Old Complete Monster cleanup thread
Welcome to the Complete Monster proposal thread! This is the thread where new Complete Monster examples are vetted, approved, and written up. If you're looking for the general cleanup thread (for cuts, rewrites, expansions, and the like), please go here
Important: Before suggesting any new examples, please read the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List; if you have any questions, the odds are high they are answered there. Additionally, please check here for the earliest date a work can be discussed (usually two weeks from the U.S. release date) and whether the work has already been reserved by another user.
Here is how the process works:
- If you have a candidate to propose, you can simply come right in and propose them! If the character's run is brief, such as a single issue of a comic book, then a simple summary of their actions and any potential redeeming qualities will be enough; for longer-running candidates, an effortpost (EP) might be helpful for organizing the proposal. An EP is not outright required, but please be mindful that if a post becomes too clunky and unorganized, it can be very hard for other people to follow.
- After the proposal, there will be a 72-hour discussion and voting period, where people may ask questions and vote on the candidate. The number of upvotes must outnumber the downvotes by at least five for the character to be considered "approved".
- Three days after the proposal has been made, if the character has been approved, you may post the writeup (the text to be posted on the trope page itself) on the thread and send it to the drafts page. Your candidate will soon be added to the CM subpage. If the work has a page, you should add your candidate to the relevant YMMV page. Voila! It's that simple!
Outside of this process, we do have a few ground rules:
- To keep the thread moving at a reasonable pace, there are some restrictions on when a proposal can be made. There should only be a maximum of four EPs posted both per page and per hour to ensure that nothing gets lost in the shuffle; additionally, each individual troper should only be proposing or writing up characters from a maximum of three works at a time (from initial proposals to end of their voting period). If your proposal would fall outside of either of these guidelines, we'd like to ask you to please wait until they would fit within; feel free to type them up on an outside document, and then when the time comes, you can just copy, paste, and post!
- No plagiarism of any kind. This is a very serious matter site-wide, as the website could get in actual legal trouble over this; as a result, this can very quickly lead to mod intervention. This can take many different forms:
- Direct plagiarism, i.e. wholesale copying. This is not only the easiest to find, but is also the most likely to warrant quick moderator intervention. To be clear, quoting in some places is perfectly acceptable, but it has to be very clear you're quoting from something else and it cannot be anything longer than a sentence or two - if you're quoting an entire work summary from Wikipedia, no one is going to believe you've actually consumed the work, so even if you cite your source, your candidate will be downvoted anyway.
- Self-plagiarism. Even if you can prove that you wrote the same text in both places, the site itself can't contain any of the duplicated text. If you already wrote something once before, it's not too hard to write it a second time.
- Using another site's work as a template for a proposal. Just because you don't copy and paste something directly doesn't mean it's any harder to detect if you're basing parts or all of your proposal on text someone else wrote. To be clear, this doesn't violate site rules and won't lead to mod intervention, but just like if you directly plagiarize, no one will believe you've consumed the work if you're clearly basing your proposal on something else. This thread largely operates on the honor system, and tweaking someone else's work to pass it off as your own is one of the fastest ways to lose trust.
- Don't delete an EP unless you intend to swiftly repost it. We know that there are reasons why you might want to delete an EP, especially if it's being downvoted - rejection is hard, even in a low-stakes environment like this. However, deleting it renders the current discussion null and void, makes it impossible to reference the discussion in the future and can confuse tropers who didn't read it before the deletion. If the issue is temporary (such as formatting problems or a post getting overlooked as the thread moves on), then deleting and quickly reposting the EP is a valid option, but to fully retract an EP, please use the [[strike:]] markup instead.
- Votes must be for specific candidates, meaning no blanket voting (i.e. "yes to everyone I missed").
- If you are the first person to downvote a candidate, please provide an explanation of why when you do so. We're here for discussions above all, and a hit-and-run downvote doesn't facilitate anything.
- 'If a work is already reserved by another user , please don't comment on the work or any potential characters worth discussion before the discussion date. We know how exciting it is when a work has a keeper that you're waiting to talk about, but it's not fair to the person who reserved the work who is just as excited to lead the discussion to see the discussion getting spoiled before they get to do it. On the other hand, if the reservation only has one name attached, shoot them a PM - they may be down for a collaboration, which will get you in on the fun as well!
