Old Complete Monster cleanup thread
Welcome to the Complete Monster proposal thread! This is the thread where new Complete Monster examples are vetted, approved, and written up. If you're looking for the general cleanup thread (for cuts, rewrites, expansions, and the like), please go here
Important: Before suggesting any new examples, please read the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List; if you have any questions, the odds are high they are answered there. Additionally, please check here for the earliest date a work can be discussed (usually two weeks from the U.S. release date) and whether the work has already been reserved by another user.
Here is how the process works:
- If you have a candidate to propose, you can simply come right in and propose them! If the character's run is brief, such as a single issue of a comic book, then a simple summary of their actions and any potential redeeming qualities will be enough; for longer-running candidates, an effortpost (EP) might be helpful for organizing the proposal. An EP is not outright required, but please be mindful that if a post becomes too clunky and unorganized, it can be very hard for other people to follow.
- After the proposal, there will be a 72-hour discussion and voting period, where people may ask questions and vote on the candidate. The number of upvotes must outnumber the downvotes by at least five for the character to be considered "approved".
- Three days after the proposal has been made, if the character has been approved, you may post the writeup (the text to be posted on the trope page itself) on the thread and send it to the drafts page. Your candidate will soon be added to the CM subpage. If the work has a page, you should add your candidate to the relevant YMMV page. Voila! It's that simple!
Outside of this process, we do have a few ground rules:
- To keep the thread moving at a reasonable pace, there are some restrictions on when a proposal can be made. There should only be a maximum of four EPs posted both per page and per hour to ensure that nothing gets lost in the shuffle; additionally, each individual troper should only be proposing or writing up characters from a maximum of three works at a time (from initial proposals to end of their voting period). If your proposal would fall outside of either of these guidelines, we'd like to ask you to please wait until they would fit within; feel free to type them up on an outside document, and then when the time comes, you can just copy, paste, and post!
- No plagiarism of any kind. This is a very serious matter site-wide, as the website could get in actual legal trouble over this; as a result, this can very quickly lead to mod intervention. This can take many different forms:
- Direct plagiarism, i.e. wholesale copying. This is not only the easiest to find, but is also the most likely to warrant quick moderator intervention. To be clear, quoting in some places is perfectly acceptable, but it has to be very clear you're quoting from something else and it cannot be anything longer than a sentence or two - if you're quoting an entire work summary from Wikipedia, no one is going to believe you've actually consumed the work, so even if you cite your source, your candidate will be downvoted anyway.
- Self-plagiarism. Even if you can prove that you wrote the same text in both places, the site itself can't contain any of the duplicated text. If you already wrote something once before, it's not too hard to write it a second time.
- Using another site's work as a template for a proposal. Just because you don't copy and paste something directly doesn't mean it's any harder to detect if you're basing parts or all of your proposal on text someone else wrote. To be clear, this doesn't violate site rules and won't lead to mod intervention, but just like if you directly plagiarize, no one will believe you've consumed the work if you're clearly basing your proposal on something else. This thread largely operates on the honor system, and tweaking someone else's work to pass it off as your own is one of the fastest ways to lose trust.
- Don't delete an EP unless you intend to swiftly repost it. We know that there are reasons why you might want to delete an EP, especially if it's being downvoted - rejection is hard, even in a low-stakes environment like this. However, deleting it renders the current discussion null and void, makes it impossible to reference the discussion in the future and can confuse tropers who didn't read it before the deletion. If the issue is temporary (such as formatting problems or a post getting overlooked as the thread moves on), then deleting and quickly reposting the EP is a valid option, but to fully retract an EP, please use the [[strike:]] markup instead.
- Votes must be for specific candidates, meaning no blanket voting (i.e. "yes to everyone I missed").
- If you are the first person to downvote a candidate, please provide an explanation of why when you do so. We're here for discussions above all, and a hit-and-run downvote doesn't facilitate anything.
