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Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
ThePest179 Since: Jul, 2015
#75377: Jan 11th 2017 at 8:11:32 PM

[up][up][up][up] No, he doesn't. He's made people kill animals before in brutal ways. For instance, HABIT forced Nicky (a victim described on CYSTW) to gouge out the eyes of his pet dog.

edited 11th Jan '17 8:11:47 PM by ThePest179

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
erazor0707 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
#75379: Jan 11th 2017 at 8:30:19 PM

[tup] HABIT and Spencer.

Got another for this week. Decided to bring up another favorite of mine, a game for the 360 this time.

What Is The Work?

Unreal Tournament 3. Its single-player story campaign is some years after the events of Unreal Tournament 2004, a Necris attack occurs on a colony on unknown planet, releasing armed Kralls on the humans. The colony is defenseless, but a group of Ronins arrives on the scene, defending the survivors. Reaper, the group's leader, advises his second-in-command warrior Othello and his sister Jester to destroy the orbital Necris blockade with a fighter, and orders team's sniper expert, Bishop, to provide cover as he swarms to save the colony. Suddenly, he is caught in the explosion of an incoming rocket missile and passes out, but not before seeing an unknown Necris woman shooting a soldier next to him. Reaper is rescued by Othello and Jester and wakes up in the base of the Izanagi, a guerrilla force that fights against Necris and Axon, and he meets with the leader, revealed to be Malcolm, who also leads the Iron Guard as the Izanagi's army. The unknown woman who Reaper saw turns out to be Akasha, the Necris operative who destroyed the colony and also leads the Necris forces. Reaper wants to kill her, but Malcolm tells him that he needs to prove himself first.

Who is the candidate?

In case you couldn’t gather from the last section, it’s Akasha. Akasha is the leader of the Necris representation in UT 3 and is hence the Big Bad. The story explains she handles non-military ops such as the attack on Izanagi and Twin Souls. Not only that, Akasha is in command of several other crews: the Blackheart Assassins, Dark Phalanx Blades and the Black Legion themselves.

Phayder Corporation developed the Necris treatment process to produce an elite group of "undead" assassins. The Necris process itself has no spiritual component, but those who have undergone the treatment have built up a religion based on this transformation. Over time, the Necris religion has become an important part of the Corporation's driving principles. Akasha is a Necris High Inquisitor, a ruthless leader who has ordered countless massacres. Layman terms, quote Jester, “So she slaughters civilians for a living. Nice.”

What has he/she done?

  • For starters, that Krall attack on the Twin Souls colony? She’s behind it. Reaper, the main character of the story mode, lost everything thanks to Akasha, including his family. Jester, Reaper’s sister, also lost some friends. Like I said, this is just one of many high-scale assaults Akasha has done.
  • When Akasha appointed herself Necris High Inquisitor and recruited members of the Necris Elite to pass judgement on the citizens of the universe, this led to the attack on Taryd and the war. Bringing us to the start of the story as covered in the first section.
  • Next, in what it looks to me one of the playable stages, some soldiers look up and see tentacled vehicles landing almost on top of them. The cutscene then goes to the Onyx coast, where again, unprepared soldiers get ambushed by Necris forces. Next, a city is partially destroyed, with civilians killed. The cutscene goes on to show the Necris killing everyone and taking over territory. Yep, definitely a slaughter than a war.
  • Eventually, Izanagi and allies push back Akasha and the Necris. Malcom says the war is over, but Reaper and the Ronin want Akasha’s blood. They’re ready to go to the Necris homeworld. So a lengthy campaign begins the Ronin surge through their homeworld and eventually Reaper is able to confront Akasha one-on-one. Depending on how the fight goes, Akasha will taunt Reaper about going it alone and killing Reaper’s family.
  • So, eventually, Reaper downs Akasha and brutally kills her with his Rocker Launcher. Then… Reaper sends a message to the rest of the Ronin, which goes unreceived. Without him knowing, Necris forces have gathered around him, and at the top of a ledge, a Necris soldier holds a weakened Jester. The soldier drops Jester, and she soon dies. Reaper suddenly realizes that the Necris forces surrounding him is being commanded by Malcolm. You can guess Reaper's Ronin allies have bit the dust.

Heinousness standard

The Big Bad of story mode. She sets it. Everything Necris and Krall do is under her command. In one story mode, we are given proof of THREE instances of widespread destruction (Twin Souls, the unknown one at the start, and finally the city midway through). We don’t see what else she does on Taryd (the setting for the first several missions), but I think that’s enough to validate her portfolio. Her and Necris do the most damage in the war.