- Please keep the thread on-topic. While discussing the trope is fun and we encourage people to enjoy it, questions like "who's your favorite CM" are off-topic and can lead to thumps. That's the kind of question to take to people's PMs if they're willing. Similarly, while we encourage friendliness and familiarity with other users, posts should always have some kind of thread-relevant purpose; for instance, if you want to wish someone a happy birthday, feel free to, but if it's the only thing in the post, it's off-topic and needs something else alongside it. Again, though, while we strive for a friendly atmosphere, this is not Facebook; life updates are fun, but unless they have some kind of impact on your thread participation, please do not bring it here - we have Yack Fest
for that.
- Please refrain from asking anything along the lines of "How Did We Miss This One?" In almost every case, the answer is simply "No one thought about it before". This Is a Wiki where everyone has different interests, and the fact that people missed a particular candidate, even one that seems like a textbook example of a trope or a character who is particularly iconic in pop culture, means absolutely nothing. The question is disruptive, has a simple and consistent answer, and provides nothing to any discussion.
- If you are suspended from parts of the website, it is still possible to participate!
- For users who are suspended from editing the wiki, you still have full access to this thread. You can propose candidates and write them up with no issues whatsoever; while you will have to ask someone else to post the entry to the relevant pages once it is done, all write-ups are considered thread-approved - as in, done by consensus - and thus doing so does not violate any rules regarding meatpuppeting.
- If you are suspended from the forums, your participation is limited but not impossible. It is still possible for a forum-suspended user to assist in creating the write-up for a character who has already been approved; as previously mentioned, write-ups are inherently considered a consensus-based edit and thus not tied to any one particular user. However, you can not assist in the proposal of a character; as a proposal is based around the forum rather than the wiki, doing so with a forum suspension qualifies as meatpuppeting.
- Please keep all discussions "in-house".
- What other wikis use for CM equivalents is irrelevant here.
- Please be wary of using other wikis, Fandom or otherwise, as sources of information. They are just as fallible as a site like Wikipedia in regards to accuracy because they can be edited by any user, just as this site can.
- Do not attempt to force a communication with an author in an attempt to gather evidence or settle a debate; besides the fact that this is a YMMV trope and thus author intent has variable weight depending on the circumstance, doing so may cross the line into drama exportation, which is prohibited site-wide.
If you would like to use an EP for your candidate, here's the general format. This format does not have to be followed exactly, but these are the main topics that need to be covered:
What is the work?
This is a brief summary of the work you're going to discuss. We don't need a full plot summary here, just however much we need to understand going into the discussion — it can even be as simple as quoting the summary on the work's page.
Who is the candidate and what have they done?
This is essentially the character's biography — who they are, their story, the crimes they commit, and, preferably (though not required), what happens to the candidate at the end. It does not have to include every single thing they ever do — for some villains, we'd be here all day if that was the case — but it should include the highlights of their journey.
Any redeeming qualities? Freudian Excuse?
This is where any potential redeeming characteristics or tragic backstory should be discussed. Do they have a tragic past? Do they show that Even Evil Has Standards or Even Evil Has Loved Ones? Maybe a Pet the Dog moment or two? This is where these should be discussed in full. Not every potential redeeming moment is a clear-cut disqualifier, but we should hear of any potential issues to ensure the character is discussed in full.
Are they bad enough?
A Complete Monster has to be particularly vile by the standard of the work they appear in. Therefore, you should look at what the character does compared to similar characters in the same work. This takes into account things like:
- Their resource level (a human Serial Killer can't stand up to an alien Omnicidal Maniac, but they can be bad by the standard of other human serial killers)
- The amount of time they have to work with (such as a one-shot character versus long-running antagonists)
- The quantity vs. quality of their crimes compared to others (someone with a lower victim count but far more visceral and personal crimes could be considered as equally bad overall as someone with a higher body count but less horror involved)
Essentially, this section is an analysis of the kinds of villainy shown in the work and an explanation of why this particular character's villainy stands out within it.