- 'If a work is already reserved by another user , please don't comment on the work or any potential characters worth discussion before the discussion date. We know how exciting it is when a work has a keeper that you're waiting to talk about, but it's not fair to the person who reserved the work who is just as excited to lead the discussion to see the discussion getting spoiled before they get to do it. On the other hand, if the reservation only has one name attached, shoot them a PM - they may be down for a collaboration, which will get you in on the fun as well!
- Please keep the thread on-topic. While discussing the trope is fun and we encourage people to enjoy it, questions like "who's your favorite CM" are off-topic and can lead to thumps. That's the kind of question to take to people's PMs if they're willing. Similarly, while we encourage friendliness and familiarity with other users, posts should always have some kind of thread-relevant purpose; for instance, if you want to wish someone a happy birthday, feel free to, but if it's the only thing in the post, it's off-topic and needs something else alongside it. Again, though, while we strive for a friendly atmosphere, this is not Facebook; life updates are fun, but unless they have some kind of impact on your thread participation, please do not bring it here - we have Yack Fest
for that.
- Please refrain from asking anything along the lines of "How Did We Miss This One?" In almost every case, the answer is simply "No one thought about it before". This Is a Wiki where everyone has different interests, and the fact that people missed a particular candidate, even one that seems like a textbook example of a trope or a character who is particularly iconic in pop culture, means absolutely nothing. The question is disruptive, has a simple and consistent answer, and provides nothing to any discussion.
- If you are suspended from parts of the website, it is still possible to participate!
- For users who are suspended from editing the wiki, you still have full access to this thread. You can propose candidates and write them up with no issues whatsoever; while you will have to ask someone else to post the entry to the relevant pages once it is done, all write-ups are considered thread-approved - as in, done by consensus - and thus doing so does not violate any rules regarding meatpuppeting.
- If you are suspended from the forums, your participation is limited but not impossible. It is still possible for a forum-suspended user to assist in creating the write-up for a character who has already been approved; as previously mentioned, write-ups are inherently considered a consensus-based edit and thus not tied to any one particular user. However, you can not assist in the proposal of a character; as a proposal is based around the forum rather than the wiki, doing so with a forum suspension qualifies as meatpuppeting.
- Please keep all discussions "in-house".
- What other wikis use for CM equivalents is irrelevant here.
- Please be wary of using other wikis, Fandom or otherwise, as sources of information. They are just as fallible as a site like Wikipedia in regards to accuracy because they can be edited by any user, just as this site can.
- Do not attempt to force a communication with an author in an attempt to gather evidence or settle a debate; besides the fact that this is a YMMV trope and thus author intent has variable weight depending on the circumstance, doing so may cross the line into drama exportation, which is prohibited site-wide.
If you would like to use an EP for your candidate, here's the general format. This format does not have to be followed exactly, but these are the main topics that need to be covered:
What is the work?
This is a brief summary of the work you're going to discuss. We don't need a full plot summary here, just however much we need to understand going into the discussion — it can even be as simple as quoting the summary on the work's page.
Who is the candidate and what have they done?
This is essentially the character's biography — who they are, their story, the crimes they commit, and, preferably (though not required), what happens to the candidate at the end. It does not have to include every single thing they ever do — for some villains, we'd be here all day if that was the case — but it should include the highlights of their journey.
Any redeeming qualities? Freudian Excuse?
This is where any potential redeeming characteristics or tragic backstory should be discussed. Do they have a tragic past? Do they show that Even Evil Has Standards or Even Evil Has Loved Ones? Maybe a Pet the Dog moment or two? This is where these should be discussed in full. Not every potential redeeming moment is a clear-cut disqualifier, but we should hear of any potential issues to ensure the character is discussed in full.
Are they bad enough?
A Complete Monster has to be particularly vile by the standard of the work they appear in. Therefore, you should look at what the character does compared to similar characters in the same work. This takes into account things like:
- Their resource level (a human Serial Killer can't stand up to an alien Omnicidal Maniac, but they can be bad by the standard of other human serial killers)
- The amount of time they have to work with (such as a one-shot character versus long-running antagonists)
- The quantity vs. quality of their crimes compared to others (someone with a lower victim count but far more visceral and personal crimes could be considered as equally bad overall as someone with a higher body count but less horror involved)
Essentially, this section is an analysis of the kinds of villainy shown in the work and an explanation of why this particular character's villainy stands out within it.
