TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

Kyon: Big Damn Hero

Go To

Eamil from Somewhere over there. Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
#12776: Aug 22nd 2012 at 10:18:39 PM

[up]@Mad Kitsu: That was how I had read that scene up until now too, but when Specular posted that snip I read it more closely. It says that the environment was horribly irradiated and full of energy and whatnot, except for a 12-kilometer circle centered on where Kuyou and the others were (including the black hole), meaning that the black hole couldn't have been the source because it was inside the "safe zone."

edited 22nd Aug '12 10:18:57 PM by Eamil

alethiophile Shadowed Philosopher from Ëa Since: Nov, 2009
Shadowed Philosopher
#12777: Aug 22nd 2012 at 10:36:19 PM

Yeah, that was my reading as well. It's noted that it's "an entire universe that ends just beyond the Earth's orbit"; one can't imagine that such a place, created on the whim of a sentient black hole, would be exactly pleasant for carbon-based life without direct intervention.

Shinigan (Naruto fanfic)
Grahf Since: Jan, 2001
#12778: Aug 22nd 2012 at 10:45:36 PM

Oh. So a fitting analogy would be like it's The Wyld from Exalted. Basic unshaped chaos that only gets worse the further you get from the single bastion of sanity.

alethiophile Shadowed Philosopher from Ëa Since: Nov, 2009
Shadowed Philosopher
#12779: Aug 22nd 2012 at 10:49:52 PM

Never having played Exalted, I cannot comment as to the validity of that analogy. The capsule description, however, sounds right.

Shinigan (Naruto fanfic)
MarqFJA The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer from Deserts of the Middle East (Before Recorded History) Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer
#12780: Aug 23rd 2012 at 1:58:06 AM

maybe Sasaki's Closed Space (available 24/7 with a working electrical grid)
... You gotta be kidding me.

[up][up][up] I still stand by my stance that the black hole only comprises one part of Kuyou, and not a "major" one at that. Crucial, yes, but not "major" as in "comprises most of her (physical) being".

Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.
Specular Since: Sep, 2011
#12781: Aug 23rd 2012 at 11:10:50 AM

Re: Kami plane

IIRC, the term "kami plane" comes from Rika's PoV and I think it's reasonable for her to understand the supernatural in her own terms. I mean, if she considers Hanyuu a shinto goddess then it wouldn't be to far-fetched for her to assume that other related mystical phenomena could also be true, including the "spirit world" she apparently can glimpse during full moon, whatever that means (I'm pretty much out of my depth with kind of mysticism).

For Yuki, things are different. From her PoV, Hanyuu is a data entity and the place where she exists within is described as a "wavelength that is restricted from casual access to baseline physical reality", probably one of the subordinate spaces of the C-Y manifold.


Re: Shadow song

Just a little addendum. After Kanae and Ryouko arrived for the first time to Kuyou's shadow song in SB-5, the latter immediately described it as "some place terrifying and dangerous".


Re: Closed space

That titbit comes from the ninth novel*

:

I walked beside Tachibana Kyouko and watched how naturally the electronic sliding glass door opened. This is like how it is usually too. I don't know what the theory behind it is, but for some reason, there is electricity in this world too.

I'm guessing there is also running tap water*

but no internet access [lol].


Re: Kuyou

About Kuyou's true nature, I'm currently inclined to think she is the Anthropomorphic Personification (Moe Anthropomorphism, IMHO) of one of the Four Fundamental Forces. If this WMG ends being true, I can already picture a likely entry for the YMMV page:


Re: Kanae

After thinking about it I remember that old idea of Kanae using her power to give herself a Hammerspace/Hyperspace Arsenal of sorts by using one of the above spaces or maybe a Pocket Dimension created by Yuki and Haruhi for this specific purpose (or a very secure storehouse somewhere) as storage space and pulling out things from there as needed.

I don't see Kanae playing the role of The Gunslinger and equipping weapons and ammo a la Futaba Aoi or Tatsumiya Mana, but I think it would work nicely as a support skill for the group. Bonus Points if it doubles as a garage for a Cool Bike (I still haven't given up on that idea smile) or a Hyperspace Wardrobe.

