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Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

MGD107 Since: Feb, 2015
#257951: Apr 26th 2021 at 4:42:36 PM

[tup] to Cassandra Berkley.

I'll go for a [tdown] to the Pulp Fiction Duo.

Um I'm leaning towards [tup] to Brand, but the works heinous standard sounds high and makes me concerned.

Ramidel Since: Jan, 2001
#257952: Apr 26th 2021 at 4:43:56 PM

[up][up][up][up] As Dood Slayer 136 said.

[up][up][up]Not really. He does confess to her, and she very kindly rejects him (again, she's out of his price range).

[up]The reason I considered Brand acceptable is that he's not a mage or a twisted Empath.

Edited by Ramidel on Apr 26th 2021 at 3:46:05 AM

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#257953: Apr 26th 2021 at 4:51:54 PM

Yea there.

I can fix up Ma'ar if nobody minds.

ASghhrv6ub Best Smile from Second star to the right. Since: Jun, 2020 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Ramidel Since: Jan, 2001
#257955: Apr 26th 2021 at 4:54:36 PM

[up][up]I don't have my copy of The Black Gryphon handy, so take it away.

STARCRUSHER99 The Moron from one of my unhealthy obsessions (Captain) Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The Moron
#257956: Apr 26th 2021 at 4:56:50 PM

Yes to Brand

So how much do we care about getting an image for the recent fan works subpages? If we do care, then does it have to be an image specifically tied to a fan work, or could it just be any fanart of a fic keeper - like, say, any fanmade image of Cinder?

Just wondering about the specifics here, cause if the fanart has to be tied to a specific work, the amount of RWBY pictures we can use is precisely zero

Edited by STARCRUSHER99 on Apr 26th 2021 at 10:15:31 AM

DoodSlayer136 It's Him from SAGE (Snick Amateur Game Expo) (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
It's Him
#257957: Apr 26th 2021 at 5:03:08 PM

In that case, [tup] to Brand.

Edited by DoodSlayer136 on Apr 26th 2021 at 5:04:36 AM

LargoQuagmire Since: Jan, 2010 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
#257958: Apr 26th 2021 at 5:04:56 PM

Abstain on Brand; the unapproved CM entries didn't really help me understand this world's heinousness standard, although I'd normally lean keep with someone with this rap sheet.

MGD107 Since: Feb, 2015
#257959: Apr 26th 2021 at 5:06:09 PM

Ramidel: Yeah fair enough, all the others have a lot more resources. Considering he's just a rogues rich guy, its probably bad enough. Switch to a definite [tup] then.

Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#257961: Apr 26th 2021 at 5:23:47 PM

[tup]Brand

G Uys. All four of them have been approved for years. Maar is like one of the worst villains you'll ever find In a high fantasy work for one.

Edited by miraculous on Apr 26th 2021 at 5:24:30 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Ramidel Since: Jan, 2001
#257962: Apr 26th 2021 at 5:26:53 PM

[up]They may have been overlooked for years, which isn't the same as approved - it looks like a series that was written up before we had this thread.

My concern is mainly that the Ma'ar example looks like a ZCE and needs fixing up (as well as the Well-Intentioned Extremist part dealt with - if it's true, which I don't remember it being, it kills the example).

STARCRUSHER99 The Moron from one of my unhealthy obsessions (Captain) Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The Moron
#257963: Apr 26th 2021 at 5:27:37 PM

Well not necessarily - you can start as a WIE and then suffer Motive Decay to still count

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#257964: Apr 26th 2021 at 5:31:59 PM

Uh peiters and Hadanelith look okay.

I do agree ancar and Ma'ar need rewrites

[up][up]Nope They were approved. Their ones by Fighteer. As in the guy who created this trope

Edited by miraculous on Apr 26th 2021 at 5:34:35 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Ramidel Since: Jan, 2001
#257965: Apr 26th 2021 at 5:44:39 PM

[up]...How is that even relevant? Fighteer is a mod but that doesn't mean he owns the trope.

And the Ma'ar example was written in 2013, before the modern standards for this trope were established, and by TV Rulez Again, not by Fighteer. And as I said, it's a mess. Which is why I said the examples needed a check - and you agree that Ma'ar and Ancar's examples are problematic.

Please don't try to shut down discussion because you disagree with it. For the record, I don't think that they need to be re-effortposted unless someone seriously disagrees with any of them (if Ma'ar proves to be a flawed example, we can re-examine him) but we do need a cleanup.

Edited by Ramidel on Apr 26th 2021 at 4:47:14 AM

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#257966: Apr 26th 2021 at 5:47:37 PM

I'll fix them up, just give me a bit.

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#257967: Apr 26th 2021 at 5:57:07 PM

Okay wasn't saying they didn't like at all. But they have been approved by the thread ?

Edited by miraculous on Apr 26th 2021 at 5:58:02 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#257969: Apr 26th 2021 at 5:58:41 PM

Okay....

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
ImperialMajestyXO Since: Nov, 2015
#257970: Apr 26th 2021 at 6:05:51 PM

Jeez, our standards for write-ups have evolved over the years, haven't they? [lol]

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#257971: Apr 26th 2021 at 6:07:15 PM

Uh hey a lot of old write-up sucked. It's just we usually rewrote them.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
RobertTYL Since: Oct, 2019 Relationship Status: Holding out for a hero
#257972: Apr 26th 2021 at 6:07:36 PM

Good morning, fellas, and... seems like Lighty had opened up a can of worms with Poison Ivy yesterday night, I presume. :|

[tup] to Gulnar, Jill, Cassandra, Brandy

DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#257974: Apr 26th 2021 at 6:11:22 PM

What is Mir even getting chewed out for? Yes to the candidate but nothing he said was hostile (or incorrect), you’re gonna wanna check that attitude.

ANewMan A total has-been. Since: Apr, 2013 Relationship Status: Don't hug me; I'm scared
A total has-been.
#257975: Apr 26th 2021 at 6:48:29 PM

[up][up][up] The Ivy proposal didn't create that much of a stir. It's more the Pulp Fiction candidates and other stuff that's being discussed.

And how about that unapproved entry I brought up at comment-257924?


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