During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Sure there.
Also, I don't mind where he goes on the tree, toss a dart
- Vampire: Enver Frasheri is a Toreador "artist" who excels only in cruelty. A musical prodigy who lost his spark upon his embrace, Enver enacts his envy on talented artists by ruining their lives, torturing them to death and keeping trophies. Enver commits himself to the ruination of those he targets, torturing them physically and mentally while framing innocents for his crimes to the authorities. Enver delights in killing everyone close to his victims and posing the corpses artistically, tolerated by the Ivory Tower for his skill in dealing with the Sabbat, even if it brings about large amounts of civilian casualties.
- Pteranodon Canyon: Francis Burner is a ruthless poacher with a legacy of violence and murder behind him. Having killed countless people, including the wife and child of bounty hunter Charlie Archer, Burner is introduced murdering a card dealer for dealing "improperly." Having numerous people murdered to cover up his dinosaur poaching ring, Burner gleefully tries to murder Archer himself at the end.
- Easy Bake: Michael, host of "easy Bake" enjoys running his baking show as a death game. Making the contestants believe they are trapped in the show, Michael has anyone "cut" from the show murdered for real with numerous innocents killed for not measuring up to his standards for baking. In the last contest, Michael even psychologically tortures the contestants, using the corpse of the last loser as "ingredients" for a meat pie.
- Kung Fu Panda: The High Priestess runs a small village in the outskirts, where she ostensibly helps travelers. In truth a cruel cannibal, the High Priestess runs a cult where innocents are taken to be harvested, murdered and cannibalized by her and her followers, something she has done many times. Upon Veruca trying to save her brother Klaus with her sorcery, the High Priestess reveals she doesn't even believe in her own purported religion, murdering people for the sheer enjoyment of it.
So it can go with this week's:
- Enver Frasheri is a Toreador "artist" who excels only in cruelty. A musical prodigy who lost his spark upon his embrace, Enver enacts his envy on talented artists by ruining their lives, torturing them to death and keeping trophies. Enver commits himself to the ruination of those he targets, torturing them physically and mentally while framing innocents for his crimes to the authorities. Enver delights in killing everyone close to his victims and posing the corpses artistically, tolerated by the Ivory Tower for his skill in dealing with the Sabbat, even if it brings about large amounts of civilian casualties.
Oh I see what happened I thought Professor Onikichi Kuroda was two separate characters by accident. You know I read it by accident as Professor Onikichi, Kuroda.
Was checking Metal Heroes.
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."Even ignoring the crossovers, are all 7 bad enough for the entire franchise?
Also, for High Priestess, is that her only episode?
Next VTM one: Righteous Endeavor
Who is righteous Endeavor?
A 9th Generation Tzimisce, a Priscus of the Sabbat and one of their best Inquisitors, Righteous Endeavor was born Righteous Endeavor Clay, he was the son of a Puritan witchhunter and a Witch. After his father discovered his wife was a witch, he tortured her nightly, which excited the boy. "Vindicating Freud," Righteous Endeavor grew to be a powerful witch hunter. Being a horrible, horrible person as a human? He was also a witch himself, forcnicating in Black Masses before betraying the covens to the witch hunters for horrific torture...not only that, but righteous Endeavor had a tendency to administer to them in the dungeons himself, in what is very clearly rape. "exhorting the nubile young sinners' redemption through means both oratorical and physical."
After falling ill, Righteous Endeavor hunted down more witches, but found himself locating the first of the Sabbat in the new world. The Kindred were delighted to meet a man of such a black and horrible soul, and the Tzimisce Ezra Howland Embraced Righteous Endeavor into the Sabbat. As a Sabbat Inquisitor, Righteous Endeavor keeps one thing most vampires lack: faith.
A brutal templar, Righteous Endeavor pushes the Sabbat to montrosity, whipping Packs into frenzies and horrific blood furies, being responsible for the deaths and tortures of countless others. And old habits die hard, before Righteous Endeavor is still a witch hunter as a hobby, whipping up packs after covens and witches to torture them. His favorite? The lash.
Despite a lasting and nightmarish legacy, Righteous Endeavor gets his in Gehenna, during a book where a pack of younger vampires comes calling for him to diablerize him to stave off the Withering. A furious righteous Endeavor attempts to summon his war form, but his powers fail and he's easily brought down, whimpering to God to save him and begging to know why he's been forsaken.
As they bite into him, one vampire remarks "maybe he's as sick of your bullshit as we are."
Mitigating issues?
Nah, not really. I know, a Tzimisce whose evil doesn't rely on body horror, right? righteous Endeavor sticks out for the amounts of mundane torture, rape and vile persecution. It's made explicitly clear the guy is an awful sadist who gets off on religious mania styled torture, and he puts this well above the benefit of the Sabbat. Take a puritan judge like Hathorne or Danforth, empty him of any redeemin qualities, make him a vampire and a brutal sadist and you've got Mr. Righteous Endeavor.
The guy is a horrific sadist, with a massive legacy of evil, whipping up packs into worse and worse violence on the regular. He's unequivocally among the worst of the Sabbat.
Of the other prominent Tzimisce, one of the few others who clears heinousness would be Velya the Vivisectionist but he has a genuine redeeming quality in his true love for his ten year old child bride/childe Elaine Cassidy (yes, really)
Conclusion?
A yes to righteous Endeavor.
See, my concern is, you say he has massive amounts of mundane torture, etc...but when the Tzimisce are infamous for their amounts of Body Horror-related torture, I must confess to having concerns. I'll still lean yes (I'm guessing the rape at least is unique?), but hesitantly.
