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Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

SumDumNerd LOCKDOWN PROCEDURES ENGAGED from [REDACTED] Since: May, 2017 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
VeryVileVillian Since: Dec, 2017
FriedWarthog Since: Jun, 2014 Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
#253679: Mar 26th 2021 at 11:18:56 PM

Aw man, right when I finally started watching the cartoon so I could effortpost him, too.

Still, I definitely agree with him counting: yes to M. Bison! I don't know if this could count as a proper Complete Monster quote or not, but I have him to thank for giving me one of my favorite villain quotes: "Yes, yes, I killed your father! What is IS it with you women, anyway?! I killed my father too, and you don't hear me WHINING ABOUT IT!"

Edited by FriedWarthog on Mar 26th 2021 at 11:22:16 AM

therealjackieboy from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
#253680: Mar 26th 2021 at 11:25:08 PM

Hey guys, late night rewrite time. Just want to discuss one of my favorite guilty pleasures that I watched during my high school AV class cuz I had nothing else to do tongue.

That guilty pleasure is The Returner, the 2002 movie that’s so derivate, it’s almost original. Plus, the soundtrack rocks. Hell, I even bought the DVD for $5 a few years ago at my nearby video store. While the film’s villain, Mizoguchi, is a definite keeper, I feel his writeup could use some work.

Original: Mizoguchi is an insane and violent gang boss who steals children to harvest their organs. This is the fate that befell the best friend of the film's hero when they were kids. Seeking absolute power to Take Over the World, Mizoguchi kills any who get in his way. With a Hair-Trigger Temper and a sense of sadism, Mizoguchi rarely leaves anyone standing and eventually has his allies slaughtered so he won't have to share power, telling his Triad ally that being forced to speak Chinese was a humiliation before shooting him in the face.

I feel the writeup prefers talking about his sadism more than his biggest crime: knowingly attempting to kickstart a war between aliens and humanity by killing an alien baby, all for the sake of fun and profit. So allow me to add that, while trimming away a lot of fat.

Rewrite: Mizoguchi is an insane and violent Yakuza boss who steals children to harvest their organs. Having done so to hero Miyamoto’s childhood friend, Mizoguchi partners with the Triads to gain absolute power and world domination. Killing anyone who gets in his way, including his own men, Mizoguchi betrays his allies and attempts to kickstart a war between the Daggra aliens and mankind by killing a Daggra baby, all for the sake of fun and profit.

Edited by therealjackieboy on Mar 26th 2021 at 11:42:23 AM

It's Spooky Month!
CloisterTheStupid from Oop North Since: Jan, 2019 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#253682: Mar 27th 2021 at 1:04:16 AM

[tup]Bison.

Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#253683: Mar 27th 2021 at 2:35:28 AM

Yes to Bison. Even without the omnicidal mania, he seems to go enough beyond generic villainy for an animated villain. Another for Richard Newman.

Also, please add the rewrites to the Drafts.

Edited by ACW on Mar 27th 2021 at 6:00:47 AM

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#253684: Mar 27th 2021 at 2:40:58 AM

So I found this well browsingbcrom Asian Saga. Anyone want to expand ?

  • Complete Monster: Most of the books of the Asian Saga heavily feature a Gray-and-Gray Morality, and the majority of the antagonists are well rounded and semi-sympathetic, but Gorth from Tai-Pan is one of the exceptions, being a brutal sexual sadist who, unlike his father, has no sense of honour whatsoever. Gorth enjoys hurting or assaulting others and clearly enjoys their pain. In order to hurt his enemy of the Struan family, he tries arranging for his son to be drugged and bedded by a prostitute with syphilis which was completely incurable in those days and a very, very horrible way to go.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
RK93 Since: Aug, 2020
#253685: Mar 27th 2021 at 3:19:02 AM

I suggest some slight changes to Afton (I know, again). Mainly adding a bit more into his evil and a update given that he apparently didn't die during FFPS and it's not confirmed he tried to corrupt Elizabeth.

