During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
My previous post just got ignored, but I am convinced it is worth discussing even if we disagree, so I’ll send a link to that post so that you can see what I had brought up earlier on.
Regarding creating a page for non-MCU Marvel films; while I'm not against the idea, I think we should wait a bit before we start making a page.
For example, Morbius 2020 is set to be a tie-in for the MCU, as well as being set in the same continuity as Venom (2018). So, does that mean Carlton Drake and Riot will be moved to the MCU page or the non-MCU page?
I'd rather wait a bit to see how stuff like this pans out. It'll save some busy work in the future.
Mmm....I suppose I'll throw in a late 'cut' to Aerys as well. The attitudes of some Tropers during the whole debacle did no favors, but Aerys himself seems a cut.
Handy 'Yes' to Sionis and Zsasz, criminally underused villains, those. Glad to see mah boy Ewan kicked ass in the role. I myself will have a version of a very much not underused Batman vilain to discuss when the allotted time has passed.
And condolences to you, Bullman, I'm terribly sorry to hear about that and I hope things get better for you soon!
Edited by Ravok on Feb 20th 2020 at 10:52:19 AM
No! That is NOT Solid Snake! Stop impersonating him!
Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button
to Birds of Prey duo, even though I personally was not a fan of the movie. (Suicide Squad was better.) Kinda was that we are getting rid of the Mad King but letting these two bozos up instead.
As for body count, basically every one of the Cat’s victims is also attributable to the Rabbit, with the exception of Allen himself. The main difference is that Cheshire is the one directly tormenting the kids, while Rabbit is more on the sidelines. That being said, I really would like if someone can go through the story and see for themselves, but I, to quote a commonly said line, will not lose any sleep if the White Rabbit is downvoted.
Edited by MasterN on Feb 20th 2020 at 9:59:59 AM
One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.
Birds of Prey duo, though Black Mask does fall into the Laughably Evil category at times.
Edited by LordYAM on Feb 20th 2020 at 10:05:19 AM
Yeah, N, even overlooking the 'someone else check this out for me to verify they count', I don't think anyone takes kindly to the sentiment of "I can't believe we're cutting this guy but letting these two bozos up". This isn't about quality of writing or anything but whether characters meet the standards for this trope. If you have an issue with the "two bozos" in question counting as Complete Monster(s), then please, weigh in on why you think they don't count instead of snidely commenting your displeasure that they're getting put up while someone else is going down, as if one is in response to the other.
Edited by Ravok on Feb 20th 2020 at 10:40:32 AM
No! That is NOT Solid Snake! Stop impersonating him!
Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button
Sorry. Please ignore both those statements. And my EP that I was not even very confident in and just put up to get it out of the way. And my chronic inability to keep my mouth shut.
Edited by MasterN on Feb 20th 2020 at 11:45:54 AM
One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.
You're fine, it was just an innocent mistake. At the risk of starting another argument, this is a thread we're all on for fun discussing fictional villains and there's really no need to personally pile on someone, if you're offended by someone's comment there are a lot better ways to communicate it than 5 people jumping on him in unison.
Its great to try and assure other tropers, but its a little rude to accuse people of "piling" or "Jumping" on them simply because they shared a criticism
No one was disrespectful in giving there points from what I can see.
Edited by Kylotrope on Feb 20th 2020 at 9:56:15 AM
Things are really about to get Fun around here
It's not so much as specific people being disrespectful as the effect of 5 people correcting him for a minor mistake at once, but I will try to be more careful with my words in the future. In general I just think correcting people for minor things like poor word choice is a very slippery slope that leads to a lot of pointless hurt feelings, from experience.
Edited by WaryHoglet on Feb 21st 2020 at 12:01:03 PM
Honestly, I think I give a
to Black Mask and Zsasz. Their Villainous Friendship seemed genuine to me.
"Roman displays zero concern for Zsasz when the girls emerge from a building where Zsasz went in to kill them. Absolutely none."
Well, Harley said that he'll surely want to kill Huntress for having murdered his BFF, and he indeed tried to kill her along with the others, so there's that...

BOP duo. Knew these two were gonna count.
It's Spooky Month!