Final verdict?
This is where you post your final conclusion on the character in question. You can continue elaborating on your reasons or even just say a simple "yes" or "no"; at this point, we've heard everything we need to hear.
IMPORTANT NOTICE: This thread tackles very serious and dark matters on a daily basis. We will be discussing things like murder, rape, torture, human trafficking, crimes against children, and in particularly dark cases, several of these issues at the same time. We keep a lighthearted air, but all candidates carry the general assumption that these are awful individuals committing disgusting crimes. We ask that if you participate, you do so with the requisite seriousness such dark topics require; exclamations of how gross something is, whether serious or sarcastic, are disrespectful to the topics at hand, and if you cannot handle such topics, please do not participate.
And that's everything you need to know. Welcome to the thread!
Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 12th 2024 at 3:13:36 PM
Yes to Evolution's End.
@ACW Yes, he does. Like I said, he has the messenger killed as well as the bandits whom he hired to kidnap the girl; certainly most CONFIRMED kills. As for slaugheting pagans (and Poles who are Christian but protect pagans), that's admittedly what Teutonics do in the book. But I still think him having most confirmed kills as well as his desire to rape the girl (something other Teutonics call him out on) and breaking religious taboo to save himself... pushes him over the edge.
Edited by emperors on Mar 24th 2023 at 5:58:44 AM
Welcome to the world of greatest media!Eh, I'll give a somewhat cautious yes then.
As for the Closer quote...
"So that's evolution's end? You and Darren Melman killing some kids at school?"
"No, no, no, no. You keep on reducing this to some minuscule high-school shooting but it's so much more than that. I'm talking about setting the record. Killing the most people ever. It's about inspiring others. Columbine was a great idea. But they just didn't execute it right. We will. And people will remember us as they line up to die."
Any better ideas?
I honestly think that quote for the page is perfect, there's a couple relating to Stroh I had in mind but frankly, I think a character bragging the intention to commit a mass murder that will make Columbine pale in comparison is a special kind of fucked that works perfect for a page quote.
Yea it's McFadden responding and Brenda asking.
Edited by Ravok on Mar 24th 2023 at 3:04:26 AM
No! That is NOT Solid Snake! Stop impersonating him!I think I'll add that quote to Quotes.Fame Through Infamy as well.
Someone should also add Butler to the Pretty Cure Monster Sandbox page since he’s also up.
- Daruizen is the second highest ranking member of the Byo-gens behind King Byo-gen himself. Many years ago, he fed off of Nodoka’s life force and health as a parasite, ruining her childhood all to grow stronger. When he returns in the show, he mocks Nodoka, who was unaware of that fact, about it to her face after making her relapse into her sickness with a Mega Part. When he creates Megabyogens and Gigabyogens, he sadistically makes sure the lifeforms he transforms into them are in as much pain as possible, to the point where some of them scream, which he delights in. He also creates Megabyogens and Gigabyogensfor the sole purpose of murdering people faster, and creates another Byo-gen general, Batetemoda, who he doesn’t care about in the slightest, in one of his schemes. When the King decides it is time to absorb Daruizen, he begs Nodoka for help, and loses it when she refuses and tries to force himself into her body, causing her to run away. When Nodoka asks if he’d quit being evil if she allowed him to go into her body again during the final confrontation between him and the Pretty Cures, he admits that he wouldn’t and tries to kill them.
Edited by SailorVenus372 on Mar 24th 2023 at 3:08:30 AM
“Get Snuck-Up On.”I like the quote too; since Hugo seems like a keep, here is the writeup; Lighty will do one for Torak.