OOC idea for Kanae: Step 1: Stockpile cannon balls or something a similar size and weight. Step 2: Teleport a few of them a couple of dozens of meters above the target. Step 3: Let the gravity do the rest. (steamroller optional but impractical)


Weapon upgrade.

While I was writing the next last paragraph I wondered if Kyon could extent his weapons' autonomy time by storing energy in some sort of external container and resorting to it when the reserves are running low or perhaps to power up a Finishing Move if required (think of the cartridge system from Lyrical Nanoha). Bonus Points if said energy containers can be used as makeshift grenades.

I also wonder if Haruhi would be willing to use her Energy Attack Drones to regularly recharge these containers. It sounds like something too boring for her tastes, though.

My K:BDH Recursive Fanfiction
MarqFJA The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer from Deserts of the Middle East (Before Recorded History) Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer
#12782: Aug 23rd 2012 at 11:24:15 AM

Oh! I thought he meant "Sasaki's Closed Space is available provided that you have access to an electrical power grid to supply your power consumption needs", rather than "Sasaki's Closed Space comes with a working force of electromagnetism, allowing for electrical transmission and other electromagnetism-dependent phenomena".

About Kuyou's true nature, I'm currently inclined to think she is the Anthropomorphic Personification (Moe Anthropomorphism, IMHO) of one of the Four Fundamental Forces.
Only one force? I say she's either the embodiment of all of those four forces at once — or more accurately, the very "fabric" of space itself that is necessary for those fundamental forces' existence (and from which they essentially emanate), given that her "race" is collectively the Calabi-Yau manifold's embodiment, and apparently there's no significant difference between each "member" of the Chorus.

edited 23rd Aug '12 11:28:49 AM by MarqFJA

Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.
Specular Since: Sep, 2011
#12783: Aug 23rd 2012 at 12:25:27 PM

@Marq FJA:

From OB-7:

"The Other was forced to maintain that disruptive, unharmonious noise; this is why she chose not to adapt when I altered state," Kuyou explained. "As that space is composed of subordinate instances of...."

She trailed off and Yuki seamlessly continued, "...other entities which fill roles similar to Suou Kuyou's." She blinked, turning to regard Kuyou curiously and commenting, "There exists both a goal of unity and separation within your ... kind."

"Unified and distinct," Kuyou agreed. "Harmonious yet separate."

"The same way light is both a particle and a wave?" Kyon asked, rolling his eyes.

"Yes," Kuyou and Yuki answered simultaneously, the dark-haired entity's reply significantly more enthusiastic than her counterpart's.

The bits about "other entities" and "your kind" is what makes me think Kuyou represents only one fundamental force, but inherently connected to the others (maybe they are like her siblings from her PoV).

Unrelated thought: GUT + S.K. = TOE? Now I know the unified field theory is pretty much an impossibility in K:BDH universe unless Kuyou decides to play nice before the eyes of the humanity. After all how could you encompass sentience of that level within the scope of theoretical physics and still be considered science?


Random image. AFAIK, that's the only picture featuring the three of them (could someone prove me wrong, please?).

My K:BDH Recursive Fanfiction
alethiophile Shadowed Philosopher from Ëa Since: Nov, 2009
Shadowed Philosopher
#12784: Aug 23rd 2012 at 12:27:45 PM

The talk about 'rotations' and how she refers to the singularity she assembles against Emiri as a separate (potentially sophont) entity both suggest that Kuyou is, at least, specifically associated with one particular (rapidly spinning) black hole. However, she's also clearly something bigger than that. I would imagine that she is related to gravity specifically, and the other members of the Chorus she refers to are related to other forces.

Shinigan (Naruto fanfic)
Grahf Since: Jan, 2001
#12785: Aug 23rd 2012 at 1:10:17 PM

Random image. AFAIK, that's the only picture featuring the three of them (could someone prove me wrong, please?).

I'm not exactly an expert in this field, but I've only ever seen that one image that has all of them. There's really barely any images that have Michiru or Mikuru(big) in them. Perhaps when another season gets made, because it should cover those events, one would think.

Specular Since: Sep, 2011
#12786: Aug 23rd 2012 at 7:36:27 PM

[up] I feared so sad.

edited 23rd Aug '12 8:03:41 PM by Specular

My K:BDH Recursive Fanfiction
Eamil from Somewhere over there. Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
#12787: Aug 23rd 2012 at 10:11:25 PM

I wasn't aware that there was a visual difference between Mikuru and "Michiru." [lol]

MadKitsu Why do I need a title again? from Somewhere Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Mu
Why do I need a title again?
#12788: Aug 24th 2012 at 4:14:03 AM

...I think that that was the joke.

