During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Sure to Crainiac.
@ lukaSylvie As for me, my measuring stick for depravity is none other than the Warlord. The guy's body count reaches the trillions. That said, in terms of an absolutely despicable monster? Kenta Ayatsuri. Full stop. You'd think you'd get hit by Darkness-Induced Audience Apathy when re-reading the fanfic, but Kenta only stands out as even more despicable. Just the lasting effect on the children he brainwashed (and unlike the child prostitution? It's on-screen), tyke-bombs and prostitutes would make you wish he put them in an And I Must Scream situation instead.
Edited by GeorgieEnkoom on Jul 29th 2019 at 4:29:06 PM
J’m’arrête pas tant qu’j’vois pas des lignes sur les moniteurs (Not stoppin 'til I see Flatlines)I'm not voting on God (even a fictional portrayal) because I fear the Allmighty. I will vote
on Satan though.
Also, this would be his 36th incarnation, I believe. He's once again beaten the Joker. I think it might be permanent this time. Barring fan works, I believe we've exhausted (current) media of Joker incarnations. I searched hard to find the latest video game example, and I think there's only one or two more incarnations from other media that could count. There is the version from Batman Live, and in Batman: Digital Justice there is a sentient AI called the Joker Virus which was created by Joker to continue his legacy after he died of old age. I'm not sure if the latter would really count as an iteration anyway since it's not Joker himself but an AI he created, the same way I don't consider those two clones of Hitler from that one comic as iterations of him since they're not the real Hitler, just clones of him. Unless there's a goldmine of fan works out there, it looks like Satan is taking the crown for good.
jjj@bobg I'll be honest that it might just me having an unpopular opinion but yeah... It feels kind of stale on having a lot of incarnations of Joker as a Complete Monster. I mean, its kind of understandable as he is the Agent of Chaos and Batman's most iconic villain after all. But yeah, I honestly feel kind of worn out about Joker getting another CM treatment.
However, even if it feels kind of worn out, I'll admit that the more I see Joker CM incarnation, the more I appreciate some people that tried to have a different take on Joker such as the Telltale Games one where he is portrayed as a truly nice guy who wanted to learn good things or the Killing Joke one
Edited by ElfenLiedFan90 on Jul 29th 2019 at 9:32:59 PM
"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
God, Satan, Jack, Mengele, Spacek and Crainiac
- SS Doomtrooper: Dr. Ullman is a geneticist making super soldiers for the Third Reich. To do so, he painfully experiments on dozens of people and animals, shooting down 17 Allied planes to protect his operation and eventually siccing his Doomtrooper on the French Resistance when he succeeds. When Captain Jerry Malloy is tasked with leading a covert operation to stop Ullman, he unleashes his monster obce again, not caring when it massacres his fellow German soldiers. His boss tries to shut the experiments down, so he kills him and has several soldiers strapped down to become more Doomtroopers, ordering the previous one to slaughter the entire base when he's thwarted.
Edited by DemonDuckofDoom on Jul 29th 2019 at 7:42:44 AM
I'm gonna have to say yes to God and Satan. I still remember reading that arc. They made for some of the nastiest examples of Enfant Terrible this side of Luke Lerner.
Speaking of Spawn, I'm thinking of proposing Norse Spawn, but I'll have to reread the one-shot.
Everyone since my last post
Also, I added the Gralo rewrite to the Drafts
Edited by KingofNightmares on Jul 29th 2019 at 8:50:09 AM
"It was the best of times, it was the BLURST of times?"
Crainiac.
I'm glad to hear many answers about which Complete Monster is your measuring stick for depravity. I don't know many of them, but I'm also glad that one user shares their character of choice with me. I would like to talk about that character further.
@Iuka Sylvie I still have more but for now... Yeah
Also, welcome aboard Delphine!
Edited by ElfenLiedFan90 on Jul 30th 2019 at 12:00:45 AM
"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."

Edited by Overlord on Jul 29th 2019 at 7:12:27 AM