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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#161901: May 7th 2019 at 11:10:48 PM

Lasombra is mostly a generic bad guy. He is an extreme case of a Bad Boss, but is otherwise generic in his actions.

But, still, bury the discussion. He was evaluated, deemed not to count for this trope, the end. Let it rest. Do not resurrect old discussions if there is not anything new to present.

Edited by AustinDR on May 7th 2019 at 11:12:40 AM

futuremoviewriter Since: Jun, 2014
#161902: May 7th 2019 at 11:19:46 PM

I think Lasombra is worse and I still think he counts, but I will accept that he doesn't count. The End.

In my defense, Scheck had never been discussed before, but that didn't mean it was necessary. I'm sorry.

Edited by futuremoviewriter on May 7th 2019 at 11:24:46 AM

Awesomekid42 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: It was only a kiss
#161903: May 7th 2019 at 11:34:56 PM

I noticed that The Clown from Dead by Daylight has been re-added. I thought he was cut for not being heinous enough to stand out?

crankers Since: Mar, 2014
#161904: May 7th 2019 at 11:57:47 PM

I know It's a bit late but I have to ask one question about Kronika. Is there anything about the arcade endings that might effect her? I think I remember Some people resurrecting her in some endings and her helping out as a thanks for not keeping her dead.

futuremoviewriter Since: Jun, 2014
#161905: May 8th 2019 at 12:28:25 AM

[up]Well that’s an interesting twist.

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#161906: May 8th 2019 at 12:46:53 AM

[tup]Boswer and basatrda

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#161907: May 8th 2019 at 12:52:31 AM

[tup] Bowser. I too am unsure if it's beyond standard fantasy villainy, but it's Bowser, so that alone is enough for me to give a yes.

Unsure on the bastard. I know we have a few keepers with only one victim, but I'm unsure if this QUITE rises to that level.

65: It'll be with this week's batch.

As for Kronika, correct me if I'm wrong, but I think usually we ignore arcade endings, since they're non-canon. Otherwise, we'd probably have to include Injustice 2!Scarecrow, who pulls a MASSIVE Playing with Syringes.

Edited by ACW on May 8th 2019 at 3:58:45 PM

ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#161908: May 8th 2019 at 1:55:46 AM

Sure to candidate I missed

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
CloisterTheStupid from Oop North Since: Jan, 2019 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
#161909: May 8th 2019 at 2:12:18 AM

[tup] to those I've missed (except Scheck, obviously).

UltimateDemonBeast65 Since: Feb, 2018
#161910: May 8th 2019 at 2:26:30 AM

The only thing the arcade endings really confirm or are canon is the Titans and how they have been manipulating events. It also confirms that Lovecraftian gods exists.

I'm also pretty sure they confirm that all the Arcade Endings are canon, but as part of timelines Kronika had created and reset.

Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Enid Sinclair
#161911: May 8th 2019 at 2:31:59 AM

Yes to Bowser and Bastard.

No to Lasombra.

Edited by Bullman on May 8th 2019 at 5:01:22 AM

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
PolarPhantom Since: Jun, 2012
#161912: May 8th 2019 at 3:13:21 AM

[tup] The Bastard.

I still haven't done all the endings, but I'll check some out and report back, but it may not be mitigating to Kronika. I mean, if they revive her it would be in her favour to keep on their good side in case she needs help again.

MGD107 Since: Feb, 2015
TheImmortalAngelNewton The MILF Virus Since: Aug, 2015 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The MILF Virus
#161915: May 8th 2019 at 4:38:25 AM

[tup] To everyone I missed.

As someone who checked Mortal Kombat 11 to, have you ever considered Frost or D'Vorah? They're pretty bad to, and it's not like we can compare them to Kronika who herself is an omnipotent being of time. Especially Frost with the Cyber-Initiative which unlike the original one with Sektor, this was completely done without consent, and is force for each cyborg. Mind you it involves a brutal process of getting rip to shred, and then having your entire will remove and be controlled by Frost and she only did this because she was too impatient to become the next grandmaster which she was going to be anyway.