But, in all seriousness, it would be interesting if such an image appeared in front of Kyon...

Ahah!

Perhaps Mikuru and Michiru can exist together at one point via a Gemini incident, with Big!Asahina standing with them, ready to give them orders, and while they are all there, they pose for a picture similar to the one we have seen, while Kyon gets a mental overload from just being present and faints. Bonus points if all three of them are sporting ponytails while posing when that happens, and someone lampshades the whole thing...

edited 24th Aug '12 4:14:40 AM by MadKitsu

I have returned, and my vacation in the void was so boring...
Specular Since: Sep, 2011
#12789: Aug 24th 2012 at 1:08:00 PM

[up] Actually, I'm kind of expecting that Big!Asahina will eventually put Mikuru's skill to test by entrusting her with a low level mission but without telling her exactly how she is supposed to accomplish it and where she will need to take the initiative and arrange the involvement of her near-future self (Michiru).


Unrelated.

Some time ago I posted two 3dCGs of Miyoko while thinking that said character design was fanon, but recently I discovered I was mistaken and it's in fact from the manga: pic1, pic2, pic3, pic4, pic5 (first meeting with Haruhi), pic6, pic7, pic8.

My K:BDH Recursive Fanfiction
MarqFJA The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer from Deserts of the Middle East (Before Recorded History) Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer
#12790: Aug 24th 2012 at 1:57:01 PM

From what I can see, the only ostensible difference between Mikuru and "Michiru" seems to be that "Michiru" does not wear kneesocks — maybe regular socks, but not kneesocks.

Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.
MadKitsu Why do I need a title again? from Somewhere Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Mu
Why do I need a title again?
#12791: Aug 25th 2012 at 10:16:47 AM

[up][up]: Miyoko looks like that?!? No wonder there was some level of confusion, kitsu...

Not to mention that Kyon's worry about her in K:BDH is entirely justified, as he thinks that a guy might ask her out and either not realize that she's Younger than She Looks, or worse, that the guy knows it and will not care...

edited 25th Aug '12 10:17:07 AM by MadKitsu

I have returned, and my vacation in the void was so boring...
MarqFJA The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer from Deserts of the Middle East (Before Recorded History) Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer
#12792: Aug 25th 2012 at 11:10:14 AM

Yeah, no kidding. I thought the Younger than She Looks thing was mostly in the chest area; man, she's considerably taller than Imouto, ain't she? How come the latter doesn't express repeated petulant complaints about the former getting a head start on her, or stealing her height, or any other comedic height-based reaction?

Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.
Specular Since: Sep, 2011
#12793: Aug 25th 2012 at 2:07:20 PM

Notice:

Draft of the new chapter available in Soulriders.net.




From what I can see, the only ostensible difference between Mikuru and "Michiru" seems to be that "Michiru" does not wear kneesocks — maybe regular socks, but not kneesocks.

On the subject of being able to differentiate time-divergent versions of a person in-story, there is an article in tailsteak.com called "Basic Time Travel Etiquette" where the author suggest the following:

When dealing with duplicates of yourself, immediately change your appearance to prevent confusion - pretending to be your younger self can be amusing, but those types of practical jokes inevitably turn sour. Whichever version of you is visiting from elsewhen (whether older or younger) is the one who has the responsibility to make the change. Generally, you would cut your hair shorter and start going by your middle name - that's why your parents gave you one! If you have more duplicates than middle names, refer to yourselves by either the Greek alphabet or the military callsigns (whichever you have memorized), with Alpha being the youngest. Consistency, here, is key - if the group of you changes eras, stay with the same names. The whole point is to avoid confusion, both for others and amongst yourselves.

In Mikuru's case, they already have covered their bases about potential naming issues but if there is a Gemini in her Yet, Kyon could need some kind of visual cue to tell them apart. Surely Achakura could distinguish Junior from Elder and share that knowledge with the whole Brigade via an AR construct (most likely a icon above Michiru's head), but I think Kyon would undoubtedly insist in a hairdo change for the time being.