Final verdict?
This is where you post your final conclusion on the character in question. You can continue elaborating on your reasons or even just say a simple "yes" or "no"; at this point, we've heard everything we need to hear.
IMPORTANT NOTICE: This thread tackles very serious and dark matters on a daily basis. We will be discussing things like murder, rape, torture, human trafficking, crimes against children, and in particularly dark cases, several of these issues at the same time. We keep a lighthearted air, but all candidates carry the general assumption that these are awful individuals committing disgusting crimes. We ask that if you participate, you do so with the requisite seriousness such dark topics require; exclamations of how gross something is, whether serious or sarcastic, are disrespectful to the topics at hand, and if you cannot handle such topics, please do not participate.
And that's everything you need to know. Welcome to the thread!
Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 12th 2024 at 3:13:36 PM
Any way to trim that? The Arc Villain of DLC probably doesn't need nearly 2,100 words.
Yeah, that EP is really long admittedly. It's intimidating to try to read it.
While the narrative despite being ambiguous leaned toward the Exile variant being dead, yeah, it's admittedly not very clear either way. The fact that so many other Kang variants exist—enough to fill a freaking stadium/coliseum—told me that we wouldn't be for want of a nail and this feels a bit like Red Skull where we had no reason to think he was alive until he was shown to be alive—though in that case, that in no way dismisses the idea that the Exiled Kang could somehow have survived rather than being shredded into nothing. I feel like I could go either way on whether or not he's worth resolving now or if we wait it out just to be absolutely sure.
Come to think of it, I agree on the loosening standards towards adaptations thing not insisting every conceivable version go up by the way. It hinders on Loophole Abuse if it becomes a regular thing and it's not something we should make a habit out of doing all the time.
Edited by futuremoviewriter on Mar 3rd 2023 at 7:50:07 AM
I'm honestly gonna say
to Kang. He's DEFINITELY nasty as all hell and one of the top three most vile and dead-serious MCU villains, but I don't think he counts yet simply due to the fact that like Tyrian Callows his story quite clearly and simply isn't over yet. He's definitely supposed to be the next Thanos after all. We'll have to wait and see once his story is finally over from later movies when we can truly decide.
MODOK/Darren Cross absolutely doesn't count at fucking all simply because he's a complete joke villain that's mostly Played for Laughs (we literally see a shot of his ass in one scene) and has a Heel–Face Turn and Redemption Equals Death moment.
Edited by Fireball246 on Mar 3rd 2023 at 8:04:27 AM
- Tarzan 1996
- Issues #1-6 “Tarzan’s Jungle Fury”: Princess Regina is heir of to the throne of Arthan, one of two lost civilizations brought back to life by the extraterrestrial plant Tara. She is fully on board with the genocide of both the Kavell, the other civilization brought back by Tara, and humanity itself. Regina ventures into the world to seduce Tarzan, intending to mate with him. Choosing Paul D’arthon instead, Regina has him infected by Tara and manipulates him into hating Tarzan. Leading her forces to completely exterminate of Kavell, Regina seemingly reforms and creates a cure for Tara after Paul almost dies. Revealing her duplicity, Regina tries to seduce Kavell king Johran, tossing Paul aside, revealing she killed her father and that cure her people took is fake. Overlooking her troops slaughtering the Kavall, Regina tries to poison Johran before spreading Tara across the planet.
- Issues #7-10 “Legion of Hatred”: Otto Mann started as just a disrespected Nazi private. Stumbling upon the lost city of Kali, Otto finds the mind-bending Zuli emerald. In order to buy time to master the emerald, Otto manipulates Kali women into helping him enslave Bandago tribe, using the emerald to take control of them, Kali and his fellow Nazis. Otto uses the emerald to rape queen Zunnesa, cause Allied planes to crash into one another and force his men to commit suicide, almost doing the same to Tarzan’s friend Mugambi. Threatening to use the emerald to kill entire Kali tribe, Otto forces Tarzan into slavery, planning to use the emerald to conquer the world and rape different women every day.
