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How do you know that something has an "Original Flavor"?

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SoyValdo7 I mainly fix indentation issues from La tierra de lagos y volcanes Since: Sep, 2022 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
I mainly fix indentation issues
#1: Aug 1st 2024 at 2:53:37 PM

According to the description, Original Flavour is "a Fanfic that attempts to emulate the tone, atmosphere and style of its inspiration as closely as possible. The goal of the Original Flavour fic is to seem as though the original production team could have thought it up." But how is that determined? Most examples are just fandom declaring that a fic has original flavor, which is effectively Audience Reaction, not an objective trope. The trope also doesn't seem to take into account the change in medium, so it's unclear what the requirements are for written fanfiction to have the original flavour of a movie with sounds and visual effects or a video game with interectical mechanics.

Furthermore, the description states the rule that "you (usually) don't introduce or kill core characters, revise continuity, or do anything that is non-canon beyond the events of your story." to have original flavour . But then it is mentioned that "it is possible to pull these off and still maintain this trope, but only if it's in a way that the canon itself could have evolved (as opposed to anything drastic)", which again, sounds very subjective, as fanfic in general to emulate the original work, while adding new concepts that fall into the realm of what is possible for the work.

Edited by SoyValdo7 on Aug 1st 2024 at 3:53:53 AM

Valdo
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#2: Aug 1st 2024 at 4:38:47 PM

as fanfic in general to emulate the original work, while adding new concepts that fall into the realm of what is possible for the work.


Not really. A lot of fanfics completely change the tone, setting, genre... Original Flavor is for the fics that intentionally only do what's possible in canon. As a fic writer myself who goes for Original Flavor I can tell you it's an intentional choice for me to keep as close to canon as possible. It's not a general theme with fanfic.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
Nen_desharu Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire from Greater Smash Bros. Universe or Toronto Since: Aug, 2020 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire
#3: Aug 1st 2024 at 4:57:33 PM

Should AI-generated content constitute "Original Flavour"? After all, it mimics the author's style of writing very closely.

Kirby is awesome.
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#4: Aug 1st 2024 at 4:59:32 PM

Uh, "mimicking the writing style" and "intentionally sticking close to canon" are different things

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Nen_desharu Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire from Greater Smash Bros. Universe or Toronto Since: Aug, 2020 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire
#5: Aug 1st 2024 at 5:30:49 PM

[up]Do AI generators stick close to the original canon in this case? If so, it can be added. If not, then it doesn't need to be mentioned.

Kirby is awesome.
TheMountainKing Since: Jul, 2016
#6: Aug 2nd 2024 at 2:34:14 PM

[up][up] Is it about canon or is it about style? You can make wild alterations to canon while keeping the style very similar. If it's about canon, how it different from Pseudo-Canonical Fic?

Edited by TheMountainKing on Aug 2nd 2024 at 5:35:30 AM

WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#7: Aug 2nd 2024 at 2:48:35 PM

Both, kinda. The point is that nothing in the fic deviates from established tone, lore, etc. PCF is for fics that can fit into canin without breaking the time-line but they can be written however in terms of tone and style (like a story about a funeral for a work like MLP). Meanwhile, Original Flavor means that the original nature of the work persists even if canon is altered (like an MLP story where Twilight doesn't get her wings, but it maintains the style of the cartoon). They can obviously overlap.

Edited by WarJay77 on Aug 2nd 2024 at 5:52:21 AM

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themayorofsimpleton Short-Term Projects Herald | he/him from the Island of Koridai (Captain) Relationship Status: I won't say I'm in love
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#8: Aug 2nd 2024 at 2:52:15 PM

So:

  • Original Flavor: Fics explicitly written in the style/canon of the original work.
  • Pseudo-Canonical Fic: Fics that can fit into the canon of the original work, but need not be written in the exact style.

If it's at all relevant, Pseudo-Canonical Fic is apparently also newer (2015) and was created without TLP/YKTTW.

Edited by themayorofsimpleton on Aug 2nd 2024 at 5:52:25 AM

Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining | Troper Wall
EmeraldSource Since: Jan, 2021
#9: Aug 2nd 2024 at 2:56:37 PM

The idea is it feels like a missing episode of the original work, which would be along the lines of:

  • Tone: No harsh language or sexual content in a work meant to be lighter and kid friendly.
  • Style: Not adding supernatural or sci-fi elements in a work meant to be low-key and realistic.
  • Format: It's not a 1,000 page epic for an episodic 1/2 hour show.
  • Canon: Doesn't make big changes to backstories, altering prior events or adding extreme original characters (such as a previously unknown twin).

