During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
That it was - I can't find evidence that Nathaniel was definitively discussed, but from what I can gather he was also shot down preemptively for caring for his father. It seems like it was one of those "literally one line disqualifies them" moments.
Edited by STARCRUSHER99 on Mar 2nd 2021 at 3:17:04 PM
@Emerald SIGH. Yes he was. It was determined Nathaniel’s throwaway line while using his powers on Deke (after torturing him for information) to knock him out ("That’s for my old man!") was deemed an indication that he cared about his father.
@mir Oh heinousness totally wasn’t an issue. It was just that one line that did him in. He otherwise would’ve been an easy keeper no matter how unremarkable character-wise.
@STAR Yes, that link was to a discussion on Gideon Malick nearly five years ago. Haha. Oh well.
Edited by futuremoviewriter on Mar 2nd 2021 at 12:18:38 PM
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I would declare S7 as my favorite had Whitehall been the villain.
Nathaniel's actor at least does a good job at scumbag. I remember seeing a comment on his appearance on The Mandalorian that perfectly sums it up: "I know that voice! I hate that voice!"
Edited by EmeraldEmperor on Mar 2nd 2021 at 12:22:59 PM
I totally forgot he was in The Mandalorian and yeah, someone with a way more interesting onscreen character doing the things Nathaniel did would’ve been amazing, especially if it had been Whitehall.
It goes to show that whether or not a character keeps for this, their villainy can be incredibly ripe while their character itself is still BS.
Edited by futuremoviewriter on Mar 2nd 2021 at 12:28:45 PM
So uh Tsugumomo is probably on the way out for failing the P5. (The manga at least. The anime was determined to be okay)
So what do we do with the cm entry (where is it from?).
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."I found the original EP
(fairly recent one too). It's from the manga and it looks like there's no anime equivalent character, so it might have to go.
P5 discussion starts here
. Main issue seems to be a lot of underage sex and sex with underage looking characters that the anime ages up, plus it apparently becomes just straight porn later on.
Edited by STARCRUSHER99 on Mar 2nd 2021 at 3:43:10 PM
Where's the P5 discussion? And out of curiosity, what does it have that makes it inappropriate (assuming the P5 aren't being Bluenose Bowdlerizers)?
I'll stop now. I got into trying to do it after Mysterio got a quote because then I thought all 5 of the Complete Monster villains can now have one on the main quotes page, but now I realize he has one on the MCU's own page and that is good enough.
Edited by Dvaderstarlord5 on Mar 2nd 2021 at 2:00:34 AM

I think that's Gideon.