From:

  • William Afton is the man responsible for all the horror in the series. A serial killer, he murdered several children, and was apathetic when their spirits possessed the animatronics and became revenge-seeking monstrosities. In Sister Location, he is revealed to be the CEO of Afton Robotics, a position he used to create animatronics to abduct and murder children, with his daughter accidentally being among the victims. Sending his own son, Michael, to a facility where he constantly tortures and dismantles his sapient robots, resulting in Michael's painful death and resurrection as a revenge seeking zombie. He also planned to corrupt his daughter into becoming a killer herself and, after his own death, returns as Springtrap, eager to keep killing. Even after being burned to death, he returns once again to haunt a VR game and terrorize its beta testers.

To:

  • William Afton is the man responsible for all the horror in the series. A serial killer, he murdered several children, one the daughter of his best friend, and was apathetic when their spirits possessed the animatronics of Freddy Fazbear's Pizza and became revenge-seeking monstrosities. At the same time, he owned a company called Afton Robotics, where he created child-murdering animatronics, with his daughter Elizabeth accidentally becoming a victim. Afton sends his own son, Michael, to the facility where he constantly tortures and dismantles those robots, one of them being possessed by Elizabeth, resulting in Michael's painful death and resurrection as a zombie seeking to find him. After a painful death, William returns as Springtrap thirty years later, eager to keep killing. Even after being burned alive and tortured in his dreams, his soul escapes his body to haunt a VR game and terrorize its beta testers, driving one to suicide while forcing another into being a follower that will murder children for him.

Edited by RK93 on Mar 27th 2021 at 2:34:58 PM

falcontalons from Earth-2 Since: Apr, 2019
DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
VenomousSeal (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#253688: Mar 27th 2021 at 4:51:37 AM

@ACW admittedly, Haavik’s record of destroying planets is mostly a Take Our Word for It. In the end, he gets off Scot free and moves on to his next planet, having realised he’s not going to be able to destroy Earth.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#253689: Mar 27th 2021 at 4:56:22 AM

Hmm, sounds like it's mainly Offscreen Villainy, but if he attempts to destroy Earth, and takes actual concrete steps, he still may count, if only barely.

TellAll111 Since: Jun, 2010
DoodSlayer136 It's Him from SAGE (Snick Amateur Game Expo) (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
It's Him
#253691: Mar 27th 2021 at 6:06:50 AM

[tup] to M. Bison.

Y'all took all the best memessad

Edited by DoodSlayer136 on Mar 27th 2021 at 6:10:22 AM

Beast from Ontario, Canada Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#253692: Mar 27th 2021 at 6:26:15 AM

@RK: Think you can take it easy on the Afton rewrites ? I recall weeks ago they were rewritten on here throughout a whole day.

Anyways, yes to Bison and Bison.

"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
RK93 Since: Aug, 2020
#253693: Mar 27th 2021 at 6:33:19 AM

[up] Don't worry, this is the last time I'll touch Game-Afton (until Security Breach)

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#253694: Mar 27th 2021 at 6:48:59 AM

Took a bit of work, but I've redone the Fire Emblem page.

k410ren Since: Jan, 2016
#253695: Mar 27th 2021 at 6:49:50 AM

Would this work for Ming the Merciless (the 1980 version)?

Ming: Klytus, I'm bored. What plaything can you offer me today?
Klytus: An obscure body in the SK system. The inhabitants refer it to as Earth.
Ming: How peaceful it looks. [causes an earthquake]
Klytus: Most effective, your majesty. Will you destroy this Earth?
Ming: Later. I like to play with things... before destruction. [summons a storm of hot hail]

Edited by k410ren on Mar 27th 2021 at 9:53:31 AM

"I'll show you the Dark Side." CM actors and kills
G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
papyru30 from Colorado for summer break Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
#253698: Mar 27th 2021 at 7:09:06 AM

I'm saying no to the Afton Rewrite, none of the changes add any pertinent crimes or information aside from the bit about creating a follower which I've explained to the thread more than once is based on promotional stuff for Security Breach and so shouldn't be mentioned until two weeks after the game's release.

RK93 Since: Aug, 2020
#253699: Mar 27th 2021 at 7:14:47 AM

Curse of Dreadbear, which is part of Help Wanted, already establishes that Afton has a follower

nwotyzal Since: Sep, 2019
#253700: Mar 27th 2021 at 7:31:27 AM

[tup]M. Bison

@mir that is approved, but it sure as hell needs to be rewritten


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