Phayder Corporation is never seen in story mode, so they’re moot. The Player Punch with Malcom is pretty cruel, too, but the cliffhanger raises too many questions to put Akasha’s heinousness into question. She’s the dang leader, now all of a sudden they are allied with someone who’s more or less the series mascot?

Freudian Excuse?

None.

Redeeming or mitigating factors?

The tricky part. Let me backtrack to give you some UT lore.

The Necris are an elite security force employed by the Phayder Corporation. Because of their prowess, they have a reputation across the universe of being fearless and efficient assassins. These guys have gone through a process of the same name which replaced their blood with nanoblack (a black fluid of unknown origin containing some form of nano technology). The nanoblack offered an opportunity for a form of immortality as the nanoblack could maintain and quickly repair deteriorating tissue. Because of this, it is assumed that those who have gone through this process no longer age. It is assumed that ongoing injections of nanoblack are required to keep the subject alive. The process also comes with extreme risk as there are several potential side effects. For example, the nanoblack has unpredictable effects on the person's mental state. It is unknown if these effects are due to flaws in the nanoblack technology or the amount of stress put on the brain due to being brought back to life.

Akasha herself is a Necris (obviously). This could bring up moral agency, but let’s dive in deeper. According to Reaper in the pre-battle objective screen, Akasha has used “Sentinel” (the arena in the Necris homeworld where you fight her) as a safehouse to hide from the Ronin, the Necris Priests, and even the Fader (?) who sent her to tear it in the first place. The whole thing seems to suggest she’s something a coward. Lastly, whenever she kills you in the final battle, she’s pretty quick to remind you of the futility of your challenges. Like, she says there’s no honor, how mortality is [Reaper’s] weakness, and taunting Reaper about his family (“You die quickly… like family” – and she sounds pretty disappointed about that according to her tone). She also has another quote ("Take no pride in victory. Soon I will be invincible!") that suggests she craves power. It’s all characterization to point there’s some individuality beneath the transformation.

It helps the rest of the Necris in the game don't even get that much, which makes her stand out from the crowd.

May seem like scraps but, hey, it’s something for a series that tends to run on an Excuse Plot.

Final verdict

Leaning toward [tup]. What about you guys?

edited 11th Jan '17 8:44:00 PM by erazor0707

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#75380: Jan 11th 2017 at 8:39:57 PM

"it has more than five entries" is a PERFECTLY fine reason tongue

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#75381: Jan 11th 2017 at 9:45:27 PM

[up] No, it really isn't, to be honest. Contest that all you want but give me a more solid reason.

LoreDeluxe Since: May, 2013
#75382: Jan 11th 2017 at 10:17:56 PM

One issue we may be having with the subpages is too much clutter on the main genre pages. WarCraft appears on the video game, comic book, and literature section when have it under VideoGame only would be just fine. The same solution could be applied to Dungeons & Dragons. Have the subpage appear only under the Tabletop section instead of also literature and video games. Yes, some of the subpages have multiple genres in them, but just putting them under the section where the franchise is most prevalent might help it not seem so cluttered everywhere and more subpages wouldn't seem like a hassle.

Think you're tough because you made it through Lord of the Rings? Real men survive The Silmarillion.
VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#75383: Jan 11th 2017 at 10:20:46 PM

It would be best to put the subpages underneath the genre of franchise origin. Or indeed the most prevalent media.

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#75384: Jan 11th 2017 at 10:28:35 PM

I've got one more keeper for the night. I think this'll be my final proposal from the Fall of Cthulhu series. This one comes from Hexed.

What's the setting?

Good old Fall of Cthulhu. Except this time... the eldritch elements are vastly downplayed. We get two returning characters (Lucifer and the Harlot) and leaves all mention of the previous events of Fall as a mention of a "turf war" to develop its own setting. In the magical underworld, Lucifer acts as a thief for magical artifacts working for her boss Val. All sorts of shenanigans ensue; necromancy, magical paintings which contain entire worlds with them, an underground market which auctions off said magical artifacts, and even greater forces at work. Lucifer's exploits attract the eye of the mysterious Madame Cymbaline, and in the opening of the comic, Lucifer's exploits accidentally open up Cymbaline's bloodhungry brother... Yves.

Who is Yves? What has he done?