Re: Miyoko

How come the latter doesn't express repeated petulant complaints about the former getting a head start on her, or stealing her height, or any other comedic height-based reaction?

IIRC, Miyoko mentioned that Nonoko was a bit concerned about her small size in comparison to the rest of their class, but it seems unlikely that she would hold that against her best friend, even if said friend is quite literally One Head Taller than Nonoko. Out of curiosity, is there a trope for Huge Girl Tiny Girl?

Just a little game. Can you find Taniguchi in the above picture.


Random thought.

If Nonoko goes for the Henshin Hero variant of Magical Girl, do you think she would request an Older Alter Ego as part of the deal? (final results may vary from picture) Although, I think she would get tired of it sooner than later:

Nonoko : I didn't know how annoying older boys can get.
Miyoko : Welcome to My World.

My K:BDH Recursive Fanfiction
MarqFJA The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer from Deserts of the Middle East (Before Recorded History) Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer
#12794: Aug 25th 2012 at 4:31:31 PM

In Mikuru's case, they already have covered their bases about potential naming issues but if there is a Gemini in her Yet, Kyon could need some kind of visual cue to tell them apart. Surely Achakura could distinguish Junior from Elder and share that knowledge with the whole Brigade via an AR construct (most likely a icon above Michiru's head), but I think Kyon would undoubtedly insist in a hairdo change for the time being.
I don't remember older!Mikuru being ever called "Michiru".

but it seems unlikely that she would hold that against her best friend
I didn't intend to sound like I was expecting her to hold a grudge against Miyoko. It's more of a childish envy/comically semi-whiny complaining thing.

Nonoko: I didn't know how annoying older boys can get.
And creepy. And gross. And prone to get stuck on a single-track thought process involving very improper topics. And... Well, you get the picture.

edited 25th Aug '12 4:33:26 PM by MarqFJA

Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.
Eamil from Somewhere over there. Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
#12795: Aug 25th 2012 at 9:01:13 PM

The only thing that confuses me about Miyoko's character design is, what color is her hair supposed to be? Does she have no official hair color and that's why whoever made those 3D images made her hair black?

(I ask 'cause her hair is decidedly not black in the manga images shown.)

And yeah, I'm not surprised by Miyoko's height so much as I've been in a perpetual state of confusion about Nonoko's short stature. She's supposed to be 11 years old as of the start of the series but looks more like she's 7 or 8 at best. An 11-year-old girl shouldn't still be able to fit in a (fairly large, admittedly) duffel bag the way she did in the anime version of Lonely Island Syndrome.

Edit: Come to think of it, I seem to recall BDH-Miyoko having some A-Cup Angst going on so I don't think the Younger than She Looks had anything to do with her chest at all. [lol]

edited 25th Aug '12 9:05:34 PM by Eamil

MarqFJA The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer from Deserts of the Middle East (Before Recorded History) Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer
#12796: Aug 26th 2012 at 1:20:27 PM

Well, somebody here told me that she did have a bigger bust than is usual for her age, though I interpreted it as "she started puberty early, and thus her breasts started developing whereas a same-aged peer like Imouto hasn't, thus the latter is board-flat while Miyoko is at least not flat at all (not to say that she's anywhere near big)".

Oh, and the A-Cup Angst was when she compared herself to Haruhi, Tsuruya and Mikuru, which is perfectly understandable.

edited 26th Aug '12 1:21:46 PM by MarqFJA

Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.
Agasa Since: Jan, 2011
#12797: Aug 26th 2012 at 5:26:50 PM

I actually already... borrowed Miyoko's sprites. In the game, she's going to be a light brunette.

Savoie Since: Mar, 2010
#12798: Aug 26th 2012 at 7:13:48 PM

The funny part is that Miyoko is closer to Koizumi's size than Kyouko is...

MarqFJA The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer from Deserts of the Middle East (Before Recorded History) Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
Grahf Since: Jan, 2001
#12800: Aug 27th 2012 at 1:17:26 AM

I don't remember older!Mikuru being ever called "Michiru".

I believe in this case the older Mikuru being referred to is the one that's only a day or two older, temporally speaking. Mikuru!Big has never been called Michiru, but the temporally displaced Mikuru has, in order to pass off as Mikuru's "twin sister".


Total posts: 14,780
Top