TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

Go To

During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

TheImmortalAngelNewton The MILF Virus Since: Aug, 2015 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The MILF Virus
#123451: Jul 9th 2018 at 6:40:31 AM

[up]

I try not to, but I tend to slip up when trying to write a character with a lot of details. That's why I try not to look for candidates in very expanded series such World of Warcraft and Planetscape.

Allow me, take my hand and never let go, promise? - Giselle
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Shin Megami Tensei IV
#123453: Jul 9th 2018 at 7:07:42 AM

[tup] Duke Sayn.

I need to get those weird comics somehow. There must be a western comic counterpart to the Manga page that I use in spanish.

Watch me destroying my country
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#123454: Jul 9th 2018 at 7:40:56 AM

BTW, since there are SO many this week, I think I'll submit the batch tomorrow morning.

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#123455: Jul 9th 2018 at 7:42:25 AM

Tenzen's entry: remove 'even evil has standards' from Koshiro. He's not an evil person.

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#123456: Jul 9th 2018 at 7:47:11 AM

VIP entry: Screw the Rules, I Have Connections! isnt potholed correctly at the end.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#123457: Jul 9th 2018 at 7:57:40 AM

Done and done.

Lighty, for Tenzen, does Manipulative Bastard or The Chessmaster work best?

[down] Okay, cool, so that part's fine as is.

Edited by ACW on Jul 9th 2018 at 11:08:05 AM

Beast from Ontario, Canada Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#123459: Jul 9th 2018 at 8:40:04 AM

[tup] Zymeth.

[tup] Hitsungi Morio.

[tup] Budo.

[tup] Sayn.

"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#123460: Jul 9th 2018 at 8:46:35 AM

[tup] to Sayn and Budo

Edited by ElfenLiedFan90 on Jul 9th 2018 at 10:48:29 PM

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
Silverblade2 Since: Jan, 2013
#123461: Jul 9th 2018 at 10:43:53 AM

For Sayn... Does asking God why He abandoned him qualifies as an Alas, Poor Villain moment?

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#123462: Jul 9th 2018 at 10:48:25 AM

IMO no, but I can see someone thinking otherwise.

Kookosbanaani Since: May, 2015
#123463: Jul 9th 2018 at 11:13:17 AM

A minor nitpick, but I think the image for Jo Jo's Bizarre Adventure page should be changed. Literal Kick the Dog / Bad People Abuse Animals moments are not outstanding at all by the standards of the story, even for non-C Ms.

[down] Part 5 anime was confirmed a couple of weeks ago so it seems that Cioccolata (probably the most repulsive CM in the entire series) will have some images to choose from. But somewhere in next spring or so (at least) when his respective episode even airs. Other than that, there's Dio forcing Senator Philips to drive his limo through a crowd of pedestrians or D'Arby the Younger showing his collection as the best images I could think of.

Edited by Kookosbanaani on Jul 9th 2018 at 9:20:01 PM

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#123464: Jul 9th 2018 at 11:15:50 AM

Kick the Dog, or Bad People Abuse Animals?

Either way, I don't disagree. Hell, it looks like he could be making out with the dog! [lol]

Any suggestions?

HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
Silverblade2 Since: Jan, 2013
#123466: Jul 9th 2018 at 11:58:21 AM

Voting yes since he doesn't look like he earned sympathy.

DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
ReynTime250 Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
#123469: Jul 9th 2018 at 2:23:45 PM

From what I hear, the Dragon Ball Super movie is to do with Broly?

I don't know if it's just been leaked or confirmed though.

MenInGreyToBlak V Since: Oct, 2017 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
V
#123470: Jul 9th 2018 at 2:37:58 PM

I'm picking up the discussion of Fortnite: Battle Royale, if no one minds. It seems like the storyline might be building up to an actual biography and a villain.

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#123471: Jul 9th 2018 at 3:01:14 PM

Yes to Sayn. None of his whiny speeches go anything beyond self-pity and self-righteousness. On that subject? We've got one more from the comic who may be worth a post... Uther the Purple himself.

Who is Uther the Purple? What has he done?

For about the first half of the comic? It seems Uther is building up to be the Big Bad... however, as the comic goes on? Uther's revealed as the zealot right-hand of Sayn himself, a Knight Templar no less vile than his master who serves as the Bishop of Stornswall. A corrupt leader of a ring of smugglers delivering various rare items for his master's benefit, Uther makes himself busy by pursuing Conrad, personally massacring a monastery full of dozens of innocent monks and fatally crucifying Elisabeth's father. Uther also serves double-duty as Sayn's Torture Technician, with just one example of this practice seen as he oversees a man on the rack, telling him to spill the information or see his torture drawn out slowly. At the end, Uther sees the man pecked to death by crows.

Now, as Uther and his forces chase after Conrad, he and Elisabeth come to Stornswall after spymaster Gerard informs them he's trying to implicate Uther for all his cruel practices and corruption. When they come into Stornwall's walls, they find... Uther, aside from his chosen black robed monks, has horribly disfigured all those in his service so they can never leave his walls or be anything else than his property, their faces branded and their tongues hacked off. Uther ambushes the others and butchers a young boy they'd befriended who sailed them to the island, revealing that the plan was never Uther's... but that he's also a fully willing and eager component of his lord Sayn's scheme. Finding out one among his service revealed the existence of the Third Testament he and Sayn are looking for to the heroes, Uther has him taken away to be horribly tortured as he pleads for his life, informing him "you'll give me the names of all your contacts, and I'll kill them — one by one. Then you will die, and I will take my time with you."

Eventually, a tortured, broken Conrad manages to find Uther himself as Sayn's forces close into victory, and personally drops the big bombshell... Sayn is Jesus' brother, immortal for thirteen centuries, and is to herald the end of all times — something Uther is willingly helping to set up. Unimpressed, Conrad walks over to Uther and slices his neck open as he comes to meet Sayn...

Any mitigating factors?

No. Uther's loyalty to Sayn's cause is typical batshit insane Knight Templar lunacy underscored by a particularly awful brand of sadism to undermine it even further (as evidenced at how much he seems to love drawing out his torture sessions). Nothing to talk about there.

The standard, for a second-in-command? Uther is damn nasty. He's fully aware of the apocalyptic end mission for starters and sheds a lot of innocent blood on his master's behalf, but also willingly racks up a lot of godawful spite, prolonged torture, and murder on his own time as well with how he casually disfigures his own servants and ruins any chance of them ever having a better life again done entirely on his own initiative as the Bishop of Stornswall. Uther's a pawn in the end, as Conrad notes, but he's as nasty as he can be and he's way worse than any of Sayn's other minions in the end with most of the dirty work of the scheme carried out gleefully by him.

Conclusion?

Honestly, I'd keep Uther too. He's exceptionally nasty for a glorified torturer and bishop on his own.

Thoughts?

Edited by Scraggle on Jul 9th 2018 at 4:26:07 AM

KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Shin Megami Tensei IV
#123472: Jul 9th 2018 at 3:06:17 PM

[tup] Uther the Purple, the color of EVIL

Edited by KazuyaProta on Jul 9th 2018 at 5:06:09 AM

Watch me destroying my country
G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#123474: Jul 9th 2018 at 3:08:51 PM

[tup]uther the purple

Edited by miraculous on Jul 9th 2018 at 3:08:52 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#123475: Jul 9th 2018 at 3:11:59 PM

Uther does indeed seem like a keep. [tup] him.

Edited by ACW on Jul 9th 2018 at 6:19:11 AM


Total posts: 326,048
Top