Yves is a soul-stealing demon and the brother of Cymbaline. Now, Yves doesn't like Cymbaline. Really, really doesn't like Cymbaline. His sole goal through is to break free of his containment, brutally murder her, and be free to devour as many souls as he can through the world. He's so brutally focused on this goal that it's stated both sides would be willing to endanger thousands and be willing to destroy the world to get at each other's throats. After a little magical accident ends with one of Val's workers, Bob, trapped within a painting called the Empty Garden, Yves is accidentally freed and in the desperate attempt to lock him back in the painting, Yves immediately goes to one of the people who accidentally freed him, Val's intern Raina and a friend of Lucifer's, and tries to devour her soul. He's intercepted in the process, and he backs off for the time being, although he swears he'll remember the encounter. Raina's soul is trapped in the Shade, a sort of hellish limbo where all manners of nightmarish, decayed spirits wander, in the process, and Lucifer begins a complicated ritual to free her - killing herself to send her soul to the Shade. Yves, on the other hand, gets straight back to business... heading off to the Harlot to inquire about removing a tattoo that can keep him bound to certain paintings, as well as a soul powerful enough to give him the power to face off against his sister. The Harlot tells him Lucifer's soul would be powerful enough to destroy his sister and points him in the direction of a device that can break the bond... which leads him right to Val's art gallery of magical artifacts.

Yves waltzes into Val's gallery as Val and a soulless Raina - who's developed the powers of necromancy - desperately attempt to free Lucifer from the Shade via a magical portal. Yves steals something called Michaelangelo's Torque (which'll prevent him from being sealed in any more paintings via immunity to the "binding frame" that makes that possible") and comments on the situation. He accidentally lets loose slip that Lucifer killed herself to gain access to the Shade and remarks that he's hungry, threatening to kill Val and Raina. However... in an amusing scene, Val shuts him up and demands Lucifer explain what the hell he's talking about while he just sort of looks on with a dumbfounded expression. After that, though, Yves remarks that he's free of all binding and attempts to kill Val, leaving the portal to the Shade undefended. For context? The denizens of the Shade would pour into the living world in droves through that door - something Yves is apparently very much willing to let happen if it means another soul for him devour. Val thankfully manages to outwit Yves, stabbing him through with a magical spear and forcing him to flee while the situation with the Shade is more or less fixed. Yves swears Val will suffer for that transgression and flees through a painting

Val goes to Madame Cymbaline herself to inquire more about the situation with Yves all while Yves goes on a feeding frenzy throughout the city, depicted devouring one poor sod's soul on-screen for the purpose of gaining his strength back and using the Torque to hide them. Yves also attacks Cymbaline at Graeae Towers and brutally massacres the dozens of people comprising Towers' workforce, crudely scrawling an impression of Cymbaline's dead face with their blood on the side of the wall as a warning. When Lucifer returns to life, Yves takes note, and attacks a showcase at a museum Val is showing her works off at. Yves drags Lucifer into a painting and threatens to leave Lucifer to slowly starve until she's took weak to fight back in the painting he's trapped her in if she doesn't submit her soul to him. Lucifer basically says "screw that" and engages in a really creative sequence with Yves, using the spell of the Torque Val weaved onto the dress she's wearing to leap from painting to painting and dodge Yves at the same time Cymbaline attacks the museum to get at Yves. Eventually, Lucifer outwits Yves and swipes the Torque from right under him, darting out of the painting and leaving him trapped inside. Cymbaline takes her opportunity and sets the painting alight, burning Yves alive with it.

Any mitigating factors?

None with Yves himself. He's a complete psychopath who seems to enjoy nothing more than the consumption of souls for nothing more than power and the brutal slaughter of anyone he feels wrongs him. The only real issue is that, obviously, Fall of Cthulhu has a fairly high heinous standard and Hexed introduces a few nasty customers. Even Lucifer sinks to some pretty harsh depths to get revenge on Cymbaline for a later nasty deed of hers. However... Yves is the Starter Villain. He has neither the screentime nor the resources to compete with his sister nor someone like Nyarlathotep and the lengths he's willing to go to kill his sister entail collateral damage described as being capable of "rending the world asunder" that match right up to the omnicidal plans of the nastiest customers of the series. Add crimes like massacres and soul-stealing to his repertoire and I think Yves passes the heinous standard in his niche pretty handily, to be frank.

Oh, and before anyone asks about Cymbaline... I think Yves is actually more heinous than her, at least with what he's given. Cymbaline is still a nasty, vindictive bitch, but she's way more composed and even after becoming a god, her plans don't entail the damage Yves' schemes do - who's only too willing to tell the Harlot that the world is filled with souls all for his taking once he kills his sister. Cymbaline is more concerned with pursuits of personal power. Yves is just a needlessly destructive scumbag.

