During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Bats and Frieza.
Ivy...now, I only saw that movie once, in theaters (what they did to Bane is still unforgivable), but..."It's never so much as hinted her mind is affected. Her body is replaced like a plant and...she promptly goes loco with power"...wouldn't that seem to imply that her mind WAS affected?
Ivy
My condolences that you had to sit through that. And I had the displeasure of watching Suicide Squad.
I have watched the film and I remember that it was really bad.
My only possible issue with Poison Ivy is that if I remember correctly, there is some indication that she has feelings for Mr. Freeze. She manipulates him and lies to him about his wife but the reason why she kills her is because she is jealous of her and she wants to rule the world along with Freeze. Aside from that, when we last see her in her cell, she plucks out the petals of a flower and says "he loves me/loves me not".
It's been a long time since I have watched the movie and I don't plan to ever revisit it (for obvious reasons), so, is there some evidence in the film that she doesn't have any feelings for Freeze? The fact that she is manipulative doesn't mean that she doesn't have any feelings for Freeze.
And
to yet another version of Frieza.
It is possible that she was influenced by the toxin considering the rapid change of her behaviour after she emerges as Posion Ivy. However, as Lighty said, there is nothing in the movie to indicate that she is not in control of her actions aside from her rapid change in behaviour and in cases like that we tend to assume that the villain is in control of their own actions. We have a case like that with Doctor Doom from the 2015 film. So, I don't think that her Moral Agency is a problem.
Yeah.
Edited by WatTambor on Apr 26th 2021 at 3:58:10 AM
I'm more concerned about if she WASN'T in fact influenced by the venom or whatever.
Oh, one of those cases of "assume agency unless evidence shows otherwise"?
BTW, I say give MLP and RWBY fan works their own pages for now (that makes up about 1/5 of the page), and worry about video games later when needed. BTW, that image won't work, as it's from a crossover.
Edited by ACW on Apr 26th 2021 at 6:31:31 AM
A quote.
Bob Page: Why contain it? Let it spill over the schools and churches, let the bodies pile up in the streets. In the end they'll beg us to save them.
Writeups for XIII keepers:
XIII:
Number I aka Wally Sheridan is the leader of "The XX", who plans to take over US and turn it into totalitarien state. To this end he has his brother, the current president of the US William Sheridan assasinated by the titular XIII and then also has the assasin himself killed. Upon learning that someone assumed XIII's identity, Wally ordered him to be hunted down, which led to the death of dozens of people. Planning to take over the country during the operation "Total Red", Wally intended to use his SPADS to slaughter the personel in the key military facilites of the US, after which he intends to declare the martial law.
Number II aka Calvin Wax poses as a counselor to the President Galbrain, while in reality he happily goes along with Number I's plan to turn America into totalitarian state. Organizing the hunt after the XIII impostor, sending SPADS to massacre anyone, he suspects might ally with the false XIII. Leading the invasion on the key facility, where the operation "Total Red" took place, and posing as the Number I, Calvin decided to activate the self-destruct sequence, which threatened to kill off any survivors in the facility and everyone around it, while the true Number I was still inside the base, simply out of spite to the false XIII for beating him.
Number XX aka Dr. Johansson is the head of the asylum, where he regularly tortures dozens of innocent people to the point of insanity, where they can't say anything coherent and scream from their pain. Happily torturing anyone "The XX" sends to him as a prisoner, Johansson also allows his guards to constantly beat his prisoners to near death. When the false XIII escaped from his cage, he reaches Johansson's office, where he hears him torturing one of his prisoners with a drill and discovers that he also locked one of his nurses in a cell with a dangerously insane patient.

Switching to
to Ivy then.