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Complete Monster Proposal Thread

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Old Complete Monster cleanup thread

Welcome to the Complete Monster proposal thread! This is the thread where new Complete Monster examples are vetted, approved, and written up. If you're looking for the general cleanup thread (for cuts, rewrites, expansions, and the like), please go here

Important: Before suggesting any new examples, please read the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List; if you have any questions, the odds are high they are answered there. Additionally, please check here for the earliest date a work can be discussed (usually two weeks from the U.S. release date) and whether the work has already been reserved by another user.

Here is how the process works:

    Process 

  1. If you have a candidate to propose, you can simply come right in and propose them! If the character's run is brief, such as a single issue of a comic book, then a simple summary of their actions and any potential redeeming qualities will be enough; for longer-running candidates, an effortpost (EP) might be helpful for organizing the proposal. An EP is not outright required, but please be mindful that if a post becomes too clunky and unorganized, it can be very hard for other people to follow.

  2. After the proposal, there will be a 72-hour discussion and voting period, where people may ask questions and vote on the candidate. The number of upvotes must outnumber the downvotes by at least five for the character to be considered "approved".

  3. Three days after the proposal has been made, if the character has been approved, you may post the writeup (the text to be posted on the trope page itself) on the thread and send it to the drafts page. Your candidate will soon be added to the CM subpage. If the work has a page, you should add your candidate to the relevant YMMV page. Voila! It's that simple!

Outside of this process, we do have a few ground rules:

    Ground Rules 

  1. To keep the thread moving at a reasonable pace, there are some restrictions on when a proposal can be made. There should only be a maximum of four EPs posted both per page and per hour to ensure that nothing gets lost in the shuffle; additionally, each individual troper should only be proposing or writing up characters from a maximum of three works at a time (from initial proposals to end of their voting period). If your proposal would fall outside of either of these guidelines, we'd like to ask you to please wait until they would fit within; feel free to type them up on an outside document, and then when the time comes, you can just copy, paste, and post!

  2. No plagiarism of any kind. This is a very serious matter site-wide, as the website could get in actual legal trouble over this; as a result, this can very quickly lead to mod intervention. This can take many different forms:
    1. Direct plagiarism, i.e. wholesale copying. This is not only the easiest to find, but is also the most likely to warrant quick moderator intervention. To be clear, quoting in some places is perfectly acceptable, but it has to be very clear you're quoting from something else and it cannot be anything longer than a sentence or two - if you're quoting an entire work summary from Wikipedia, no one is going to believe you've actually consumed the work, so even if you cite your source, your candidate will be downvoted anyway.
    2. Self-plagiarism. Even if you can prove that you wrote the same text in both places, the site itself can't contain any of the duplicated text. If you already wrote something once before, it's not too hard to write it a second time.
    3. Using another site's work as a template for a proposal. Just because you don't copy and paste something directly doesn't mean it's any harder to detect if you're basing parts or all of your proposal on text someone else wrote. To be clear, this doesn't violate site rules and won't lead to mod intervention, but just like if you directly plagiarize, no one will believe you've consumed the work if you're clearly basing your proposal on something else. This thread largely operates on the honor system, and tweaking someone else's work to pass it off as your own is one of the fastest ways to lose trust.

  3. Don't delete an EP unless you intend to swiftly repost it. We know that there are reasons why you might want to delete an EP, especially if it's being downvoted - rejection is hard, even in a low-stakes environment like this. However, deleting it renders the current discussion null and void, makes it impossible to reference the discussion in the future and can confuse tropers who didn't read it before the deletion. If the issue is temporary (such as formatting problems or a post getting overlooked as the thread moves on), then deleting and quickly reposting the EP is a valid option, but to fully retract an EP, please use the [[strike:]] markup instead.

  4. Votes must be for specific candidates, meaning no blanket voting (i.e. "yes to everyone I missed").

  5. If you are the first person to downvote a candidate, please provide an explanation of why when you do so. We're here for discussions above all, and a hit-and-run downvote doesn't facilitate anything.