Conclusion?

I think we've got our final keeper from this series - although I won't be surprised if Michael Alan Nelson continues this series further considering Hexed only ended in late 2015. But until then? We can welcome Yves to this trope.

Thoughts?

edited 11th Jan '17 11:31:33 PM by Scraggle

DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#75385: Jan 11th 2017 at 11:14:54 PM

[tup] Spence, Alaska and Yves

New proposal, from Black Sunday.

Who's the candidate?

Asa Vajda, a Moldavian princess who's also a Satanist vampire witch.

What does he do?

As punishment for various crimes (none of which are detailed or on-screen), Asa's brother, the local Grand Inquisitor, condemns her to death. In retaliation, she cursed his descendants to die by her hand. The inquisitors proceed to nail a "Mask of Satan" to her face and burn her at the stake. However, a rain comes (implied to have been sent by Satan) which puts out the fires before they can purify her soul. Her corpse is placed in the Vajda tomb, where a window is carved in her coffin and a cross placed so her spirit could see it in order to keep her wrath contained.

BUT WAIT! SHE ISN'T DEAD! ASA SURPRISE!

OK, she is, but doesn't stay that way.

200 years later, Drs. Thomas Kruvajan and Andre Gorobec passing near the Vajda crypt, and goes inside to investigate while his carriage driver fixes a damaged wheel. He's attacked by a bat, though he fights it off. In the process, he both destroys the cross and gets some of his blood onto Asa's body, thus facilitating her resurrection.

Asa telepathically commands her servant Javuto, who was also executed for aiding Asa's crimes in life, to return from the grave as her zombie servant. She then sends him to kill Prince Vajda, the current patriarch of the family, but he's warded off by Vajda's cross.

However, Vajda is paralyzed with fear from the event, so his children send for a Kruvajan to help. On the way, the servant they send is slain by Javuto. Javuto takes his place and takes Kruvajan to Asa's tomb, where she seduces him into letting her kill and vampirize his ass. Kruvajan ends up personally slaying Vajda.

Gorobec arrives at Castle Vajda looking for Kruvajan, and learns of the Prince's demise. Based on a tip by a young girl who saw Javuto, he investigates an inscription that describes how to end the curse. Upon finding Kruvajan, Gorobec asks him about the piece, and Kruvajan flees, killing the Vajda family dogs in the process.

A servant discovers a secret passageway behind a painting, where Gorobec discovers Asa's corpse. As Gorobec goes to a priest who knows more about the curse, Javuto goes and kills the male Vadja child and their head servant. As Princess Katia Vadja discovers their corpses, Prince Vadja returns and tries to kill her. Javuto throws him in the fireplace for his insolence. He then takes her to Asa, who starts to absorb her youth as her own. Asa taunts Natia over the fact that her life's about to be used to perpetuate evil.

Gorobec arrives to rescue Katia, but Asa has already slain her. She tries to trick Gorobec into staking Natia, but he notices she's wearing a cross (which burn vamp skin) at the last moment. She then tries to make him into a vampire, but the priest comes in with an angry mob, who burn her alive, properly this time, and Katia's life returns to her.

Heinousness?

Big Bad, sets it.

Mitigating factors?

There are two kinds of vampires in this universe: Humans who got their abilities via Deal with the Devil, who have full agency. and zombie vampires created by the human ones, who are basically slaves to the human ones, and have their redeeming qualities removed by Satan. Asa is the former.

Asa is avenging her death, but given that she's killing her own family in retaliation for punishment for crimes she committed in the name of Satan, it doesn't strike me as redeeming.

Verdict?

[tup]

edited 12th Jan '17 1:14:28 AM by DemonDuckofDoom

LordYAM Since: Jan, 2015
LordYAM Since: Jan, 2015
#75387: Jan 12th 2017 at 1:41:15 AM

Also in the Edward Braddock writeup you should change steak to stake. It's not "his life was at steak." It's "his life was at stake."

edited 12th Jan '17 1:41:48 AM by LordYAM

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#75389: Jan 12th 2017 at 3:14:46 AM

  • Scraggle, you missed the tongue (personally, I think it's enough, but that's just me). Also, I say keep the subpages in multiple genres.
  • [tup] to Rivington (though why does he bother paying them at all?)
  • [tup] HABIT
  • [tup] Spence
  • [tup] Necris (I think).
  • [tup] Yves, I THINK. He's less powerful than Nya, but what about Nero?
  • Asa: So how many deaths does she cause exactly?

edited 12th Jan '17 5:46:58 AM by ACW

MGD107 Since: Feb, 2015
#75390: Jan 12th 2017 at 3:57:04 AM

[tup] to Rivington, HABIT, Jack Spence, Akasha, Yves and Asa.