- Issues #17-20 “Tarzan vs the Moon Men”: Jamagar Cha-Ron is the leader of the carnivorous Va Gas. Allying himself with Jamagar Or-tis of Kalkan, Cha-Ron has his troops help the Kalkans enslave African people in order to build a landing area for his fleet. Coming to Earth, Cha-Ron brings weapons with to conquer Earth and plans to betray the Kalkans and eat their hearts. He watches as Tarzan is forced to fight an animal mutated into a monstrous slave. Leaving Or-tis to be killed and eaten by his guard, Cha-Ron brings his army to Earth, intent on enslaving humanity.
I'd say wait and see for Kang. People would've expected Thanos to be a CM with his build up but he ended up being a WIE (at least his prime version.)
Would anyone obejct to me attempting an EP for Tai Lung? I know he's listed on the former CM page with this:
First film: Tai Lung (essentially a Tragic Villain, despite his destructive deeds)
...except he has a few chances of redemption yet refuses to accept it.
What's wrong D-16? Rise up!![]()
Yeah sorry, Wet, but no Tai Lung still doesn't count. Not only does he arguably fail the heinous standard to the likes of Lord Shen, but he's simply way too tragic and it's quite clear that his tragic past still haunts him in the present and is still clearly supposed to be seen as sympathetic. He can also be seen as somewhat of a scapegoat as his fate is arguably WAY too horrific as shown in the third film where he was sent to the Spirit Realm and he's shown to be one of Kai's victims and is in a And I Must Scream situation. That's a pretty nasty fate for someone who isn't THAT vile and heinous of a villain.
Edited by Fireball246 on Mar 3rd 2023 at 8:12:05 AM
While it is true that Tai Lung rejects redemption multiple times, his feelings and relathioship with Shifu push farthest away from this trope out all Big Bads of trilogy
Wait and see on Kang from me...you can go for Tai Lung if you want but I'll be a pretty solid No, I don't think his Redemption Rejection at all invalidates his status as a Tragic Villain and as mir said, his rapsheet isn't really impressive.
What's the work?
Avatar: The Last Airbender is one of the greatest animated shows to ever exist.
The Last Airbender is one of the worst movies to ever exist.
Perfectly balanced.
So anyway yeah, Airbender is a bad movie and bad adaptation of the cartoon made by the madman himself M. Night Shyamalan. It does...so very many things wrong, but one aspect that a lot of people acknowledge was done...mmmm semi-decently not completely terrible? The film's main antagonist, the Arc Villain of the cartoon's first season.
Who is Commander Zhao? What has he done?
The rival to teenaged Prince Zuko and the film's primary baddie, Zhao is a power hungry commander in the Fire Nation, with designs to make his name famous in history by capturing the Avatar and eliminating the rebellion of the Northern Water Tribe against the Fire Nation's tyrannical rule.
Ambushing Avatar Aang, Zhao captures the boy and brags of his intention to keep him as prisoner for the rest of his long life so that he won't die and the Avatar spirit reincarnate...when a disguised Zuko breaks Aang out to try and capture the Avatar himself, Zhao proclaims Zuko a traitor to his father Fire Lord Ozai, and though Ozai orders Zhao to leave Zuko be? Zhao goes behind his back and tries to assassinate Zuko with a bombing anyway, later subtly mocking Zuko's uncle Iroh over the loss of his nephew and own son in a previous war.
Zhao's ultimate goal is soon revealed: he plans to invade the Northern Water Tribe, murder the Moon Spirit and then wipe out the depowered waterbenders (they get their power from the moon) in a replication of the Air Nomad genocide 100 years ago, Zhao hoping for it to be a final, brutal show of force to ensure the Fire Nation's complete power over the world. Against even Iroh's protests, Zhao proclaims himself a god and murders the Moon Spirit, turning the sky blood red and sending the waterbender tribe into total chaos as they are overwhelmed and murdered one by one by Zhao's forces.
Luckily, our heroes manage to restore the Moon Spirit to its power at the cost of Princess Yue's life, and after a final duel with a surviving Zuko, Zhao is left to face the very waterbenders he tried to wipe out, who promptly drown Zhao while Aang uses his Avatar powers to wipe out Zhao's forces and save the Northern Water Tribe.