  6. 'If a work is already reserved by another user , please don't comment on the work or any potential characters worth discussion before the discussion date. We know how exciting it is when a work has a keeper that you're waiting to talk about, but it's not fair to the person who reserved the work who is just as excited to lead the discussion to see the discussion getting spoiled before they get to do it. On the other hand, if the reservation only has one name attached, shoot them a PM - they may be down for a collaboration, which will get you in on the fun as well!

  7. Please keep the thread on-topic. While discussing the trope is fun and we encourage people to enjoy it, questions like "who's your favorite CM" are off-topic and can lead to thumps. That's the kind of question to take to people's PMs if they're willing. Similarly, while we encourage friendliness and familiarity with other users, posts should always have some kind of thread-relevant purpose; for instance, if you want to wish someone a happy birthday, feel free to, but if it's the only thing in the post, it's off-topic and needs something else alongside it. Again, though, while we strive for a friendly atmosphere, this is not Facebook; life updates are fun, but unless they have some kind of impact on your thread participation, please do not bring it here - we have Yack Fest for that.

  8. Please refrain from asking anything along the lines of "How Did We Miss This One?" In almost every case, the answer is simply "No one thought about it before". This Is a Wiki where everyone has different interests, and the fact that people missed a particular candidate, even one that seems like a textbook example of a trope or a character who is particularly iconic in pop culture, means absolutely nothing. The question is disruptive, has a simple and consistent answer, and provides nothing to any discussion.

  9. If you are suspended from parts of the website, it is still possible to participate!
    1. For users who are suspended from editing the wiki, you still have full access to this thread. You can propose candidates and write them up with no issues whatsoever; while you will have to ask someone else to post the entry to the relevant pages once it is done, all write-ups are considered thread-approved - as in, done by consensus - and thus doing so does not violate any rules regarding meatpuppeting.
    2. If you are suspended from the forums, your participation is limited but not impossible. It is still possible for a forum-suspended user to assist in creating the write-up for a character who has already been approved; as previously mentioned, write-ups are inherently considered a consensus-based edit and thus not tied to any one particular user. However, you can not assist in the proposal of a character; as a proposal is based around the forum rather than the wiki, doing so with a forum suspension qualifies as meatpuppeting.

  10. Please keep all discussions "in-house".
    1. What other wikis use for CM equivalents is irrelevant here.
    2. Please be wary of using other wikis, Fandom or otherwise, as sources of information. They are just as fallible as a site like Wikipedia in regards to accuracy because they can be edited by any user, just as this site can.
    3. Do not attempt to force a communication with an author in an attempt to gather evidence or settle a debate; besides the fact that this is a YMMV trope and thus author intent has variable weight depending on the circumstance, doing so may cross the line into drama exportation, which is prohibited site-wide.

If you would like to use an EP for your candidate, here's the general format. This format does not have to be followed exactly, but these are the main topics that need to be covered:

    Effortpost Template 

What is the work?

This is a brief summary of the work you're going to discuss. We don't need a full plot summary here, just however much we need to understand going into the discussion — it can even be as simple as quoting the summary on the work's page.

Who is the candidate and what have they done?

This is essentially the character's biography — who they are, their story, the crimes they commit, and, preferably (though not required), what happens to the candidate at the end. It does not have to include every single thing they ever do — for some villains, we'd be here all day if that was the case — but it should include the highlights of their journey.

Any redeeming qualities? Freudian Excuse?

This is where any potential redeeming characteristics or tragic backstory should be discussed. Do they have a tragic past? Do they show that Even Evil Has Standards or Even Evil Has Loved Ones? Maybe a Pet the Dog moment or two? This is where these should be discussed in full. Not every potential redeeming moment is a clear-cut disqualifier, but we should hear of any potential issues to ensure the character is discussed in full.

Are they bad enough?

