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Ok it was mentioned there is not a thread for Law Enforcement Officers (LEO for short)and other similar jobs for discussion.

This is for discussing the actual jobs, ranks, training, culture, relations to military bodies that exist, and any other variety of topics that can arise pertaining to the World of Policing.

SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#6476: Oct 31st 2019 at 4:23:41 AM

Maybe one should pull the 3th amendment against them.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#6477: Oct 31st 2019 at 4:24:42 AM

...The Third Amendment is about quartering soldiers in private homes without owners' consent. That's not exactly what happened here.

Edited by M84 on Oct 31st 2019 at 7:26:27 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
Euodiachloris Since: Oct, 2010
#6478: Oct 31st 2019 at 4:33:04 AM

Well, that's bollocks. Law enforcement to all intents and purposes herded a panicking, armed idiot towards a residential property and partially demolished it getting to him, causing risk to those inside it.

That's stretching "all part and parcel of the arrest, sir" just a smidge far.

Wal-Mart's goods ain't worth that.

Edited by Euodiachloris on Oct 31st 2019 at 11:34:27 AM

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#6479: Oct 31st 2019 at 4:35:01 AM

The issue is that there's already precedent against the lawyers' argument. And courts tend not to like going against precedent.

Besides it stopped being about the Wal-mart goods the moment the idiot tried to escape and resist arrest. Especially when he broke into a house and started firing at cops.

The funny thing is that the shoplifter could have only been charged with an infraction or something considering the relatively low value of the goods he stole.

Edited by M84 on Oct 31st 2019 at 7:42:31 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#6480: Oct 31st 2019 at 4:43:13 AM

We are talking about a Constitution where "freedom of speech" means "spending as much as you like to influence elections" and where "nobody shall be deprived of their liberty without due process of law" means "you have the right to have an abortion", what makes you think that "quartering soldiers" can't include "police officers breaking into your home"?!

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#6481: Oct 31st 2019 at 4:44:17 AM

Well police aren't soldiers for one thing. Nor did the government actually force anyone to allow said police to stay in the house.

Edited by M84 on Oct 31st 2019 at 7:45:29 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
Euodiachloris Since: Oct, 2010
#6482: Oct 31st 2019 at 4:44:23 AM

[up][up][up]Not an excuse in my book.

There are ways and ways to manage somebody resisting arrest (which people with a strong flight-fight reflex will do, often despite their better judgement).

A fair proportion of the population isn't built for the more common freeze. Police should flipping know that by now. And, chasing the hare isn't the only way.

Edited by Euodiachloris on Oct 31st 2019 at 11:46:56 AM

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#6483: Oct 31st 2019 at 4:46:45 AM

Actual lawyers tried to make this argument already and failed. So either the argument itself is flawed or these were really shitty lawyers.

[up]If I were to guess, the cops were probably expecting the guy to go in quietly since the charge would have been a very minor one. It'd be like someone willing to kill cops to avoid being charged for jaywalking.

Edited by M84 on Oct 31st 2019 at 7:52:31 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
Euodiachloris Since: Oct, 2010
#6484: Oct 31st 2019 at 4:48:46 AM

Or the way the precedent as practiced has started being used is egregiously evading responsibilities enshrined in the Bill of Rights.

[up]Sure, from their perspective, this shouldn't have been a big deal to make a fuss about. But, that hare wasn't coming at it from a "just another day at the office" perspective. Most people aren't hardened criminals who know how the system works.

Edited by Euodiachloris on Oct 31st 2019 at 11:55:27 AM

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#6485: Oct 31st 2019 at 4:52:34 AM

For those curious, here's the actual court filing (pdf).

The parties agree that the Takings Clause of the Fifth Amendment “requires compensation when a taking occurs.” Alto Eldorado P’ship v. Cty. of Santa Fe, 634 F.3d 1170, 1174 (10th Cir. 2011); see also U.S. Const. amend. V (providing that private property shall not “be taken for public use, without just compensation”).6 But they disagree about whether a taking occurred here. According to the Lechs, the defendants’ conduct amounts to a taking because (1) the officers physically intruded upon and ultimately destroyed their home and (2) such a “physical appropriation of property gives rise to a per se taking.” Aplt. Br. 9. The defendants, on the other hand, argue that no taking occurred because the officers damaged the Lechs’ home pursuant to the police power, not the power of eminent domain. The district court agreed with the defendants: it concluded that “the tactical decisions that ultimately destroyed [the Lechs’] home were made pursuant to the state’s police powers and not the power of eminent domain.” App. vol. 2, 399. Thus, the district court ruled, the defendants’ conduct did not constitute a taking for purposes of the Taking Clause.

It's also worth noting that the police officers of the city who were being sued weren't the ones who chased the suspect into the house. They only got involved after the suspect triggered a burglar alarm in the house.

It'll be interesting to see what happens if this case does indeed get all the way to the Supreme Court.

Edited by M84 on Oct 31st 2019 at 8:01:34 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
Euodiachloris Since: Oct, 2010
#6486: Oct 31st 2019 at 5:00:06 AM

Nice weasel: "they didn't take it — sure, they broke it, but they didn't take it".

I'll try that line the next time I break something in a physical store, then. tongue

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#6487: Oct 31st 2019 at 5:02:01 AM

[up]You wouldn't be charged with shoplifting at least. You'd be charged with property damage.

This is why you gotta frame your arguments carefully in the court of law. Exact words matter.