Allow me, take my hand and never let go, promise? - Giselle
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#161916: May 8th 2019 at 4:52:29 AM

Hmm, Frost seems to occupy a unique niche, different from Kronika or the current quartet. Lighty?

Michealthehero21 Since: Jan, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#161917: May 8th 2019 at 5:23:08 AM

Hey guys, I think I found a video game series that could have an potential candidate, but first I have to ask, was anyone from the Okami’s games ever discussed. Because I can take a look to see who counts if that’s alright with everyone.

Silverblade2 Since: Jan, 2013
#161918: May 8th 2019 at 5:34:38 AM

Okami is one of my favorite games. I've seriously considered Kyubi/Ninetails but I'm not sure if he's sufficiently heinous. Orochi had a few comedic moments IIRC. I considered revisiting Akuro from the sequel who was listed at one point but it looks like he's Made of Evil.

Edited by Silverblade2 on May 8th 2019 at 2:41:27 PM

Michealthehero21 Since: Jan, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#161919: May 8th 2019 at 5:50:47 AM

I can see what I can find about Ninetails, but yeah, there’s a possibility that Akuro’s made of evil. Then again, Mephilies was a part of Solaris, and he had moral agency, so who knows.

Edited by Michealthehero21 on May 8th 2019 at 5:51:08 AM

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#161920: May 8th 2019 at 5:51:55 AM

TV Image needs more votes. Looks like the Dexter one is winning so far.

Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Libraryseraph uu~ from Canada (Handed A Sword) Relationship Status: Raising My Lily Rank With You
uu~
#161922: May 8th 2019 at 6:24:10 AM

I'd be interested in a Kyubi effortpost

HAPPY HALLOWEEN FOR MARIA
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#161923: May 8th 2019 at 6:29:55 AM

I'll work on them later today, but these entries need SERIOUS de-potholing (unless someone wants to trim the entries and start from scratch; I think Joker's at least, is fine):

  • Batman: The Animated Series: The Joker is the only supervillain of Batman's rogues gallery who possesses no sympathetic or redeeming qualities whatsoever. Before becoming a supervillain, the Joker was a mobster and hit man who murdered Carl Beaumont, the father of Andrea, over money owed to his employers. He committed this murder even after the debt was repaid. This set in motion Andrea becoming the supervillain Phantasm and took away Batman’s one chance of a normal, happy life. Following his transformation into the Axe-Crazy Joker, he now commits crimes more often For the Evulz than he does for any profit. Samples of his crimes include repeatedly abusing his girlfriend Harley Quinn, trying to bomb a child’s birthday party, setting up Catwoman to go through a grinder, psychologically tormenting Charlie Collins for two years, murdering countless people with Joker venom, attempting to drive 70 million people insane by having Ace Mind Rape them, attempting to nuke Gotham City, and going on a rampage with a Kill Sat. His most widely recognized crossing of the Moral Event Horizon was from Batman Beyond: Return of the Joker when he tortured Tim Drake into insanity and implanted a microchip in the child so the Joker could take over Tim's body and perform a Post-Mortem Comeback.
  • Batman Beyond: Derek Powers, also known as Blight, is a Corrupt Corporate Executive and the Arch-Enemy of Terry. Seizing control of Wayne Enterprises and using it for illegal operations, he developed a chemical weapon for terrorists that an employee named Harry Tully leaked to Terry’s father, Warren. Powers purposefully infected Harry Tully, later showing the Kaznian diplomat who bought the shipment Tully’s gradual death at the hands of said chemical. Powers had his right-hand man murder Warren and frame The Jokerz. Infected by the chemical, he was saved but mutated by the radiation used, driving him insane in the process. Other crimes include committing industrial sabotage; hiring supervillain Shriek to murder Bruce Wayne then try to drive him insane; exiling his own son; polluting the ocean by dumping radioactive waste into it; and experimenting on, then later killing, Mr. Freeze. When his illegal dealings and mutations are publicly exposed, he goes into hiding, later attempting to murder his treacherous son and Batman before seemingly getting himself killed. A sociopath motivated by greed, power and wealth, Derek Powers was such a monster before becoming Blight that when Batman used You Killed My Father as a hint to his identity, he snarls at how "little" that narrows it down.
    "Do you have the slightest idea how little that narrows it down?"
Changes:
  • Joker: I think we can remove the spoiler tags (it's been nearly 20-25 years); "His most widely recognized crossing of the Moral Event Horizon" can be changed to "Perhaps his most infamous crime"...; mention about not only tormenting Collins, but using him to try and blow up the entire GCPD (and Charlie too For the Evulz).
  • Blight: Among other things, the quote is superfluous.

