During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
@Lighty: Oh yeah, I forgot. If he dies then we can all vote on him without doubt.
I'm just hoping Captain Phasma will do more in the next movie. Like......eating a taco.
Yes. That's more important than what she did in TFA.
I write stories and shiz. You can read them here.I imagine her going through a Norrington-like arc, where she's been booted out of the ranks for what happened and tries to take more personal revenge on the heroes.
I also imagine I should take that to an actual SW thread, but hey, it was brought up....
There is no beginning. There is no end. There is only... Hooty.Changed Astaroth's writeup a little bit to more accurately reflect his reasons for trying to end the universe:
The Tapestry: Astaroth is an ancient and powerful demon ( actually a "spore" created by entities called the Starving Gods) who wants the Book of Thoth so he can rule the world with it. While he masks himself as a Well-Intentioned Extremist, he's really a demon supremacist, punishing David Menlo for summoning demon by biting his hand off. His plan for world conquest involves bringing governments around the world close to collapse before descending on Rowan with his army to seize the Book, leveraging the lives of Max's friends to get it. Upon getting it, he uses its power over truenames to expunge all post-medieval human knowledge from existence and memory, killing the vast majority of the human race. He then sets up demons as the Earth's rulers under him, instituting a vicious regime where a single person being literate mandates mass slaughter. When he loses the demons' loyalty, he loses use for them, and after consistently failing to create fully functional life because of his true nature, he flips out when Rowan gears up to stop him and reveals his true motives: he just wants to play capital-G God, and cares no more for demons than for humans. To this end, he attempts to summon the Starving Gods in the hopes that they will devour the universe and give him scraps to live out his fantasies with. A narcissistic psychopath caring only about his fantasies of power, Astaroth exhibits unparalleled evil even amongst demons.
edited 1st Jan '16 8:48:21 PM by MetaBuu
Don't know if it makes a difference at this point but
on Black Hiver and all TFA villains until either the end of the trilogy or they die.
I have also gone ahead and added the Elf Quest entries to the YMMV page. ACW, feel free to make any edits you deem necessary, but otherwise it's a simple copy and paste job onto the main page.
Think you're tough because you made it through Lord of the Rings? Real men survive The Silmarillion.Hey guys its me again, so here it is
1.
for Black Hiver
2.
for any TFA until the trilogy ends
3. I've also explored the Video Game CM page and noticed the Far Cry candidates are separate from one another. To show you:
Far Cry 3: Hoyt Volker is the boss of the biggest slave-trading ring in the South-Pacific. He's described as the root of all the evil happening on the island, and is responsible for manipulating Vaas with drugs into becoming a madman. In his first appearance, he gleefully forces a small group of innocent civilians to run across an active minefield. The second time we see him, he burns one of his own men alive and tells the rest of his privateers to kill any island native they see on sight. Finally, during a poker game, he kills Jason's friend Sam and threatens to cut off one of Jason's fingers every time he loses a round, a threat that he makes good on. Volker may seem pleasant, but is in fact an utterly psychotic sadist without a single redeeming quality.
Far Cry 3: Blood Dragon: In this post-apocalyptic timeline, Colonel Ike Sloan was the leader of cybernetically enhanced soldiers, and the ideal hero, but upon learning that America and the Communists are making a peace agreement, he goes rogue with his soldiers. Enhancing himself with the Blood of the Blood Dragons, Sloan considered himself the strongest and best suited to be leader. He plots to use the blood to enhance nukes which he'll launch all over the worlds, resulting in a new apocalypse and then he’ll build a world where the strong rule over the weak, with him as supreme leader. When he first encounters two of his former soldiers, Sergeant Rex "Power" Colt and Lieutenant T.T. "Spider" Brown, he kills Spider and later praises Rex for killing some of his men, as he sees it as culling out his weaker soldiers.
So I was thinking of doing something like this:
Far Cry 3:
The main campaign has Hoyt Volker, the boss of the biggest slave-trading ring in the South-Pacific, and the one responsible for manipulating Vaas with drugs into becoming a madman. He is first introduced forcing a small group of innocent civilians to run across an active minefield. In his second introduction, he burns one of his own men alive and tells the rest of his privateers to kill any island native they see on sight. In his last appearance, he kills Jason's friend Sam in the middle of a poker game and threatens to cut off one of Jason's fingers every time he loses a round, a threat that he makes good on. An utterly psychotic sadist without a single redeeming quality, Volker may seem pleasant but is in fact the root of all the evil happening on the islands of Rakyat.
The stand-alone expansion, Blood Dragon, has Colonel Ike Sloan who was once the leader of cybernetically enhanced soldiers, and an ideal hero, but upon learning that America and the Communists are making a peace agreement, he goes rogue with his soldiers. Enhancing himself with the Blood of the Blood Dragons, Sloan considered himself the strongest and best suited to be leader. He plots to use the blood to enhance nukes which he'll launch all over the worlds, resulting in a new apocalypse and then he’ll build a world where the strong rule over the weak, with him as supreme leader. When he first encounters two of his former soldiers, Sergeant Rex "Power" Colt and Lieutenant T.T. "Spider" Brown, he kills Spider and later praises Rex for killing some of his men, as he sees it as culling out his weaker soldiers. Once a proud hero to all, manages to shed this status with his extreme Social Darwinist and Bad Boss tendencies, and is now on par with Hoyt Volker as one of the most evil villains in the Far Cry Series.
