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Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Enid Sinclair
#201: Jun 24th 2023 at 10:05:13 AM

Are we sure that Talos is the only good skrull? I'm sure we will meet more good skulls. Though that might just be wishful thinking.

Edited by Bullman on Jun 24th 2023 at 12:05:49 PM

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#202: Jun 24th 2023 at 10:05:29 AM

I do think it's premature to designate all the Skrulls but Talos as evil, especially since it's a plot point that Gravik's plans are on a need to know basis and the vast majority of people joined with him are unaware of what he's doing.

We're only at the very first episode.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Jun 24th 2023 at 10:06:18 AM

fasoman1996 Google "big ears" from Argentina (A.K.A. Naziland) Since: Dec, 2014 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
Google "big ears"
#203: Jun 24th 2023 at 10:07:41 AM

I had no idea what to expect of this show, never watched any trailers nor even kept up with the discussion. The only thing i was mildly aware is that Skrulls are usually Always Chaotic Evil in the comics, so the fact that they still made this series even after depicting the skrulls as benevolents really confused me.

It's like sometimes marvel wants to adapt a comic run even if they are lacking a few things that would make that adaptation make sense. But making skrulls be led by a fascist now kinda makes sense....kinda.

Uni cat
ECD Since: Nov, 2021
#204: Jun 24th 2023 at 10:11:44 AM

I certainly hope we'll get more good Skrulls, but I'm not massively optimistic as we're directly told Gravik is a member of their governing body and Talos is an exile. I mean, if their government wasn't 'in on it' or totally apathetic, the very first step would be a call to the Skrull Council saying 'come and get your boy, before he makes a big mess.' Though I guess maybe they wanted to try to get proof/not warn Gravik they were coming? Maybe that's what the next episode opens with?

But my guess is Talos is going to be the only good Skrull unless some flip, just to keep Fury/Talos as the underdogs.

Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Enid Sinclair
#205: Jun 24th 2023 at 11:43:43 AM

[up] I feel like that is a stretch. Just because the bad guy is part of a council that w e haven't mean that they are all in on it especially when we don't know how many know if the plan. I'm absolutely sure that we will get more good ones.

Edited by Bullman on Jun 24th 2023 at 1:47:13 PM

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Avenger09 Since: May, 2014
#206: Jun 24th 2023 at 11:46:57 AM

I still think it would work, especially if Carol would later discover that the Kree still plan on killing Talos and his group out of prejudice and paranoia, with the only reluctant member being her mentor Mar-Vell.

Yeah I've got a whole alternative story laid out in my head.

ECD Since: Nov, 2021
#207: Jun 24th 2023 at 12:34:29 PM

[up][up]The point isn't that the bad guy is on the Council, or that they exiled the good guy, it's that literally none of our protagonists even suggest, 'hey, maybe we should talk to the Skrull Council about the fact that one of their members is committing acts of war against multiple human nations (and trying to do far worse)' says that either:

1) Our protagonists are idiots

or

2) They know/believe the Council is either unwilling or unable to do anything about that.

ETA: Now, I do expect we'll get some more good Skrulls, amongst other things, I really doubt this story is really going to end with Talos's daughter dead, or still evil. But I very much do doubt it will be in any organized form, rather than individual friends/allies of Talos. My guess is that they'll continue their general pattern of 'governments are evil/corrupt/incapable, only individuals can accomplish anything' and extend it to the Skrulls, it's just that that has even worse implications than usual when its the government won't/can't do anything about one of its own senior leaders attempting to commit genocide.

Edited by ECD on Jun 24th 2023 at 12:37:22 PM

MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#208: Jun 24th 2023 at 2:04:34 PM

Honestly, the Skrulls and the Kree in the MCU make me think of the Andalites and the Yeerks from Animorphs. The former have a ruthless, verging on evil army, but the citizens are genuinely good people. Meanwhile the latter just wants to conquer and rule the universe.