All that said, fanfic tropes are fairly niche and some care needs to be done before making broad label decisions like that, as only 20 other people may have read it and even fewer able to peer review it.

^ Pseudo-Canonical Fic seems to be focused more on just not contradicting established canon and not altering the status quo. It compares itself to Fix Fic where it may be used to explain discrepancies between two points in the actual work.

Edited by EmeraldSource on Aug 2nd 2024 at 3:02:19 AM

Comics are just words and pictures. You can do anything with words and pictures.
TheMountainKing Since: Jul, 2016
#10: Aug 2nd 2024 at 3:01:39 PM

[up] The point about "style" would be more accurately labeled "genre". I think of style more as meaning artistic techniques, not subject matter.

This would seem to make Original Flavour a sub-trope of Pseudo-Canonical Fic, but the page only says it "frequently overlaps", not that it necessarily has to be pseudo-canonical. If that's wrong it should be changed.

Edited by TheMountainKing on Aug 2nd 2024 at 6:06:53 AM

RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#11: Aug 2nd 2024 at 3:46:31 PM

I think you could have Original Flavor fics that aren't Pseudo Canonical Fics, provided they're written for a story that has concluded, and the fic is set after the story's end.

Like if a TV series ran for six seasons, and a fan decides to write a Season 7 for the show, continuing where the series left off. This fic could be Original Flavor so long as it maintains the style, structure, tone etc. of the series it's based on, but wouldn't be Pseudo Canonical since it's not trying to fit its story within the show's canon, but instead is set after canon's end.

EDIT: Just occurred to me, you could also have Original Flavor fics written for a series that has Negative Continuity, making a Pseudo-Canonical Fic impossible.

Edited by RavenWilder on Aug 2nd 2024 at 3:47:34 AM

SharkToast Since: Mar, 2013
#12: Aug 2nd 2024 at 4:37:18 PM

Or how about a Fix Fic that tries to remain true to the work's original tone? Would that count as Original Flavor?

WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#13: Aug 2nd 2024 at 6:31:00 PM

Original Flavor could also apply to certain Alternate Universe stories. Like my example was "MLP:FIM, but Twilight didn't get her wings". Someone could easily just keep writing fictional episodes for a scenario where she didn't become an Alicorn, but everything else (tone, length, characterization, etc) remains consistent. Original Flavor fics do not have to slide into canon like a missing puzzle piece like PCF, but they do need to be consistent with the rest of the story.

Edited by WarJay77 on Aug 2nd 2024 at 9:32:35 AM

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
TheMountainKing Since: Jul, 2016
#14: Aug 2nd 2024 at 6:34:44 PM

[up][up][up] That's interesting, because a "canon compliant" fic can be a sequel to the original work, but it seems from the description Pseudo-Canonical Fic must happen during the work, even thought that description also says that the trop is also called "canon compliant fic".

[up] This was also my impression originally, but some posts in this thread seem to think that Original Flavour cannot alter canon at all.

I'm also interested in what "style" means here. Almost all fanfiction is prose. So it's easy to see how it can mimic the style of a novel, by writing in an authorial voice extremely similar to the original work. But how does that apply to a, say, a cartoon. Just by being prose instead of animation, it's style is unrecognizable?

Edited by TheMountainKing on Aug 2nd 2024 at 9:39:20 AM

WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#15: Aug 2nd 2024 at 6:38:46 PM

I mean, it's hard to articulate it but I don't think it's enough to say Original Flavor is "just" about the style but it also isn't "just" about copying canon. It's for cases where someone goes out of their way to make their fic into a story that could have actually happened in the canon work, even if it involves a "what if" scenario or something. It's the type of thing that you know when you see, but it definitely doesn't apply to the majority of fanfic since a lot of fanfic writers actively attempt to go against the "correct" tone, setting, characterization, etc.

It's easy for me as a fic writer to understand the difference given that I have one Original Flavor fic and then one that's a lot darker and more mature than would ever be canon, but it's not easy to really explain where the line is drawn.

Edit: For your question, while yes prose is a different medium, style may still match. Back to the MLP:FIM one, I've seen fics that emulate the style and format of the show, such as ending on a "Dear Celestia" letter and being short enough to be a proper episode if it was adapted into animation.

