Two problems with this. Banner is in control and he doesn't start fights like the Hulk would and second, Bob establishes the void and his powers are a packaged deal. So if he's using his powers, they will have bigger problems
Them agreeing to things to protect Bob, on the caveat that if Valentina tries anything, they'll talk and bury her as well, seems to be their motivation. I also suspect Bucky joined just to keep on eye on them in general.
Consider this. Bucky refused to work with John before (for good reason) and the man literally bloodied the shield due to cracking under the pressure. He might figure that this time, watching John to keep him from slipping is a good idea. It also lets him keep Valentina close as well.
They still sold out, but for a reason.
One Strip! One Strip!I dunno, Valentina is the one who experimented on Bob in the first place, and they don't really need Valentina to do that really. Seriously, letting her go scott free with the assumption they can control her is pretty stupid. I've seen a lot of arguments for it, but I'm not convinced. They are letting a corrupt CIA director who has experimented on American citizens and was SO close to getting impeached go free.
"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"Like I said, she's discount Waller IMO and not as charismatic.
Waller at least had leverage against the Squad and the likes of Batman to prevent a takeover.
And it makes the ending bad because the entire time the movie builds up to Fontaine getting defeated and impeached but NOPE. The Thunderbolts go along with this even though they could have easily called her out, and BUCKY is a legitimate congressman who could change the narrative since he's against her in the impeachment case.
"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"They have an potential apocalypse with legs 5 meters away from them, it's not like they're in a position to aggravate the situation.
"Waller at least had leverage against the Squad and the likes of Batman to prevent a takeover."
And one believing that Batman is a hero.
Edited by AlexHopeLife on May 4th 2025 at 9:16:45 AM
![]()
![]()
![]()
I mean, my read, though they aren't explicit about that is that their available choices are 'work together' or at minimum Bob is getting locked up until the end of time, with every possibility that all of them, except Bucky, are going with him, as they've all been running around committing large numbers of crimes at Val's behest and if she goes down, she's taking everyone with her. I don't love it, but I do think it's a lot closer to MAD than anything else, which is admittedly muddied by 'we own you' but I think the argument is that they just had a lot less to lose as they have the skills and strength to run on their own, which Val simply doesn't, relying on wealth/allies who she would lose if this came out. It's not that they're going along out of fear of what Val would do (or that this was really her plan in some Xanatos way) but that no one except them knows that Bob was the horrible monster that traumatized all of New York by locking everyone in their worst memories...that only remains true so long as everybody shuts up and there's no way to out Val without outing Bob.
Edited by ECD on May 4th 2025 at 9:13:23 AM
I do wonder if Doom trying to recruit the Void is how the New Avengers get involved in Doomsday.
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup threadThe only thing that makes the ending really awkward, to me, is Bucky. I think it's in character for the rest of them to find putting de Fontaine under their thumb, keeping her powerless and unable to hurt anyone else, while profiting off of her - it's in keeping with them being selfish but good people willing to do the right thing but also perfectly happy to take advantage for profit at the same time.
It's Bucky, whose entire stake in this story was to stop de Fontaine and bring her to justice, that's the dissonant factor. There's no reason for Bucky to go along with it. The bit at the end with him arguing with Sam over it also really weird.
Speaking of the opening, I wonder if the people Bob void-ed offscreen in the medical center came back.
Edited by KnownUnknown on May 4th 2025 at 9:22:47 AM
They probably don't know how to weave a government who isn't corrupt into the setting. A crooked government is an easy narrative tool to keep the heroes as underdogs despite their powers, and writing a "good" government now is a minefield because no one agrees on how a "good" government would work, and Hollywood writers treating "The Man" as "good" would be treated as reactionary.
Edit: that applies to Marvel and DC alike.
Edited by TomWithoutJerry on May 4th 2025 at 1:56:50 PM
Please remember that, ultimately, fictional works of entertainment are just that.Bucky going along with the ending completely ruined the congressman's case of trying to impeach Fontaine. That man had a reasonable speech about trusting the system to take out women like her, and Bucky completely ruins his efforts, it's baffling.
"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
I mean, the federal government in the MCU is simply such a total failure at any of this, that trusting them is insane. I would like it if it was different, but of course Bucky doesn't actually trust the system, it's insanely corrupt in every possible way.
![]()
So government's in American superhero fiction need to operate in a very narrow (and somewhat schizophrenic fashion). They need to be good/moral enough that the hero handing over at least low-level threats for trial/punishment is an acceptable end to a story, but incompetent enough that the hero needs to do the work and it can't just be cops, AND they need to have some form of escalation dominance which allows them to be a massive threat to the hero, if the hero ever is framed/does anything wrong/the government is taken over by bad guys. This is deeply annoying to me, but is such a genre staple at this point that I don't think it's going anywhere.
And I think every time a superhero or a group of superheroes tries to take on a role of political power to improve the world, it usually ends badly. (Not counting guys like Black Panther or Aquaman, who are already rulers to begin with)
I don't think there is a single "Superman or (Superman Expy) is the new ruler" story that ends well.
Edited by AlexHopeLife on May 4th 2025 at 11:23:17 AM
Apparently they are spoiling what the asterisk means now in the marketing. Look at this billboard:
Edited by BigBadShadow25 on May 4th 2025 at 2:25:50 PM
You’re Gonna Carry That Weight.

Val set up the Xanatos Gambit for them to become the New Avengers with them relucantly accepting it otherwise they'd pop her off on the spot. Taskmaster dying wasn't intended in the operation but worked regardless for them to assemble. It's not bad, but it's somewhat an unprecedented ending.