A Complete Monster has to be particularly vile by the standard of the work they appear in. Therefore, you should look at what the character does compared to similar characters in the same work. This takes into account things like:

  • Their resource level (a human Serial Killer can't stand up to an alien Omnicidal Maniac, but they can be bad by the standard of other human serial killers)
  • The amount of time they have to work with (such as a one-shot character versus long-running antagonists)
  • The quantity vs. quality of their crimes compared to others (someone with a lower victim count but far more visceral and personal crimes could be considered as equally bad overall as someone with a higher body count but less horror involved)

Essentially, this section is an analysis of the kinds of villainy shown in the work and an explanation of why this particular character's villainy stands out within it.

Final verdict?

This is where you post your final conclusion on the character in question. You can continue elaborating on your reasons or even just say a simple "yes" or "no"; at this point, we've heard everything we need to hear.


IMPORTANT NOTICE: This thread tackles very serious and dark matters on a daily basis. We will be discussing things like murder, rape, torture, human trafficking, crimes against children, and in particularly dark cases, several of these issues at the same time. We keep a lighthearted air, but all candidates carry the general assumption that these are awful individuals committing disgusting crimes. We ask that if you participate, you do so with the requisite seriousness such dark topics require; exclamations of how gross something is, whether serious or sarcastic, are disrespectful to the topics at hand, and if you cannot handle such topics, please do not participate.

And that's everything you need to know. Welcome to the thread!


Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 12th 2024 at 3:13:36 PM

Agentofchaos A God Am I from Somewhere in the Universe Since: Dec, 2021
#11476: Apr 17th 2023 at 8:37:50 AM

[tup] Cain (stuff like [up] is why I will never get into the main DC or Marvel comics)

"We'll meet again" | 🏳️‍⚧️
SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#11477: Apr 17th 2023 at 9:14:19 AM

Yes to Cain.

STARCRUSHER99 The Moron from one of my unhealthy obsessions (Captain) Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The Moron
#11478: Apr 17th 2023 at 9:44:43 AM

I had the misfortune of reading the comics with New 52!Cain - there, he’s unsympathetic to the end, but he gets Redemption Equals Death, so he's no CM there either. Yes to this version of Cain though

Edited by STARCRUSHER99 on Apr 17th 2023 at 1:45:32 PM

Mr-ex777 Since: Apr, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#11479: Apr 17th 2023 at 10:30:36 AM
Thumped: This post was thumped by the Stick of Off-Topic Thumping. Stay on topic, please.
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#11480: Apr 17th 2023 at 10:31:24 AM

Guys off-topic.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Mr-ex777 Since: Apr, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
EmperorGeode from A Galaxy far, far away Since: Oct, 2022 Relationship Status: On the prowl
#11482: Apr 17th 2023 at 11:55:32 AM

Okay I have another cut villain I wanna repropose. This one was originaly put up by ban evader.

What is the work?

Onyx Equinox Crunchyroll original animated series. Set into mesoamerican like world, war is waged between gods of Underworld and heaven. Bet is made beetwen gods Quetzalcoatl and Tezcatlipoca, if lowest of the low can close 5 Gates of the underworld, humanity would be spared and winner would get all losers sacrifices and life. Quetzalcoatl choses Izen, young boy whose sister is sacrificed as a champion.

Who is Tezcatlipoca? What has he done?

One of four calestial gods. Specificaly cited as the one who destroyed first incarnation of humanity (one in series being fift incarnation). Now Mictecacihuatl was a mortal woman who is taken to be a bride by lord of the Underworld Mictlantecuhtli. She ventured into Mortal realm and fell in love with the warrior Yaotl, who was to be sacrificed to Tezcatlipoca in order to become his servant. Tezcatlipoca erased all Yaotl’s memories of Mictecacihuatl, promising that if she even spoke of it he would destroy Yaotl, making sure to not even leave the bones.

1000 years pass, Mictecacihuatl manipulates her husband into taking entire city of Danibaan for himself. This and human Wars convice Tezcatlipoca that it is time to destroy humanity. And this is where the bet comes in, Tezcatlipoca sends Yaotl to be Izel’s companion in order to ensure there is no cheating.