Edited by WarJay77 on Aug 2nd 2024 at 9:40:45 AM

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TheMountainKing Since: Jul, 2016
#16: Aug 2nd 2024 at 6:40:19 PM

A problem I'm having is that a lot of the on=page examples are really vague about what makes them qualify.

themayorofsimpleton Short-Term Projects Herald | he/him from the Island of Koridai (Captain) Relationship Status: I won't say I'm in love
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#17: Aug 2nd 2024 at 6:42:21 PM

A problem I'm having is that a lot of the on=page examples are really vague about what makes them qualify.

Given this, I wonder if a wick check might be in order — even if we do know what the definition is, we can see if there's misuse/other issues.

Edited by themayorofsimpleton on Aug 2nd 2024 at 9:42:44 AM

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WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#18: Aug 2nd 2024 at 6:44:19 PM

I mean, it's definitely something that's hard to describe in words. I'm fine with a wick check.

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themayorofsimpleton Short-Term Projects Herald | he/him from the Island of Koridai (Captain) Relationship Status: I won't say I'm in love
SoyValdo7 I mainly fix indentation issues from La tierra de lagos y volcanes Since: Sep, 2022 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
I mainly fix indentation issues
#20: Aug 2nd 2024 at 6:55:48 PM

[up] I can do that

EDIT: If anyone else would like to help, feel free to do so and make changes as you see fit.

Edited by SoyValdo7 on Aug 2nd 2024 at 10:27:47 AM

Valdo
EmeraldSource Since: Jan, 2021
#21: Aug 2nd 2024 at 10:59:15 PM

You can't be too strict on whether or not it breaks canon, by definition it is not canon and even the smallest suggestion may become Outdated by Canon.

I was thinking an explicit AU episode would disqualify it from Original Flavor, simply because a most AU fics are fundamentally different in premise and structure (Harry Potter characters in a Noir Episode). But then I remembered the Friends two parter that was an alternate timeline but other than some details being different was still a Friends episode.

Comics are just words and pictures. You can do anything with words and pictures.
TheMountainKing Since: Jul, 2016
#22: Aug 3rd 2024 at 12:28:15 AM

[up] There are plenty of A Us that try to stick close to the original, mostly one's that are more "what if" type stories where everything is like canon with one or two alterations.

I think the emphasis on maintaining canon continuity should be avoided because it runs us into confusion with Pseudo-Canonical Fic.

Reymma RJ Savoy from Edinburgh Since: Feb, 2015 Relationship Status: Wanna dance with somebody
RJ Savoy
#23: Aug 3rd 2024 at 5:09:03 AM

I once made a Nyaruko: Crawling with Love! fanfic in which I consciously kept the no-fourth-wall comedy, space-opera adventures and character dynamics, but changed things I needed to write it: replaced the Japanese cultural references with British ones, and the slapstick with witty dialogue. There are some things that have to change with the medium.

Stories don't tell us monsters exist; we knew that already. They show us that monsters can be trademarked and milked for years.
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#24: Aug 3rd 2024 at 5:28:16 AM

Right. I don't think an Original Flavor fic has to be an exact copy. It just has to capture the essence of Canon; characters should be in character and the tone shouldn't stray too far; that sort of thing

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
SoyValdo7 I mainly fix indentation issues from La tierra de lagos y volcanes Since: Sep, 2022 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
I mainly fix indentation issues
#25: Aug 4th 2024 at 1:46:40 PM

Update on the wick check: So after struggling a bit with it, I settled with dividing the wicks between fanfics that want to stick to the original as much as possible (Group A) and those that introduce new concepts/plots/characters but keep the spirit of the original (Group B).

In general, both groups are very vague about what makes them qualify for the trope, but Group B showed that writing style is more important than any alterations to the original work. Fanfic.Young Justice Darkness Falls seems to deviate a lot from canon, but the reader still considers it to have an Original Flavour. On the other hand, Fanfic.Dumbledores Army And The Year Of Darkness occasionally uses some American spellings in a work that is supposed to take place in England, and some readers consider that a dealbreaker.

So while tropers are able to identify which works have an Original Flavour, they struggle to write why, probably because things like the "tone and style" of a story are very difficult to explain to others in a written comment and because a fanfic that sticks to the original style doesn't make significant changes either, so there's not much more to say other than the fact that "This fanfic is just like the original".

Edited by SoyValdo7 on Aug 4th 2024 at 4:40:31 AM

Valdo

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