- The Knights of the Cross: Hugo von Danveld stands out in the monstrous Order of the Teutonic Knights. Even unpopular among his brethren of knights, Hugo takes pleasure in slaughtering pagans and Christian Poles who protect them. When he and other knights ambush pagans, Polish knight Jurand of Spychow protects pagans, and von Danvel leaves his brothers to die. He only avoids punishment since he swears on an oath that he lost control over his horse, thus breaking a holy taboo of his Order. Hating Jurand for making him stand trial, Hugo von Danveld comes up with a plan to kidnap Jurand's daughter Danusia and expresses desire to rape her too. When the messenger of Teutonic Knights, Mr. de Fourcy doesn't like the plan, and decides to inform a Polish prince about it, Hugo has him murdered. Once Danusia is kidnapped, Hugo has the bandits who kidnapped her hanged instead of compensating them. When Jurand comes and begs for his daughter, Hugo takes pleasure in the father's despair and taunts him that even if he gives him his daughter back, she will give him his bastard. Fanatical, hypocritical, and sadistic, Hugo von Danveld really represented the worst traits of the Teutonic Knights and no wonder other Teutonic Knights (also fanatics) loathed him and never promoted him to higher position in the Order.
Pretty long, but I am sure there is a way to shorten it.
Edited by emperors on Mar 24th 2023 at 6:16:50 AM
Welcome to the world of greatest media!
to The Lamb, Yu Ji, Torak, Rios, Hugo von Danveld and Evolutions End.
to the quote.
Okay now Sorjonen is an absolutely brilliant Finish detective drama that I would seriously recommend to anyone (seriously, even the gorgeous scenery alone is enough to be worth watching).
Staring Ville Virtanen as Kari Sorjonen, a brilliant but eccentric detective in the Finish National Bureau of Investigation, who following his wife Paulina barely surviving brain cancer decides to relocate to Lappeenranta, his wife’s small home town close to the Border with Russia (near St. Petersburg), hoping it will mean a quietly life and that he'll be able to spend more time with his family. But of course it turns out the seemingly tranquil Lappeenranta is in fact a hotbed of corruption, intrigue and crime.
He is thankfully assisted by Lena Jakkola, played by Anu Sinisalo, a former member of the Bravada and officer in the FSB who arrives in Finland looking for her missing teenage daughter and is forced to abandon Russia after she accidentally kills the son of a senior politician.
Now whilst I’m working on a proposal for the MB thread, the series does have two possible candidates for this one. I’m not 100% sure if either of them will qualify, but I figured it was worth giving them a try.
Now “The Fury” see’s the officers of SECRI altered by Europol to their suspicions that a major figure in the illegal dog fighting world is operating in Lappeenranta, meanwhile Kari is called in when his good friend Hannu-Pekka Lund is randomly attacked by an escort he hired for the evening.
As the investigation discovers it all comes back to one man, our first candidate Iskariot Ranta.
Who Is he:
Born in Finland, raised in Sweden, Ranta is a ghost living almost entirely off the grid, to the point that the intelligence agencies barely know anything about him. Rising to become a dangerous gangster, the Danish police having been after him for over seven years. They had undercover officer Vibeka Parsson infiltrate his gang, but Ranta managed to turn her to his side and to cover up her disappearance, he drowned a lookalike in the Copenhagen Cannel.
For the last two years he’s been responsible for organising a series of major illegal dog fighting rings operating throughout Scandinavia. However, in the present Ranta has decided that dog fighting simply doesn’t bring in the cash like it used to and has turned his attention to an even more profitable venture.
What Does He Do:
Setting up in Lappeenranta, Ranta made a deal with local timber magnate Paul Dagerman to use several of his unused warehouses to host his fights, infighting the gamblers in from Russia to place their bets of the event. Homing in on two desperate Russian sisters Irina and Natasha Kurylenko, former athletes forced into prostitution, Ranta approached them with the proposal of fighting in his game promising them a large pay out even if they didn’t win. However, he didn’t tell the sisters that their opponents would be his fighting hounds, or that he’d deliberately infected his dogs with rabies to make the fights more brutal.
To twist the knife even further he also nicked their father’s dog to infect and use in his fights.
