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KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#651: May 3rd 2025 at 6:02:23 PM

Yeah, Bucky just kind of strikes me as... tired beyond belief. He's been doing this for almost twice as long as most people even live.

The movie isn't super about him, but also there is a sense that just like Steve he can't just sit still and let a situation stew when he could be going out and doing something about it, but is in a job that forces him to basically do nothing. ( or was, I guess)

I do wonder what happened with the impeachment. The implication is that de Fontaine's ultimate punishment is to be trapped under the thumb of all the people she tried to manipulate, but that does imply that Bucky kept the truth from the people he was working or somehow convinced the congressman to go along with it.

ArthurEld Since: May, 2014
#652: May 3rd 2025 at 6:03:35 PM

Probably because getting the team to testify would also implicate them in enough crimes to put them all in prison for the rest of their lives.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#653: May 3rd 2025 at 6:17:45 PM

Honestly, I’m surprised some of them didn’t go with it.

Defontaine’s just too dangerous to be allowed to walk free, even if she’s in a sort of Mutually Assured Destruction scenario with 3 out of 5 Thunderbolts members.

Bucky might have chosen to go along with it to spare them, or maybe it was more about protecting Bob (if people knew he was that flying shadow guy, shit might become 3 dimensional and strike multiple rotational devices very quickly) from both attempted reprisal, and a potential slip-up.

This might also be why Sam’s not too keen on them calling themselves the Avengers.

Bucky might also be keeping a bit of an eye on them, as he’s aware these people are all messed up.

Edited by HandsomeRob on May 3rd 2025 at 6:18:00 AM

One Strip! One Strip!
ArthurEld Since: May, 2014
#654: May 3rd 2025 at 6:22:23 PM

It all depends on how things shake out afterwards. She could essentially be Director in name only.

We won't really know until/if she appears again.

AlexHopeLife Since: Feb, 2025
#655: May 3rd 2025 at 6:26:43 PM

Valentina is now aware that she cannot control the "god" she herself created, so she has lost that tactical advantage.

Synchronicity (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#656: May 3rd 2025 at 7:15:02 PM

Also, q about Yelena’s general loneliness: did Melina get Chuck Cunningham Syndrome’d? (I also assume she and Kate aren’t texting or anything)

ArthurEld Since: May, 2014
#657: May 3rd 2025 at 7:29:56 PM

Yeah, presumably she's either looking after the other Widows and/or is simply withdrawn. The fact that Alexei doesn't seem to have seen her either would suggest both.

Also, looking at Jake Schreier's past two movies, I have to say this is a case where Marvel's tendency to cast a wide net for such creatives really paid off well.

BigBadShadow25 With my last breath, I curse Zoidberg. from Basement at the Alamo (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: Desperate
With my last breath, I curse Zoidberg.
#658: May 3rd 2025 at 7:30:21 PM

I imagine that Melina is underground doing other important work that is preventing her from reaching her family.

[nja]ed.

Edited by BigBadShadow25 on May 3rd 2025 at 10:30:40 AM

You’re Gonna Carry That Weight.
AlexHopeLife Since: Feb, 2025
#659: May 3rd 2025 at 8:10:00 PM

One potential funny scene in Doomsday would ve the Mighty Avengers' reaction when the "homeless guy" throws Hulk to another country.

Edited by AlexHopeLife on May 3rd 2025 at 8:11:28 AM

RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#660: May 3rd 2025 at 8:20:28 PM

Oh right, Yelena was in Hawkeye, I missed that.

What happened to her there?

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
KRider Desire Grand Prix Entry from Origin System Since: Feb, 2021
Desire Grand Prix Entry
#661: May 3rd 2025 at 8:22:57 PM

[up]She was hired by either Kate's mother or Val to kill Hawkeye w/ the added incentive that Val told her that Clint was the last person w/ Natasha when she died. Yelena ultimately did not do her job and had awesome chemistry w/ Kate Bishop instead w/c was 1 of the show's highlights.

Set! Avenge! "Henshin." Black General! Bujin Sword! Ready, Fight!
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#662: May 3rd 2025 at 8:23:16 PM

She thought Clint killed Natasha and was essentially on the warpath trying to kill him for revenge, and spent most of it trading initially-dangerous-but-increasingly-friendly banter with Kate who largely took point in trying to stop her.