Mitigating features?
None at all, the character trope listed on his page claiming he has Adaptational Heroism compared to the cartoon is incorrect and he's just an ambitious warmonger with dreams of grandeur.
Heinousness?
So, Zhao slaying the Moon Spirit is presented as a bad thing, but...very vague, the spirits and Iroh noting it will "throw the world off balance" and "hurt everyone", but it's too vague to really say how bad it is on a worldwide scale...but, thing is? That's not what pushes Zhao over, here: it's that he, explicitly, is out to wipe out the entire Northern Water Tribe after depowering them. The Dragon spirit remarks that Zhao's victory means a replication of the genocide of the Air Nomads, the waterbenders' first reaction to Zhao's invasion it to try to hide the children, and once he slays the Moon Spirit, and the waterbenders lose their power? Zhao's forces immediately overwhelm and begin murdering them, Zhao bragging that he will crush them all and take the city for the Fire Nation.
He tries to kill Zuko as well, and his slaying of the Moon Spirit is still a nasty moment, but it is absolutely the attempted annihilation of the Northern Water Tribe that puts Zhao over, here. Unlike in the cartoon, no other villains eventually trump him in heinousness, so he's the worst we've got here besides Ozai who is just an Orcus on His Throne.
Final Verdict?
Zhao's a Yes to me.
God. This and Howard the Duck on my effortpost history. I ask...is it worth it...
No! That is NOT Solid Snake! Stop impersonating him!Okay I tried to trim Astrid EP, so is it any better (I wanted to make sure I explained my opinion on why I think Astrid counts, that she lacks redeeming and sympathetic qualities, and how she's uniquely heinous compared to the other villains)
to Zhao
Edited by G-Editor on Mar 3rd 2023 at 11:14:19 AM
My sandbox of EPs and other stuff
Zhao
Uh this film. I tried to forget man. At least Aasif Mandvi got a better role in Evil (2019)
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."![]()
OOOPPS! My bad! I should've looked more clearly. Anyways, in that case, definite
to Film!Zhao. That makes five official Avatar C Ms.
Edited by Fireball246 on Mar 3rd 2023 at 8:24:07 AM

I'll wait until the Kang Dynasty comes out since we'll have more backstory on the guy given that he'll most like make an appearance there and voting on him right now may be too early.
Anywho I got a candidate worth discussing from Dying Light 2 Stay Human, specifically from the DLC story "Bloody Ties" so let’s talk about it
What’s The Work?
Dying Light 2 Stay Human is the sequel to the first Dying Light taking place where a zombie virus has been unleashed throughout the world bringing the planet to a Zombie Apocalypse. The game’s main character Aiden Caldwell goes to Villidor, one of humanity’s last settlements, to rescue for his sister from Big Bad scientist Waltz. However Waltz isn’t the candidate but rather the Arc Villain for “Bloody Ties” is where Aiden competes in the brutal Gladiator Games in carnage hall hosted by this person, Astrid.
Who is She? What Has She Done?
Astrid is the Arc Villain for the DLC storyline “Bloody Ties” who runs Carnage Hall, thus is known as The Queen of Carnage Hall. Originally just a harmless sporting competition that was suppose to elevate stress and bring hope to the denizens of Villedor during the Zombie Apocalypse, once Astrid took over she converted the sport into a slaughter house where she has people compete in brutal Gladiator Games, having them kill each other in horrific ways or having zombies kill off the competitors, leading to hundreds of people, if not more, getting killed while Astrid uses this regular slaughter to keep her viewers entertained and thus under her control.
If that wasn’t bad enough she rounds up countless people, whether they be her own employees who object to how Astrid has run Carnage Hall or just innocence she has found in Villador and have kidnapped, before imprisoning them beneath Carnage Hall where Astrid would use them as fodder for her games whether it be for them to get butchered by competitors, used to feed zombies, or even turn them into zombies so that she could use them for her games, leading to even more casualties.