Thus right before the fight, Ranta also had the two sisters infected with the disease just as added incentive. They managed to kill the dogs, but only after Vibeka had emerged the champion. Ranta then forced them to cover up by disposing of his dead animals, and to safeguard his secrets simply ditched the sisters. The little detail they were now carrying a highly infections lethal disease and could easily infect others being of absolutely no consequence to him.
Sure enough Irina expired first, whilst Natasha took several days of agony to die. Knowing that Ranta would be organising another fight, managing to track a shady gym as his temporary base they sent Lena in undercover. Attracted to her fighting prowess, Ranta quickly pegged her as potentially his next champion as well as quickly falling for her. As such he ropes her in with the same promise, he gave the two sisters.
Unfortunately, Kari’s investigation into the Dagerman connection leads to them pulling out, which leads to Ranta being tipped off that Lena isn’t who she says she is. Moving the fight’s location to the abandoned limestone mine, having Lena tied up, he also has his goons kidnap her daughter Katia, as well as having Parsson tied up and murdered seemingly for no other reason than she tired to warn Lena that she didn’t want to get involved with him.
For the extra cash he traps them both in a cage with a rabid dog, so that if Lena fails to kill it the crazed animal will maul the tied-up Katia to death.
Thankfully Kari is able to figure out the new fight’s location, the police arriving throws the venue into chaos. Getting free Lena beats Ranta to death for endangering her daughter.
Any Freudian Excuse or Redeeming Traits:
Nothing given about what we hear from his past as to why he would turn to crime. From what we see Ranta’s motivations don’t go any deeper than greed.
He certainly seems to get along with his Russian contacts, even taking them to the strip club. But there is nothing to suggest he cares about them.
Now there is one little wrinkle, as I said he does seem to fall for Lena in her undercover persona, and before fighting accuses her of “breaking his heart” whilst looking quite distraught.
However, the issue is his attraction to her comes across as quite possessive, he’s only known her inverse for a span of a few days, walking in on her whilst she’s just come out of the shower, practically forcing himself upon her whilst telling her his proposal (due to her past Lena overall has no issues with sleeping with him to sell her being undercover) etc.
As such its hard to read his feelings as sincere. In the same conversation he also talks about Parsson also betraying him, even though she was overall completely loyal to him. Thus the whole thing comes across more as a bruised ego than sincere feelings.
He does also reprimand one of his goons for making a sexist remark about Lena, but its implied that its entirely cause he’s attracted to her himself rather than any standard.
Heinous Standard:
Now I should stress that for the sheer number of brutal and gritty crimes this series goes into (seriously for comparison the very first serial involves a child killer who stiches their victim’s eyes and mouth shut, and a serial rapist who runs a forced prostitution operation involving a sixteen-year-old – neither count, both have loved ones) overall due to its attention to realism this isn’t a series with high body counts.
Most episodes only involve a single, or two deaths.
There are only two killers with large body counts (respectively Kari’s archenemy a criminal mastermind who appears in multiple episodes and the spin off movie, and a offscreen Russian mob boss with political connections).
With four deaths to his name, Ranta is punching well beyond the series standard. Likewise the method of death is presented as utterly horrific, with us getting multiple scenes of Natasha’s agonising slow death.
Likewise whilst it overall thankfully doesn’t happen, its acknowledged by multiple people that Ranta actions could easily lead to a massive rabies outbreak.
Conclusion:
Well it depends whether you feel his words to Lena were genuine or not. Assuming their not, then I’d say Iskariot Ranta is a keeper.
So what do you think?
Edited by MGD107 on Mar 24th 2023 at 4:05:15 AM
Ranta, there's some depraved niches there. Expecting anyone else MGD?
EDIT: Discussion page is only partially loading for me but did anyone claim the RE 4 Remake?
Edited by WetFlannels on Mar 24th 2023 at 3:25:02 PM
What's wrong D-16? Rise up!

to Evolution's End
"We'll meet again" | 🏳️⚧️