It all leads to Mictecacihuatl owetrowing her husband and facing heroes at the last gate. Izel however summons two gods and refuses to close the gate, unwilling to let humanity be playthings of the gods. Tezcatlipoca wins the bet as he gets Quetzalcoatl’s power, letter slowly facing away. Tezcatlipoca turns Yaotl into regular Jaguar, while preparing to anihilate humanity. As Izel and his friends prepare to fight for the freedom and survival.

Mitigating features?

Nothing his only problem with humanity is lack of sacrifices and he dosen’t care for the balance even Mictlantecuhtli cares about. Literaly closest thing he gets to the Redeming moment is deciding to leave Mictecacihuatl Yaotl’s corpse as a cruel reminder of what happens when he is crossed.

Heinousness?

Worst in the show. Underworld duo are bad but have Redeming qualities and don’t come even close to Tezcatlipoca’s genocidal goals.

Conclusion?

Happy to put him back up.

Edited by EmperorGeode on Apr 17th 2023 at 12:02:51 PM

WatTambor Since: Oct, 2020
#11483: Apr 17th 2023 at 12:11:19 PM

[tup] to Tezcatlipoca or whatever his name is

Edited by WatTambor on Apr 17th 2023 at 10:11:41 PM

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#11484: Apr 17th 2023 at 12:16:40 PM

[tup]Tezcatlipoca

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#11485: Apr 17th 2023 at 12:22:18 PM

Yes to Tez.

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#11486: Apr 17th 2023 at 12:24:25 PM

Yes there.

  • Dungeons and Dragons: Honor Among Thieves:
    • Szass Tam, master of Thay, is an evil Lich who was no longer content to be one of the ruling Zulkirs. Luring in the population of the capital city, Szass Tam cast the Beckoning Death to consume the souls of the people and turn them into undead abominations he used to conquer the entire land. Sending his agents through the land to expand his entire, Szass Tam is the mastermind behind the scheme to unleash the Beckoning Death upon Neverwinter and expand his domain.
    • Sofina, an undead Red Wizard and servant of Szass Tam, assisted in the Beckoning Death and blocked numerous civilians from fleeing to lead to their horrific demise. Infiltrating Neverwinter and placing its Lord Neverember into a coma to secure the rise of Forge Fitzwilliam, Sofina assists in all Forge's depravities and betrayals. Summoning the Beckoning Death, Sofina plots to unleash it on the civilians of Neverwinter only to furiously rain magical destruction upon the city when the attempt fails.
    • Seemingly Lovable Rogue Forge Fitzwilliam betrays his old friends Edgin and Holga while "adopting" Edgwin's daughter Kyra out of sheer delight in having someone he can shape and mold to look up to him while poisoning her against her father. Forge runs Neverwinter as a despot, with killer gladiator games and also attempting to wipe out the forest druids. Plotting to flee with his treasure, Forge lures the entire city to the latest games to die in the Beckoning Death and threatens to murder Kira should Edgin try to stop him.

  • Extraordinary Rendition: Interrogator Maro is a vicious professional torturer who cares little for anything but confessions. Taking anyone who falls into his grasp, Maro subjects them to excruciating psychological and physical torture for as long as they reside in his prison beginning with sleep deprivation. Stealing all hope via psychological torment, Maro then moves on to physical pain with the scars in hero Zaafir lasting long after he escapes the prison.

TotemGenitor Bye Since: Apr, 2021 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Agentofchaos A God Am I from Somewhere in the Universe Since: Dec, 2021
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#11489: Apr 17th 2023 at 12:31:39 PM

Next up:

What's the work?

Shanghai Triad is an early work by famed Chinese director Zhang Yimou and his last collaboration with his chief muse Gong Li for a long while. A crime drama with this bastard as our CM: Tang.

Who is Tang?

A Triad boss marked by ruthlessness. Tang Shuisheng is a new member of the Triad who is assigned to the detail of Boss Tang's mistress, a singer named Xiao Jinbao who's conducting an affair with the Boss's right hand Song. The Boss opens a gang war that leaves rivals dead, but forces a retreat to an island where Jinbao befriends a local woman. Things go bad and said woman's lover is kileld by the triads, to Jinbao's anger.

