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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

bobg Since: Nov, 2012
#128676: Sep 3rd 2018 at 12:27:59 PM

Somewhat off topic, but, on the subject of Black Wolf, incidentally, in real life, it would be a very bad idea for a wolf, or any animal, to mess with Santa.

jjj
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#128677: Sep 3rd 2018 at 12:28:40 PM

Now, my final Rhapsody of Fire post: After the Emerald Sword Saga's conclusion, Rhapsody produced a sequel over 4 music albums: The Dark Secret Saga, beginning in Symphony of the Enchanted Lands II: The Dark Secret...and the narrator of the saga? Christopher Lee as the Wizard King. And we have a villain far more terrifying than Akron: The son of the Hell God Kron....Nekron.

Who is Nekron?

I have no idea what sort of grudge Rhapsody seems to have against the syllable 'Kron' in general, but Nekron is a powerful, evil deity who led a war against the forces of light to enact a reign of torture, pain and death, to reign over Cosmic Chaos forever. Nekron was defeated. Sensing his impending demise, Nekron penned seven black books and entrusted them to his most trusted lieutenants in order to facilitate his dark return. The demons were turned to stone....but now? The time of Nekron's resurrection is drawing near... The heroes set out to stop Nekron's reign, seeking out the lost hero who destroyed Akron: Dargor, the Shadowlord, the half demon who turned on his evil master, the chosen one by prophecy. The song Unholy Warcry kicks off, with the foreboding warnings of Nekron: NEKRON PROMISED BLOODY TERROR BRINGING DEATH AND HATE TO THE NEW WORLD" for one, and also: "Torment, pain and bloody rain... Nekron's resurrection. They must kill the demon king or fight another war"

It is revealed Nekron had conquered elven lands in the past, enacting a reign so bloody and horrific, he depopulated them and despoiled the lands. Quoth the song: or elves and unicorns this meant the fall, Nekron found a new reign to rule, so woods and flowers decided to die.

It is revealed in the final war, the black dragon Thanor, Nekron's ally, betrayed him and gave his location to the angels. Nekron was so furious his rage 'cracked the earth', and he took and tortured Thanor, tearing out his eyes, and turning him to stone...Nekron's prophecy threatens to come to pas,s as Nekron prepares to sweep out of the underworld with an army of demons to exterminate everything in his path. The heroes manage to kill the strongest of Nekron's demon knights, and awaken Thanor who destroys the rest...Dargor, realizing what he has to do, accepts his fate to embrace the light and is reborn as a divinity, going through the gates of hell to challenge Nekron one on one and destroying him once and for all.

Mitigating Qualities?

Nope. While he's not as viscerally awful as Akron, Nekron has massive, massive amounts of death and torture, with attempted mass omnicide to his deeds. He tortured Thanor hideously, depopulated entire regions and his ultimate plans involve "torture, pain and a bloody reign" with things proceeding as he set up even post-mortem, and his return means the apocalypse.

Conclusion?

Another Rhapsody keeper.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#128678: Sep 3rd 2018 at 12:29:10 PM

[lol] Re: Black Wolf: Hmm, that might wanna be changed.

[tup] Nekron (though I can't hold his torture of the traitor TOO much against him).

Edited by ACW on Sep 3rd 2018 at 3:31:06 PM

MenInGreyToBlak V Since: Oct, 2017 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#128680: Sep 3rd 2018 at 12:44:03 PM

[tup]nekron. Oddly common CM name here.

Now here's an interesting question for you. The Otherworld (which is what Bitten is adapted from if your curious, though I hear Malcolm Danvers might not qualify in the original novels though I havent gotten to his books yet so dont quote me on that) has a Lighter and Softer YA Novel spin-off set in the same universe called Darkest Powers. This spin-off since its targeted for teenagers rather adults doesnt have any of the graphic profanity or sexual content (Theres no rape for example that occurs here well it does in Otherworld) and is overall lighter and softer. Im reading both and might have a few ep's down the line, do you think its fine to take both series as there own thing as far heinous standard goes since there disconnected and differently toned being for different audiences.

Edited by miraculous on Sep 3rd 2018 at 1:07:52 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
papyru30 from Colorado for summer break Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
TommyFresh Since: Aug, 2013
MGD107 Since: Feb, 2015
HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#128688: Sep 3rd 2018 at 1:29:39 PM

Oh right did anyone count in Ducktales 2017 ?. I dont think there was a discussion on it

Edited by miraculous on Sep 3rd 2018 at 1:29:32 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
MenInGreyToBlak V Since: Oct, 2017 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Knack Since: Mar, 2018
AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#128691: Sep 3rd 2018 at 1:49:59 PM

[up][up][up]The Big Bad that season was Magica De Spell who at first appeared to be played seriously for a reboot of the original character. However, more of her original personality comes out to where she is inconsistent. For instance, upon getting her original body back, one of the first things she does is force Scrooge to listen to her read her evil gloating which she had somehow written during her time trapped in his number one dime. Her grand scheme in itself is also generic in and of itself, and while she does express interest at destroying the city, she is mainly focused on getting revenge on Scrooge.

That, and she gets no real punishment. After she lost her magic, she tries to humiliatingly use a smoke screen to escape...but that backfires, and she's made to comedically run away. So, no. No one qualified.

[down] More too inconsistent. In her first few appearances, she is taken seriously, but later on when she gets her original body back, she shows off more of a goofy side.

Edited by AustinDR on Sep 3rd 2018 at 2:05:13 AM

MenInGreyToBlak V Since: Oct, 2017 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
Awesomekid42 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: It was only a kiss
#128694: Sep 3rd 2018 at 2:21:37 PM

Along with that, no other villains from the show count either. People like Ma Beagle, Marc Beaks, and the various one-shot villains don't cross baseline threshold. And Flintheart Glomgold, while he crossed the Moral Event Horizon a couple of times, those are also the only couple of times he's treated seriously throughout the entire season.

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#128695: Sep 3rd 2018 at 2:23:59 PM

Guys I uh asked a question above. Id like an answer in advance before I do ep's to know what to do ?

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Riley1sCool Since: Dec, 2014
#128696: Sep 3rd 2018 at 2:28:28 PM

Alright, sorry it took me so long to get this entry out here. If I remember correctly we've still got enough [tup] for Song! Griffith to count.

  • Complete Monster: Griffith, the mercenary captain leading the Band of the Hawk, is a narcissistic, coldly ambitious sociopath with a cruel demeanor. Expressing his egotistical views and cold ambition, he betrays his mercenary comrades without a second thought, allows them to all die in a monstrous manner, and, with glee, rapes Guts' beloved Casca just to spite the two.

Thoughts?

Edited by Riley1sCool on Sep 3rd 2018 at 2:37:03 AM

Tyk5919 Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin Since: Mar, 2011 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin
#128697: Sep 3rd 2018 at 2:31:04 PM

[up][up] If they got different continuities like Kamen Rider, treat the books separately in terms of heinous standard.

Edited by Tyk5919 on Sep 3rd 2018 at 5:30:42 AM

I write stories and shiz. You can read them here.
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#128698: Sep 3rd 2018 at 2:36:08 PM

What Tyk said... depends on whether or not it's in the same "verse" basically.

@ Riley, Griffith has a character page if you wanna use that in his name.

KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#128700: Sep 3rd 2018 at 2:42:56 PM

What Tyk said... depends on whether or not it's in the same "verse" basically.

What do you guys mean by that. Do you mean like if there technically in the same universe but disconnected and dont share continuity like Kamen Rider than its fine taking each as its own thing.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."

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