Astrid would later notice one of the contenders, Skullface, rising up within the ranks, where she attempts to convince her champion at that time, Olga, to loose so that the crowd can continued to be entertain. However Olga wins the match against Skullface, which pisses off Astrid to the point that she sends her goons after Olga. After finding Olga and his two sons Astrid would then forces Olga to make a Sadistic Choice; Olga would be forced to hand over one of his two sons to Astrid or Astrid will kill both Olga and his sons.
Olga decides to hand over Astrid his oldest son, Abel, which Astrid will have Abel fight Skullface. She would then tell Olga that his son died in the fight, but the truth is that Abel won and killed Skullface, before becoming the new Skullface after Astrid would lie to Abel that Olga abandoned Abel. This allowed Astrid to corrupt Abel, transforming him into a brutal combat would who slaughter and kill all that he sees while feeding Abel drugs to keep him in that murderous state, making the already deadly Gladiator Games even more brutal and dangerous with countless more people dying.
However, news of Skullface’s actions would get the wind of Peacekeeper leader Jack Matt who threatens to shut down Astrid’s Carnage Hall unless she kills him. Not wanting Carnage Hall to get shut down, Astrid complies to Matt’s demands and plots to have Skullface killed while finding someone else to replace him as her champion, eventually taking an interest in Aiden Caldwell upon witnessing him kill off the other fighters during a match, though Aiden was forced to kill these fighters in self-defense because Astrid said it was a fight to the death in the last minute.
As Aiden goes through many of Astrid’s death matches and being forced to kill many participants in them, while he’s trying to rescue his friend Ciro being held prisoner by Astrid, Astrid meets with Aiden where she makes a deal with Aiden that she would free Ciro if Aiden stays in the competition and kill Skullface to become her champion, and would send Aiden to Skullface’s hideout to learn that he’s been torturing fighters to make a camouflage substance to keep him safe from zombies, which intrigues Astrid implying that she’ll make plans to torture people herself to recreate Skullface’s formula.
Astrid does release Ciro from her prison, however she manipulates Ciro into participating in her bloody competition on the pretense that Ciro will achieve fame and glory and will become a better fighter than his father Olga. Astrid would then arrange for Aiden to fight Ciro to the death which leads to two outcomes; Wither Aiden would be forced to kill Ciro when Aiden is unable to reason with Ciro as a result of Astrid’s manipulations and fight Skullface afterwards or Aiden would throw the challenge and let Ciro win resulting in Astrid putting Ciro back to prison while forcing Aiden to fight Skullface anyway with uncaring on who kills who.
Before Aiden fights Skullface, Astrid reveals to Aiden that Skullface is indeed Abel, Ciro’s big bro and Olga’s other son, and that she lied to Abel that Olga abandoned him to mold him into her bloodthirsty monster for her entertainment while planning to replace Abel with Aiden when Abel becomes harder for Astrid to control, while admitting to have no intentions to discontinue her barbaric Gladiator Games exclaiming that it’s her legacy she brought to this zombie apocalypse and won’t let anyone put an end to her Carnage Hall no matter how many people have to die, with plans to put Aiden down the same path of violence that she sent Abel towards should Aiden win, with Astrid giving Aiden the camouflage substance to allow Aiden to be more evenly matched with Abel, thus would make their fight more entertaining to the crowd.
Eventually Aiden is able to defeat Abel in their fight where Astrid goads Aiden to finish Abel off. However Olga comes out and convinces Aiden not to kill Abel, which results in Astrid attempting to manipulate Abel to kill his father along with Aiden and Ciro (if he’s still alive) telling Abel that Olga abandoned him and preferred Ciro over Abel to further manipulate Abel kill them. Luckily, Abel finally comes to his senses and kill Astrid before succumbing to his wounds and dies, thus ending Astrid’s reign of terror for good.
Freudian Excuse? Redeeming Qualities?
Okay so there is a side-quest where you look into Astrid’s past where she use to be a famous news anchor until an unknown scandal ruined her career and was there when the safety rules for Carnage Hall was established. That’s pretty much it and a ruined career certainly doesn’t justify all the bloodshed and atrocities Astrid has committed once she took over Carnage Hall where she abolished all the safety rules while manipulating hundreds of people Astrid into fighting each other to the death on the pretense of glory.