If this show goes into depth about how the Skrulls as a society operate outside of the evil ones on Earth, I think that's a great way to address of some of the Unfortunate Implications the show had so far. Because yes, there absolutely needs to be more good Skrulls than Talos, Soren and potentially G'iah.

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
Mizerous Pet Owner from Hell Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: Brewing the love potion
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#210: Jun 24th 2023 at 3:15:53 PM

Even with the Yeerks it was emphasized they weren’t all evil, with a critical part of the last arc being how many deserted the war once they had the chance.

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#211: Jun 24th 2023 at 3:30:36 PM

I have the view we'll probably get a #NotAllSkrulls message tagged on as Giah is redeemed because of something that shakes her faith in Gravik. However, my faith in this film is that the whole thing is based on trying to adapt Secret Invasion despite how different the Marvel Cinematic Universe depiction of them is.

I wouldn't be surprised if Gravik turns out not to be a refugee Skrull but a infiltrator from a much-larger still intact Skrull Empire.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#212: Jun 24th 2023 at 3:37:10 PM

wild mass guessBig Twist: The evil Skrulls are actually Dire Wraiths disguised as Skrulls.wild mass guess

MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#213: Jun 24th 2023 at 3:37:17 PM

[up][up][up][up] Yes, Science Guy was great, and I miss him.

[up][up] Honestly, I'm still thinking that Gravik is a Skrull traitor that's secretly working with the Kree to help make it easier to exterminate the rest of the Skrulls (and humanity) in the hopes of him getting safety and security for his actions. Which he won't, because his resentfulness for Fury and Talos has blinded him towards what the Kree truly are.

Edited by MatthewWayne on Jun 24th 2023 at 3:37:36 AM

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
ECD Since: Nov, 2021
#215: Jun 24th 2023 at 6:32:29 PM

[up][up][up][up]That's my fear, though I sort of expect Gravik to be some non-Skrull infiltrator of the Skrulls (maybe who brought along the mind transfer device, I don't remember seeing before?).

They could do a really powerful story about radicalization, realization and redemption, almost a reverse Daenrys arc, 'it's never too late to change course,' but wow, if that's where they're going, they've set it up so badly that I sort of think 'changing course under these circumstances may have better results, but makes her personally a less interesting and worse character.'

[up]Unclear what's going on with them yet, though if Maria was fridged...eh, I don't love it.

Edited by ECD on Jun 24th 2023 at 6:33:49 AM

dmcreif Vault Dweller from Vault 33 (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Robosexual
Vault Dweller
#216: Jun 24th 2023 at 6:34:45 PM

Honestly, I'm still thinking that Gravik is a Skrull traitor that's secretly working with the Kree to help make it easier to exterminate the rest of the Skrulls (and humanity) in the hopes of him getting safety and security for his actions. Which he won't, because his resentfulness for Fury and Talos has blinded him towards what the Kree truly are.

I believe Bron-Char (the big bearded blue Kree on Starforce) is supposed to appear in this, so maybe you're onto something.

I have the view we'll probably get a #Not All Skrulls message tagged on as G'iah is redeemed because of something that shakes her faith in Gravik.

I could see something coming from this in the future. G'iah could be in a "Wanda in Age of Ultron" place.

Okey Dokey!
MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#217: Jun 24th 2023 at 7:36:01 PM

[up] Yeah, that's what made me wonder if that's where the plot is going. If Kree people are showing up, that makes me wonder how the Skrulls' plans factor into the greater setting.

And yeah, I have faith that G'iah can turn from the darkness and become stronger from her mistakes.

Also, something interesting I just found: Kevin Feige apparently killed a lot of concepts for this show that didn't tie into the overall MCU.

Is that good or bad? It's hard to tell till we get more than one episode.

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
dmcreif Vault Dweller from Vault 33 (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Robosexual
Vault Dweller
#218: Jun 26th 2023 at 7:54:05 AM

Not sure if it's been brought up on this thread or the main MCU thread, but Charlayne Woodard is in this show as Priscilla Fury.

I think we even saw her in the trailer at one point. I'm convinced that she's the person we see G'iah fighting back to back with in this shot.

