop Firestar and Hulk from killing the former when they rebel, knocking them unconscious and ensnaring them with webbing. He watches Hyperion kill Hulk before moving in to try and finish off Firestar, who incinerates him with a heat blast that takes her own life as well. His body is returned to Earth-15 and buried in the prison cemetery.
Does he have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Although the Spider briefly muses that the Morlocks he killed deserved better, he never truly takes this sentiment to heart and continues to slaughter indiscriminately. He enjoys killing other people and willingly sided with the similarly-unstable Hyperion (who himself is already a CM) as long as it meant that he kept slaughtering others. He also has no Freudian Excuse for the carnage he wrought throughout the Multiverse.
Does he meet the Heinousness Standard?
As a member of Weapon X, he was naturally more unscrupulous and willing to kill than the Exiles. However, unlike most of the team, especially Sabretooth, he is far more sadistic and murder-happy and kills primarily For the Evulz. He is also complicit in willingly and gleefully aiding Hyperion in attempting to conquer various worlds in the Multiverse, pushing him both standards of heinousness.
Final Verdict?
Please post your opinions in the thread!
Edited by Pikamencer079 on May 11th 2021 at 3:01:04 AM
Leaning yes on Spider, but..."briefly muses that the Morlocks he killed deserved better" is still a standard.
EDIT: Whoa, so Exiles has given Adaptational Villainy to Peter Parker and Professor X.
Edited by ACW on May 11th 2021 at 5:59:33 AM

Based on what I read,
to Surtur.
When I read the part about Grevious killing Captain Tarpals, I went "Awww..." To me, that was actually really sad. I didn’t know that happened.
Yeah, from what I recall, Dooku totally has his beliefs and ideals.
Edited by futuremoviewriter on May 11th 2021 at 1:16:48 AM