The funny thing is that you could end up suffering an even more serious charge depending on what you broke and what state you broke it in than if it was just a shoplifting charge.

Makes sense if you think about it — you'd feel worse if someone destroyed your stuff than if they just stole it.

Edited by M84 on Oct 31st 2019 at 8:10:23 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
Ominae Since: Jul, 2010
#6489: Nov 1st 2019 at 10:21:23 AM

On the Essex case, the driver is going to show up in court.

Public Security police in Vietnam announced the arrest of two persons, supposedly responsible for bringing the illegal migrants to Europe.

FluffyMcChicken My Hair Provides Affordable Healthcare from where the floating lights gleam Since: Jun, 2014 Relationship Status: In another castle
My Hair Provides Affordable Healthcare
#6490: Nov 2nd 2019 at 12:44:00 AM

Cross-posting from the Military Thread:

The first half of the 2019 National Day parades in Taiwan are dedicated to the ROC Armed Forces.

Beginning at the 59 minute mark, the Marines demonstrate room-clearing tactics in a hostage situation. Some interesting pieces of equipment used is an explosive mounted at the end of a stick to destroy windows, ballistic shields mounted on the bottom of M P5s, and a special metal detector used to check if a door is booby trapped. It's interesting to see how the soldiers are trained to check downed enemies, furniture, and the hostages for booby traps by feeling around them as they clear a room.

AngelusNox Warder of the damned from The guard of the gates of oblivion Since: Dec, 2014 Relationship Status: Married to the job
Warder of the damned
#6491: Nov 3rd 2019 at 6:09:10 PM

One of the PMESP finest Sergeants passed away yesterday.

Sgt Rua, one of our oldest and most experienced Tactical Force member died due to a gunshot to the stomach during patrol in an armed robbery call.

He was one of the best shooting instructors of the PMESP academy body.

I've got some friends who were his students, they got nothing but praise to say about him and his instructions.

The Internal Affairs still trying to figure out what happened.

Inter arma enim silent leges
AngelusNox Warder of the damned from The guard of the gates of oblivion Since: Dec, 2014 Relationship Status: Married to the job
Warder of the damned
#6492: Nov 13th 2019 at 1:23:56 PM

Yesterday we lost a Private Second Class during a shooting exercise due to a Negligent Discharge.

I did the basic with said private and he died because another private loaded his handgun and it allegedly fired when he chambered a round into it.

I and my friends went to the funeral to pay our respects and sadly an impromptu meetup of our basic course happened.

We're still a bit shocked for his death. He was the oldest of 5 brothers and an example of a good soldier.

Inter arma enim silent leges
TuefelHundenIV Night Clerk of the Apocalypse from Doomsday Facility Corner Store. Since: Aug, 2009 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
Night Clerk of the Apocalypse
#6493: Nov 13th 2019 at 3:06:37 PM

Damn man, that sucks hard. Sorry to hear you lost one.

Who watches the watchmen?
Ominae Since: Jul, 2010
#6494: Nov 16th 2019 at 10:33:54 PM

The Narcotics Control Department busted another celebrity.

Japanese actress Erika Sawajiri, famous for her role in 2005 drama "1 Liter of Tears," has been arrested on suspicion of possessing drugs, NHK reported on Saturday citing unnamed sources.

The 33-year-old actress, who this year starred in a TV adaption of Toyoko Yamasaki's hit novel "Shiroi Kyoto," was arrested in Tokyo on suspicion of possessing ecstasy, although few other details are known, NHK said.

Tear-jerker "1 Liter of Tears" made Sawajiri famous not only in Japan but across Asia with the drama's depiction of its heroine's physical deterioration from a rare disease.

Drug arrests are treated seriously in Japan with celebrities who are caught frequently edited out of movies and TV shows.

The Tokyo police did not immediately respond to a request for comment. Sawajiri's talent agency was not immediately reachable for comment.

As of now IIRC, she personally admitted to using MDMA.

Edited by Ominae on Nov 17th 2019 at 12:44:38 PM

TuefelHundenIV Night Clerk of the Apocalypse from Doomsday Facility Corner Store. Since: Aug, 2009 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
Night Clerk of the Apocalypse
#6495: Nov 17th 2019 at 5:37:20 AM

Man they are just going to town, aren't they. I wonder who else will be snatched up?

Edited by TuefelHundenIV on Nov 17th 2019 at 7:37:48 AM

Who watches the watchmen?
Ominae Since: Jul, 2010
#6496: Nov 17th 2019 at 7:38:00 AM

Depend on which celebrity in Tokyo "will admit" to using drugs if someone "informs" the NCD.

AFP Since: Mar, 2010
#6497: Nov 17th 2019 at 9:15:00 PM

Oh, it's over ecstasy? From the headline, I was hoping they found her with a Nissan Skyline packed with cocaine or something.

Ominae Since: Jul, 2010
#6498: Nov 17th 2019 at 9:35:37 PM

Actually, the police searched her residence.

The MPD received an anonymous tip. Kinda like how Pierre Taki was busted.

archonspeaks Since: Jun, 2013
#6499: Nov 17th 2019 at 9:39:03 PM

Busting people for low-level possession or use like that is a seriously massive waste of time.

They should have sent a poet.
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#6500: Nov 17th 2019 at 9:40:22 PM

Yeah, but that's Japan for you. They take drug use very seriously over there.

Disgusted, but not surprised

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