LoreDeluxe Since: May, 2013
#75391: Jan 12th 2017 at 6:32:28 AM

Just as an example of clutter on the main pages, on Comic Books, we have Conan the Barbarian, G.I. Joe, Godzilla, Sonic the Hedgehog, Star Trek, Star Wars, Transformers, and WarCraft. This could easily be cut down to only having 2000 AD, DC Comics, and Marvel Comics. Even though the above examples do have some examples from comic books, eight of eleven subpages could be moved to only one genre page where their franchise is most well known or originated. Right now it looks like we have way more pages than we actually do, and if we did this everyone may not be so hung up on adding new pages for franchises.

Think you're tough because you made it through Lord of the Rings? Real men survive The Silmarillion.
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#75392: Jan 12th 2017 at 6:33:42 AM

Yes to yves and Asa.

But as a note, this "WAIT HE ISN'T DEA SURPRISE" thing is really freaking annoying now.

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#75394: Jan 12th 2017 at 6:58:05 AM

LD, I see what you're saying, but I respectfully disagree (ESPECIALLY with something like, say, Star Wars or Transformers or GI Joe.

erazor0707 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
#75395: Jan 12th 2017 at 6:59:32 AM

[tup] Yves and Asa.

I agree subpages should be confined to their most prevalent media. When I think of Disney, I think Western Animation, for example. Really no reason to put it elsewhere. AND it cleans up clutter.

[up] Those could be the exceptions then.

edited 12th Jan '17 7:00:20 AM by erazor0707

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#75396: Jan 12th 2017 at 7:05:05 AM

Disney may be another exception. We can probably remove it from Video Games (same with Dragon Ball for that matter), but...
Would this entail moving, say, the Dragon Ball and Disney video games to the main VG page?

edited 12th Jan '17 7:05:23 AM by ACW

erazor0707 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
LoreDeluxe Since: May, 2013
#75398: Jan 12th 2017 at 7:32:53 AM

The subpages themselves can remain the same. I'm just looking at it from the viewpoint of a random person looking over the tropes and wanting to find examples from their favorite franchise. They would go to a specific genre page to find what they wanted.

Here's some information: there are currently 107 monster subpages linked under all 11 of the genre pages, but there are only 68 actual subpages.

Think you're tough because you made it through Lord of the Rings? Real men survive The Silmarillion.
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#75399: Jan 12th 2017 at 7:37:13 AM

Hmm, I see what you're saying (didn't realize there were THAT many duplications), but still...

Beast from Ontario, Canada Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#75400: Jan 12th 2017 at 8:15:31 AM

[tup] to Rivington, [tup] HABIT, [tup] Spence, [tup] Necris, [tup] Yves, and [tup] Asa.

  • Red Faction: Adam Hale from Armageddon who also appears in the film was originally the second in command of the White Faction and a lover to Lyra Mason, before becoming a cult leader placing himself as a messiah figure. An initial supporter of the White Factions plot to start a war between the Red Faction and Marauders, overseeing the massacre of civilians. When Lyra realizes the truth of her past and leaves for her family, Hale's immediate reaction is to take control of the White Faction and ordering the destruction of the Teraformer, knowing it would render Mars virtually uninhabitable and not caring that Lyra could be a casualty, holding one of his men at gunpoint for hesitating the attack, and is only stopped when Alec Mason sacrifices himself to destroy the dreadnought. By the time of Armageddon, Hale reemerges twenty years later with a cult to his name, and succeeds in destroying the Teraformer causing widespread destruction, such as tornadoes and violent storms across the surface, forcing the people of Mars to colonize underground to survive. Learning of a ravenous alien race called the plague further beneath the surface, Hale has his cultists trick Darius Mason into releasing the plague on the people of Mars, overrunning the colonists and killing multiple people. He later announces to his cult his plans to enslave these creatures as an army in his conquest. Originally raised to be a loyal soldier, Hale is ultimately a man motivated to claim his envisioned destiny of ruling Mars, with or without Lyra, and partially motivated by his hate for the Mason family, not caring who or how many have to die in the process.

"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."

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