Edited by ACW on May 8th 2019 at 9:35:40 AM

VeryVileVillian Since: Dec, 2017
#161924: May 8th 2019 at 6:46:03 AM

The Joker is the only supervillain of Batman's rogues gallery who possesses no sympathetic or redeeming qualities whatsoever.

I don't think this statement is accurate, considering that we've got Firefly and couple small baddies in BTAS, who don't have anything redeeming in them, but simply fail heinous stadard.

Edited by VeryVileVillian on May 8th 2019 at 4:47:00 PM

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#161925: May 8th 2019 at 6:49:07 AM

As for D'Vorah and Frost....hrm, not sure. D'Vorah never quite seemed to give me the extra 'oomph' there and Frost...I always got the sense she was more this annoying, impatient brat wholly without morals, and Sektor is godawful in of himself (nevermind Bi-han/Noob Saibot )...if Newton wants to make the case for them, I certainly won't stop him and I'll keep an open mind.

now, thanks to the miracles of Netflix, I have a decent bad movie CM for you.

What's the work?

Robin Hood The Rebellion is this low budget film that basically sets Robin Hood In Media Res, with the legend having begun and Robin engaging the wicked Sheriff of Nottingham who's hunting him relentlessly. first let me plug this review because the headline nearly makes this movie's existence worthwhile. Now, let's tlak The Sheriff of Nottingham.

Who is the Sheriff?

The...unusually powerful Sheriff seems to rule the entire country somehow. Anyways, when we open up, the Sheriff, no name given, is oppressing people, murdering people and being a general dick about it. He starts off with interrogating a peasant couple for the whereabouts of Maid Marian, threatening them and when they hesitate to answer, he guts the husband before saying the wife can still save their children. This seems pretty par for the course for the sheriff as well, who tends to do nasty things to people, like the script and actor heard of subtlety as a very vague concept but were all "no thank you."

Upon Marian being captured and other good guys killed, the Sheriff opts to try to force her to marry him in a creepy fashion, noting she can do it willingly or not, and he has absolutely no qualms hurting her if not. His cousin, Guy of Gisborn, is meanwhile ambushed by Robin Hood and humiliated. Upon his arrival back to the sheriff's fortress, the sheriff is in the middle of raping a crying woman in bed and after dealing with Gisborn, he returns to the woman and says if she's still there when he returns later, he'll cut her eyes out and feed them to the pigs. Now, Robin and team are captured in the attempt to save Marian but escape with the help of a woman in the castle, who the Sheriff shoots in the back in front of Robin out of spite, before resuming trying to kill them...Gisborn, btw, is shot with an arrow by Robin and the sheriff demonstrates his displeasure by torturing his cousin by moving the arrow about when it's still in him out of sheer frustration. Oh, and did I mention he has torture chambers? Cause he so does.

Now, by the film's climax, the Sheriff recaptures the heroes, and murders Marian and Robin's friend Much the Miller's Son in front of them, before engaging Robin and Marian with Gisborn, still inending on forcing Marian to marry him. Robin is beaten in the sword fight, but manages to grab a discarded arrow shot at him earlier, nocks it, and when the Sheriff closes in, raises it and fires it through the sheriff's throat. Ending his reign and, mercifully, the movie.

Heinousness?

Rapist, murderer, general dick, worst in film, blah blah blah.

Mitigating qualities?

Hah. Hahahahahahaha.

Conclusion?

And a keeper.


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