Turns out Song with Jinbao plans to kill the Boss, sick of his cruelty. The Boss counters the coup and Song's men are slaughtered while Song is set to be buried alive. Tang informs Jinbao that she will be "bowing out" with Song, and sets to execute her as well...along with several innocent civilians like Jinbao's friend Cuihua. Shuisheng tries to save the day, but is brutally beaten down and lashed to the ship's mast.

And the Boss? It ends as he takes Cuihua's daughter, promising that in a few years she will become just like Jinbao.

The end.

Mitigating issues?

Just...

Read the above. No, absolutely the hell not.

Conclusion?

Easy keeper.

TotemGenitor Bye Since: Apr, 2021 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#11491: Apr 17th 2023 at 12:37:16 PM

[tup]Tang The Boss.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Mr-ex777 Since: Apr, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
therealjackieboy from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
#11493: Apr 17th 2023 at 12:48:52 PM

[tup]Tezcatlipoca and Tang

It's Spooky Month!
EmperorGeode from A Galaxy far, far away Since: Oct, 2022 Relationship Status: On the prowl
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#11495: Apr 17th 2023 at 12:52:11 PM

Remember I also mention I had a Satan?

What's the work?

The Devil Conspiracy is a hysterically bad film from earlier this year. Long ago, Lucifer fought with God and heaven and was cast down. His brother Michael imprisoned him in hell...but now an evil cult plans to bring Lucifer back. With the power of genetics! An evil cult murders a priest, who is possessed by Michael, who returns to stop Lucifer at last. And the cult plans to clone Jesus to serve as a host to Lucifer!

Who is Lucifer?

The great beast who tried to overthrow God and destroy Creation. In modern times, Lucifer influences his cult led by the great satanist named....Liz, to murder people to get the Shroud of Turin and free him from his chains in hell. Now, the cult has been offering victims to Lucifer who's been possessing them, which kills them due to their inability to serve as proper host bodies for him. He burns through them quickly (ask him if he cares).

Lucifer possesses one captive woman named Sophia, which murders her, but another woman named Lauren is more compatible, so Lucifer uses her as a host, and decides to bring hell to destroy earth. Lauren is pregnant and Lucifer intends to use the baby, torturing Michael spitefully. Michael reveals that the baby is God's plan and the child is meant to stop Lucifer, to his anger. He says he's going to possess the messiah and use it to bring ruin to mankind and the earth. The ultimate "fuck you to daddy."

Realizing the baby can stop him, Lucifer begs Liz to kill the kid and cover things up, so Liz she has her chief servant the Beast massacre the cult just to use their blood to baptize the child and corrupt it....but the child's innate goodness traps Lucifer and leaves him stuck. Michael regains his angel form and saves the day, but the last moments of the film reveal Liz is alive and looking for Lucifer....who tries to escape the child, only to be bound back within.

Sucks to be you, Morningstar.

Mitigating issues?

Let me begin with...

This film makes absolutely no sense at all. It is gloriously, ridiculously weird and insane. The plot is bizarre and introduces ideas the film just completely forgets like the weird cloning thing. Nevertheless, Lucifer (and probably Liz, maybe even the Beast if I didn't forget a redeeming quality) are well above the line being a mass murdering, baby killing monster who intends to annihilate the entire world.

He's also little else but a spiteful brat who intends to destroy the world in a temper tantrum, explicitly saying he wants to spite his father.

Conclusion?

Easy keeper. Anyone wants Liz? Have at it.

ForgoLight The Ultimate Lifeform Since: Oct, 2022 Relationship Status: In Lesbians with you
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#11497: Apr 17th 2023 at 12:57:28 PM

[tup]Lucifer.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Agentofchaos A God Am I from Somewhere in the Universe Since: Dec, 2021
EmperorGeode from A Galaxy far, far away Since: Oct, 2022 Relationship Status: On the prowl
Echidna from Ontario, Canada (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Two-timing
#11500: Apr 17th 2023 at 1:01:19 PM

[tup]Tezcatlipoca, Tang and Lucifer


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