In fact Astrid said that she’s glad the Zombie Apocalypse occurred because it gave her a chance to reclaim her fame where she was treated like royalty while just about everyone else had to suffer, and makes it clear to Aiden that even if he won and killed Abel, she’ll continue to her murderous Gladiator Games just because they made her famous, no matter how many more people will get killed because of her, so yeah nothing excusable for Astrid here.
Now after Astrid give Olga a Sadistic Choice and chooses which son to give to her, She leaves Olga and Ciro after being given Abel. However this is not a Pet the Dog moment as she left Olga and Ciro with nothing at all in the middle of the zombie-infest city, probably expected them to die while using that as way to manipulate Abel into become bloodthirsty monster who hates a father, by lying to Abel that Olga abandon Abel and preferring Ciro, when the truth is Astrid forced Olga to chose between his two sons or else she would kill them all.
Astrid does decide to plot in killing Skullface and replace him as champion but this is not because she shows any remorse (which she doesn’t show whatsoever) for turning him into a monster resulting into all the people Skullface had slaughtered, but because Peacekeeper leader Jack Matt, threatened to shut down Astrid’s operation unless she could kill Skullface, and her only reaction of learning that Skullface was torturing people to be camouflage for zombie is how she can use that substance for her own usage.
When Astrid attempts to make Aiden her new champion, she plans to corrupt Aiden down the same bloody path as Abel and kill Aiden should he become uncontrollable like Abel and if Aiden throws the match against Ciro (which Astrid said she would spare only to go back on her word and arrange Aiden to fight Ciro to the death) Astrid would punish Aiden by forcing him to fight Skullface in hopes that he would kill Aiden while throwing Ciro back to prison planning to kill Ciro later, and would goad Abel to kill her enemies, including Aiden and Ciro, with her goading Abel to kill his father first. Overall, Astrid cares for no-one but herself and her desire for fame and control, thus explaining my argument on why she has no redeeming qualities.
Heinousness
Now the heinous standard for the Dying Light series is rather high with 1st game’s Big Bad Rais being a sadistic warlord who turns his entire army into zombies in the end would was once a CM until an argument regarding his care for his brother got him cut, the Arc Villain of The Following, The Mother, wanting to nuke Harran but to prevent the zombie virus from being unleashed throughout the world and after when it’s made apparent that her cure doesn’t work, while Waltz and Williams despite having many deaths, especially Waltz who experimented on children, were Well Intentioned Extremists
Then there the candidates who are already been approved such as the three side-quest baddies who were still unique to be considered despite their limited resources and screen-time and the Buran, main villain in a tie-in comic who put an entire unnamed city in danger. Now among the main villains, Astrid might have the least amount of resources (she’s might be around Rais tier who was at least a warlord who ruled the entire city of Harran while Astrid is limited to one area in Villador), yet her crimes are unique enough to still be considered.
She has converted a once safe and family friend competition sport meant to bring people together and establish peace in the city into a series of horrific Gladiator Games where countless people are slaughtered and killed in a daily occurrence whether they were butchered by other contestants, devoured by zombies, or turned into zombies, having lured hundreds, if not thousands or probably even more thought Villador to participate in her murderous games, while even imprisoning anyone, even her own subordinates should they even argue to her games, and use them as fodder for her murderous fighters and zombies, as shown when she had a woman either killed or imprisoned to be used as zombie fodder when that woman tried to ask Astrid to end the bloodshed.
Now there is Abel whose been slaughtering countless people both in and out of Carnage Hall and has been torturing people to create a camouflage substance against the zombies, but he’s only so murderous and messed up because of Astrid who lied to Abel all his life about his father abandoning him so that she could mold the adolescent Abel into growing up becoming her monstrous champion while feeding him drugs to maintain her control over Abel and continue murderous rage, and attempts to manipulate Abel to kill his own father, which only failed because Abel finally came to his senses a kills Astrid for her manipulations and what she did to his family, so yeah with was Astrid has to work with, I’d say she stands out.
Final Verdict
I’ll leave it to you guys to decide.
Edited by G-Editor on Mar 3rd 2023 at 11:13:48 AM
My sandbox of EPs and other stuff