[nja]'d

Tbh, I think the most surprising thing about the end of this is that Natasha ended up on a superteam that didn't include Kate, given how good their rapport ended up being in that show.

Edited by KnownUnknown on May 3rd 2025 at 8:25:51 AM

RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#663: May 3rd 2025 at 8:26:35 PM

Huh, I missed that, I genuinely thought she went from Black Widow to here, because I only remembered Fontaine being at the end of Widow and forgot what their convo was about.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#664: May 3rd 2025 at 8:37:08 PM

Bob/Kate/Yelena polycule!

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#665: May 3rd 2025 at 8:44:52 PM

Man, Bob has a pretty sweet deal at the end.

So how do we feel about the New Avengers? I'm getting vibes of them selling out, and it's not just Red Guardian, Bucky going along with this means Fontaine evades justice and the Congressman's case got thrown out. Hell, Bucky even mentions Sam and him broke off.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#666: May 3rd 2025 at 8:47:19 PM

It's been pretty clear for years that my favorite Team of New Avengers was never getting adapted, and I'm mostly fine with this one.

It's all going to depends on if they actually get any further adventures or if, like the last new group of Avengers (the post Ultron ones), the next story just skips to their last mission together.

RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#667: May 3rd 2025 at 8:50:56 PM

I guess I'm one of the few people here who genuinely feel uncomfortable with how they dealt with Fontaine at the end when they went along with her narrative instead of calling her out and exposing all her various crimes including the Sentry project. Even Bucky of all people, who was working with the other Congressman to impeach her.

I dunno, it feels like them selling out, and trying to blackmail Fontaine like this will backfire in the next crisis.

Edited by RedHunter543 on May 3rd 2025 at 11:51:07 PM

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
ArthurEld Since: May, 2014
#668: May 3rd 2025 at 9:34:35 PM

If it comes up, it'll probably be like Ross telling Rhodey off in Infinity War. That is, an incredibly minor footnote in the larger narrative that takes up roughly sixty seconds of screen time, max.

Edited by ArthurEld on May 3rd 2025 at 9:34:49 AM

RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#669: May 3rd 2025 at 9:44:50 PM

I guess them selling out was foreshadowed with Yelena’s talk with Red Guardian and her asking for a public facing role, but it still left a bad taste in my mouth as an ending.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
Hawkeye86 Spirit of Battle from Classified (Searching for Spock) Relationship Status: You can be my wingman any time
Spirit of Battle
#670: May 3rd 2025 at 9:47:29 PM

[up]I mean they all completely sold out, there is no question about that. It really depends on how it plays out later on, and like [up][up] brought up, it will probably barely get mentioned again.

You and I remember Budapest very differently
RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#671: May 3rd 2025 at 9:51:04 PM

This is a plot point that’s feeling like an MCU version of the the Seven but a lot less psychotic.

I’m actually intrigued to see where it goes. It’s no comic book Thunderbolts but very New Warriors reality tv esque era.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
ArthurEld Since: May, 2014
#672: May 3rd 2025 at 10:04:59 PM

Also, I doubt it will come up one way or the other, but I hope MCU Yelena is eventually confirmed to be aroace like in the comics.

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#673: May 4th 2025 at 4:23:25 AM

I don't necessarily see it as selling out since they're also doing it to protect Bob.

But yes, they could have had Bucky introduce them as New Avengers and her arrested.

Edited by CharlesPhipps on May 4th 2025 at 4:23:55 AM

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
chino514 (Apprentice)
#674: May 4th 2025 at 4:33:56 AM

Do we know if she's in Doomsday?

Whowho Since: May, 2012
#675: May 4th 2025 at 4:42:06 AM

I really enjoyed the film. The characters were well realised and they all had great chemistry with each other. The fight choreography was superb. My only criticism was the fight in Avengers Tower didn't work for me at all and of course Taskmaster being wasted

Spending my life living with both Bipolar disorder and DID means this film hit me where I live.

Damn I love Bob. The performance was so good and really made a character I loathed from the comics work so very well.

I like how this sits in the MCU in terms of world building. It makes sense to me that you can, in this world manipulate people into promises of becoming super heroes, and also that now that the original generation of superheroes are increasingly disassembled, the government would be scrambling to make their own, not so good versions of them.

I like the narrative of John Walker being a substandard government knock-off of captain America, refusing to come to terms with that, and ending up on a substandard government knock-off the avengers.


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