Edited by dmcreif on Jun 26th 2023 at 10:56:51 AM

Okey Dokey!
MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#219: Jun 26th 2023 at 8:09:46 AM

[up] Yep, that's her. We saw her in the first trailer, where she picks up a gun sent to her in the mail. I initially mistook her for Monica Rambeau in the second trailer.

I'm definitely curious what kind of person Fury's wife will be. Though if she ends up getting fridged too, I'm going to officially jump on the "this show is misogynist" bandwagon.

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
dmcreif Vault Dweller from Vault 33 (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Robosexual
Vault Dweller
#220: Jun 26th 2023 at 8:18:04 AM

Someone on Reddit's saying that she's a Skrull. And that's the explanation behind why Fury made that remark to Talos about knowing a lot of good-looking Skrulls.

Okey Dokey!
fanman "To watch it all burn." from Earth-Prime/Earth-1218 Since: Feb, 2022 Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
"To watch it all burn."
#221: Jun 26th 2023 at 7:53:01 PM

Saw the first episode, thought it was okay. I will say, I thought the opening on its own merits was pretty good. I was surprised people thought it was ugly, since I'm pretty sure it being uncanny was the point. Too bad it was made with AI, which I agree people should be iffy about, instead of having a team of artists.

dmcreif Vault Dweller from Vault 33 (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Robosexual
Vault Dweller
#222: Jun 27th 2023 at 5:11:27 AM

I've seen the backlash. And I'd say a lot of people are misunderstanding the way that AI was used.

To quote Method Studios, the people who made the sequence, "the entire production of the opening involved traditional work of the art department, animators, compositors and other artists."

In other words, the credits were designed by artists who then used AI to enhance what they made.

Okey Dokey!
MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#223: Jun 27th 2023 at 7:09:19 AM

Potential spoiler warning, but there's some interesting news regarding The Marvels that relates to this show.

Apparently, there's reports that Maria Hill is set to appear in The Marvels. Which now makes her death in this show seem suspect. It could be a flashback, or the movie is a prequel to this show. But given how big Maria Hill is, I somehow doubt that...

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#224: Jun 27th 2023 at 2:04:58 PM

The only thing i was mildly aware is that Skrulls are usually Always Chaotic Evil in the comics, so the fact that they still made this series even after depicting the skrulls as benevolents really confused me.

Sort of. Umh to to be fair. It is more nuanced than that. The kree and skrull empires as awhile are expansists assholes. But you still get normal citizens in the skrulls and the kree who are okay. And even bad guys can be noble demons. The skrulls used to be an actually benevolent race who uplifted others but ended up choosing to uplift the species known as The coati over the kree and royally pissed the kree off. The kree stole their technology and become the empire and the skrulls responded by doing The same, figuring if the benevolence was not going to get them anywhere they'll be the worst instead. Causing a Cycle of Revenge that continues to this day. It's a shame the MCU simplified a conflict that was much more nuanced than kree are assholes and skrulls good.

Edited by miraculous on Jun 27th 2023 at 2:05:37 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#225: Jun 27th 2023 at 2:19:35 PM

It’s funny because in general the Kree were treated in the comics as more noble than the Skrulls. To the point where you had a noble Kree Captain Marvel way way before you had a noble Skrull of equal prominence. The Kree were even treated as the more noble side of the Skrull/Kree War, with the Supreme Intelligence masterminding a way to stop the war despite Warhawk Ronan the Accuser seizing power while the Skrulls were trying to turn Kree communications technology into a WMD

Of course, you had asshole Kree. Quite a bit actually. But when it was Skrull vs Kree and even despite the reveal that the Kree drew first blood, overall writer sympathy tends to be more with the Kree, the guys who look more human, if sometimes a bit blue

It’s what made the Captain Marvel movie twist work even on comic fans. A heroic Kree force trying to stop evil, untrustworthy Skrull infiltrators from fucking with Earth? That fits the pattern

Forever liveblogging the Avengers

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