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Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

captainmarkle Limited Patients from Behind you Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
#251101: Mar 8th 2021 at 5:20:52 AM

[tup] Stanley, Haman, Kingsley and Adam, I'll say yeah to Norvik as well if the show's latest arc is on a mid season pause.

Trans rights are human rights. If you don't think that, please leave.
nwotyzal Since: Sep, 2019
#251102: Mar 8th 2021 at 6:55:46 AM

Quick question, didn’t we have a video of Cioccolata? I don’t think I was around when it was cut.

Beast from Ontario, Canada Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#251103: Mar 8th 2021 at 6:57:37 AM

I'm leaning no to Norvik for now, if the fic is still ongoing.

There's also something I wanted to bring up yesterday but never got around too.

Animated!Graydon Creed from X Men 90's cartoon. I'm just looking back and wondering if his Freudian Excuse does hold up ?

It's just, he was raised by Sabretooth who in addition to being a CM himself, is all but directly spelled out to be an Abusive Parent (and also heavily implied to end up killing Graydon). Now yes, they do play Graydon off as a loathable Hate Sink villain, and his past clearly doesn't justify turning into a genocidal megalomaniac, who tries to kill otherwise innocent mutants and even his own family, nor is his implied abusive past really played for sympathy.

My question here is, if whatever past trauma Graydon had is ultimately disqualifying as it's shown that having Sabretooth as a dad clearly affected him on a psychological level - he get's increasingly nervous when his father is even eluded too, and then there's his whole panic induced Villainous Breakdown at the mere sight of Sabretooth's holographic image, which was bad enough that his final appearance revealed he was checked into a psyche clinic for months.

I don't know, I just want to know if this was brought up when Graydon was first discussed.

Edited by Beast on Mar 8th 2021 at 7:00:28 AM

"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#251104: Mar 8th 2021 at 7:02:49 AM

No, it's not enough to disqualify him here and Graydon's breakdown is more being exposed as the son of a mutant I should note

STARCRUSHER99 The Moron from one of my unhealthy obsessions (Captain) Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The Moron
#251105: Mar 8th 2021 at 7:13:44 AM

I will say that that RWBY fic hasn't been updated since last June - even if it is not a Dead Fic altogether, it's been long enough for me to say yes to Norvik.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#251106: Mar 8th 2021 at 8:42:52 AM

Can we discuss why people are voting yes to Stanley but no to Charlie? They both have about the same number of kills, and while Stanley's may be a bit more brutal, Charlie has the cruel abuse of his own brother.

nwotyzal Since: Sep, 2019
#251107: Mar 8th 2021 at 8:47:44 AM

Honestly leaning a slight [tup] to Charlie

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#251108: Mar 8th 2021 at 9:00:54 AM

I've already explained myself ACW. I dislike these "Omg no one is explaining their reasoning, why?!" posts when I've laid it all out and then someone acts like I was just like "No because lol"

Stanley operates in an immensely condensed window, that is the only reason I'm saying yes, as I made quite clear several times over now.

Edited by 43110 on Mar 8th 2021 at 12:04:02 PM

SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#251109: Mar 8th 2021 at 9:06:28 AM

I'm abstaining because 1. I am unfamiliar with the work, and 2. I have a hard time gauging heinousness accordingly.

Sorry if I didn't clarify that before.

Abstain on Norvick.

Edited by SkyCat32 on Mar 8th 2021 at 1:10:53 PM

MGD107 Since: Feb, 2015
#251110: Mar 8th 2021 at 9:28:37 AM

Now as I've said before I have no issues accepting Charlie doesn't count.

But if anyone else has any more questions about the shows heinous standard I'm happy to clear it up. Sorry if I haven't done so so far.

RK93 Since: Aug, 2020
#251111: Mar 8th 2021 at 9:34:51 AM

So, uh, any opinion on the Five Nights at Freddy's: Fazbear Frights version of William Afton? Not gonna propose him just yet as it wasn't two weeks since The Cliffs and Friendly Face might go deeper into him, but I want to hear some opinions anyway.

SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#251112: Mar 8th 2021 at 9:38:05 AM

[up] If it hasn't been two weeks, please hold off.

[down][down] I think that was already approved.

Edited by SkyCat32 on Mar 8th 2021 at 12:41:07 PM

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#251113: Mar 8th 2021 at 9:39:13 AM

That's something you'd talk about via PM, not on the public thread.

beeruckzII Since: Aug, 2011
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#251116: Mar 8th 2021 at 9:41:16 AM

In case I wasn't clear, yes to the image.

nwotyzal Since: Sep, 2019
#251117: Mar 8th 2021 at 9:44:50 AM

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#251118: Mar 8th 2021 at 9:52:37 AM

Drafts please; it'll go next week. Music, right?

SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#251119: Mar 8th 2021 at 9:53:07 AM

[up][up] That's a lot of potholes.

[up] According to an ATT link I posted, yes.

Edited by SkyCat32 on Mar 8th 2021 at 12:58:18 PM

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#251120: Mar 8th 2021 at 9:55:34 AM

ACW as you were the one demanding people expand on their reasoning: are you accepting the verdict on Charlie? You’ve gone from telling us we need to elaborate (or in my case restate) why we said no and now you’re just jumping to a new topic. Is this something you’re able to move on from or are you going to be coming back to it again?

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#251121: Mar 8th 2021 at 9:56:46 AM

I'm not too happy about it, but I've explained why I think he's a yes, and if nobody changes their mind, then so be it, I've done all I could do. Goodness knows it's not the first (and likely won't be the last) time I've disagreed with the majority.

[down] Yeah, I probably went too far there. Apologies.

Edited by ACW on Mar 8th 2021 at 1:11:12 PM

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#251122: Mar 8th 2021 at 10:02:03 AM

And that's fine, what's not is "Everybody stop, even though you explained why you're saying no I didn't read or don't like your reasons, think about it again!"

TellAll111 Since: Jun, 2010
#251123: Mar 8th 2021 at 10:02:46 AM

[tup] for Haman, Kingsley and Adam.

Tentative [tdown] for Charlie. Midsommer Murders is on the "to-watch" list, so judging from the EP, he's close in terms of heinousness, but not quite there.

Abstain on Norvick if the fic is ongoing.

papyru30 from Colorado for summer break Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
#251124: Mar 8th 2021 at 10:10:04 AM

yes to Norvick and the Luca image

AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#251125: Mar 8th 2021 at 10:12:21 AM

[tup] Adam, Haman, Norvick (since it looks like a Dead Fic).


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