I also did some editing on the entries, so what do you think?
edited 1st Jan '16 11:40:27 PM by G-Editor
My sandbox of EPs and other stuffI have some minor changes for the completeMonster pages for Fire Emblem's Izuka Entry.
- Izuka, Ashnard's demented chief scholar, is no less evil than his master. In his brief cameo in Path of Radiance, he appears onscreen just long enough for it to be revealed that he is the developer of the Feral Ones, Laguz who are forcibly mode-locked into their beast forms and driven insane to be used as Cannon Fodder. In his base at Gritnea Tower it is revealed he has a basement devoted to storing the corpses of his experiments' victims. Izuka takes on a much greater role in the second game, where he has been hired by Lekain to bend Daein to Begnion's whims. He takes on the role of strategist to Daein's weak-willed Prince Pelleas, where it is demonstrated that he would gladly sacrifice good strategy for pointless destruction. He injects the innocent Muarim with the Feral One drug, which would have annihilated his mind if not for Rafiel's intervention. When Begnion offers to make peace with Daein, Izuka springs his trap, telling Pelleas to sign a "peace treaty" that is actually a Blood Pact, mystically binding Pelleas and thus all of Daein into virtual slavery to Begnion. Finally, it is revealed that he's tested his drug on the Beorc, too, including turning Elincia's noble Uncle Renning into the Tragic Monster known as General Bertram.
My version with the changes highlighted.
- Izuka, Ashnard's demented chief scholar, a Beorc Mad Scientist, is no less evil than his master. In his brief cameo in Path of Radiance, he appears onscreen just long enough for it to be revealed that he is the developer of the Feral Ones, Laguz who are forcibly mode-locked into their beast forms and driven insane to be used as Cannon Fodder. In his base at Gritnea Tower it is revealed he has a basement devoted to storing the corpses of his experiments' victims. Izuka takes on a much greater role in the second game, where he has been hired by Lekain to bend Daein to Begnion's whims. He takes on the role of strategist to Daein's weak-willed Prince Pelleas, where it is demonstrated that he would gladly sacrifice good strategy for pointless destruction. He injects the innocent Muarim with the Feral One drug, which would have annihilated his mind if not for Rafiel's intervention. When Begnion offers to make peace with Daein, Izuka springs his trap, telling Pelleas to sign a "peace treaty" that is actually a Blood Pact, mystically binding Pelleas and thus all of Daein into virtual slavery to Begnion. Finally, it is revealed that he's tested his drug on his own race, the Beorc, too. Turning Elincia's noble Uncle Renning into the Tragic Monster known as General Bertram.
I feel this small change helps explain it better for people who aren't familiar with the game.
Basically it explains that Beorc are the the setting's equivalent to humans, and that by experimenting on the beorc, Izuka is experimenting on his own people.
Any views on this proposed change?
Here is a Link
to my other proposed small change.
edited 2nd Jan '16 12:49:49 AM by Monsund
Now that I know Youtube poop can count, I want to know, have you guys done Mr. Krabs from Mr. Krabs Unquenchable Bloodlust?
edited 2nd Jan '16 1:05:58 AM by G-Editor
My sandbox of EPs and other stuff![[up] [up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png)
Actually, looking at them carefully, I like both those changes.
- G-Editor, please copy from Video Games A To K and post with the potholes.
- Let's see, so Mordekaiser has evil before death, Ungrateful Bastard, killing many AFTER getting his revenge, and only redeeming quality is by Word of God and non-canon? Seems like an easy
to me.
- Please put Heydrich and the FNAF guy on their respective YMMV pages. I'll do those and the Elf Quest quartet next week.
edited 2nd Jan '16 1:36:08 AM by ACW
What do you mean ACW that page is locked also if I have time I could do an effort post on mr Krab's unquenchable thirst if one has not been made
edited 2nd Jan '16 1:50:01 AM by G-Editor
My sandbox of EPs and other stuffG-Editor, you can go to Video Games A To K, click on "source", copy from there, and paste in this thread.
edited 2nd Jan '16 3:29:42 AM by ACW

Probably not.
I think it's a good point that whereas Tarkin basically operated on his own whereas Hux shares in his evil with Snoak and sometimes Ren.
It's been a while since I've seen the original movies, but as I understand it:
In the original trilogy, you basically have Vader as the Dragon-in-Chief and Palpatine is the guy who keeps the Death Stars running on time and so he and Vader are on the same team, but have different priorities.
In this, Hux and Ren are both subordinates to Snoak and dislike each other and vie for favor. To continue the Nazi comparison, it's kind of like an SS vs Gestapo thing. But at the same time, Hux shares in evil with Snoak.
Semi-
.
But yeah, we should wait on Hux. Also strikes me, he's rather a Hate Sink as a character. Makes Ren and Phasma more sympathetic by comparison.
edited 1st Jan '16 7:44:08 PM by Hodor2