Edited by ACW on Aug 15th 2022 at 2:46:13 PM
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Giving the tree a glance, Queen Pandora destroyed multiple planets, God Neros starved entire nations, Doctor Giba attacks people with Hate Plague killer bees, Professor Onikichi Kuroda has much lower resources, Carla tried to drain the life force of five children to genocide humanity, and Emperor Gaohm is a Bad Boss. So they all seem fine to me. Plus this is a pretty big franchise with quite a few shows.
Edited by Ordeaux26 on Aug 15th 2022 at 11:45:29 AM
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I would say yeah, all of them do their worst with what they've got. Kuroda and Carla are probably the ones who had the least amount of resources, but even if they were in another Metal Hero series their crimes are bad enough that they'd probably still qualify.
What Ordeaux said.
Edited by ReddishGuy1 on Aug 15th 2022 at 11:48:31 AM
Just imagine something here.Got another one from Dread X Collection 5, this time from Rotten Stigma, where we play as an ex-cop, who arrives at Gallagher Sports Center to find his missing daughter
Walkthrough can be watched here:
Game starts at 15:00 time mark
Who is Director Gallagher?
The director of the compound, who in reality is the leader of a cult, that worshipped a dark god, Aoduk, possesor of all knowledge. Hoping to achieve immortality, due to the belief that if all knowledge of the universe will be stored within him he would never die, the director lured to his compound 12 children (and at least few adults), promising them immortality, while in reality using them as "test subjects" of his experiments and sacrifices to Aoduk. Making them read "The 4 parts book", which led to them growing magic symbols on their bodies, the director then had them mutilated, while they are still alive, while filming snuff material out of it, to earn himself money for his rituals, afterwards offering their bodies to Aoduk, who then turns them into feral monsters, whom he calls "demigods", who only capable to attack and devour anyone they see.
After catching his wife cheating on him, the director has her trapped in "cocoon" in the bathroom and made it a "game", offering a "prize" to anyone who goes to the bathroom and kills her, as she cries, having no hope to get out. Also having fun with other cult members by trapping their victims in cages and playing scenarios on which order they would die, the director created several puzzles to hide the secret of his cult. We heard nothing of what happened to director afterwards, as the protagonist arrives there, searching for his daughter, solves all the puzzles, kills mutated victims of the cult, thus putting them to rest, and finds out that he arrived too late, as his daughter was already transformed, forcing the protagonist to kill her in self-defense, which destroyed him completely, as he kills himself due to immense grief.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
None. While we never meet director in person, there are several notes (including couple, written by him), that details his actions and crimes, with his note, where he "punished" his wife for cheating clearly estabilshed enough personality for him as a sadistic and petty asshole. We see after effect of his crimes, as we fight through the monsters, who were his victims, that were mutated by his rituals.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Dozens of people mutilated and turned into feral monsters, snuff film business, trapping his wife in a bathroom and making a game out of it by promising the prize to whoever arrives there and get it, making it a necessary part that to get to the prize the one, who arrived, must kill her. I think this is pretty unique niche and notable crimes that make him stand out.
Final Verdict?
What do you think?
Edited by VeryVileVillian on Aug 15th 2022 at 9:53:18 PM
Yes to Gallagher. Insert watermelon joke here.
What is the work?
Hunter: Return to Justice is the second TV Movie from the Hunter franchise of Buddy Cop media.
"Rick Hunter investigates after his former partner, Dee Dee McCall's fiancé, San Diego Mayoral Candidate Roger Prescott, kills a burglar in apparent self defense. As Hunter investigates with McCall, they discover that Prescott has a Dark and Troubled Past, and is being hounded by a Russian Mobster."
Who is Vladimir Koskov, and what has he done?
Vladimir Koskov is a former KGB official turned Russian Mobster who wishes to acquire a list of Russian expats to extort or kill, having earned a reputation as the "Butcher of St. Petersburg", due to how many people have historically died at his hands.
After Roger Prescott, real name Mishka Savaransky, lures Vladimir to Roger's home in an attempt on his life, Vladimir meets up with Roger in order to threaten him and his fiancée, Sgt. Dee Dee McCall, in particular threatening to torture McCall.
Koskov has a henchman shoot up a crowded Patio where McCall is discussing how Roger shot Koskov's accomplice with her former partner, Lt. Rick Hunter. When McCall confronts Roger over his past, he comes clean about the stress that Koskov is putting him under, since Roger is protecting numerous Russian expats from being extorted or murdered by Koskov.
Koskov later takes McCall hostage and threatens to dismember her in order to make Roger give him the list.
Once Vladimir has the list, Roger dies in McCall's arms, while Hunter gives chase against Koskov, eventually killing him in a gunfight.
Mitigating Factors?
Wants nothing more than to acquire a list of names and locations to exploit for his own personal gain.Vlad doesn't take the attempt on his life personally, but he does mock Roger/Mishka for not finishing the job. Remember, villainous valour is not necessarily redeeming.
Heinousness?
In terms of Former Regime Personnel, Vlad's got a deservedly vicious reputation as both a Mobster and a KGB official, being known as the "Butcher of St. Petersburg". Onscreen, Vlad has a henchman shoot up a San Diego Patio in order to intimidate a defector and said defector's fiancée, has news clippings detailing his atrocities, and attempts to obtain a list of hundreds of Russian expats intending to extort or kill them, leaving several dead bodies in his wake.He has a projected bodycount in the hundreds from his KGB years, and has a Russian Mob backing him when he kills even more people.
There are other regime personnel (General Mariano, who lets his serial rapist son run rampant and abuses political prisoners comes to mind), but they aren't given nearly the savage reputation of Vladimir.
Verdict?
Bad Vlad is bad.
Stay tuned for more Hunter.

So are we making Monster.Metal Heroes as this makes 8.
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."