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Complete Monster Proposal Thread

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Old Complete Monster cleanup thread

Welcome to the Complete Monster proposal thread! This is the thread where new Complete Monster examples are vetted, approved, and written up. If you're looking for the general cleanup thread (for cuts, rewrites, expansions, and the like), please go here

Important: Before suggesting any new examples, please read the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List; if you have any questions, the odds are high they are answered there. Additionally, please check here for the earliest date a work can be discussed (usually two weeks from the U.S. release date) and whether the work has already been reserved by another user.

Here is how the process works:

    Process 

  1. If you have a candidate to propose, you can simply come right in and propose them! If the character's run is brief, such as a single issue of a comic book, then a simple summary of their actions and any potential redeeming qualities will be enough; for longer-running candidates, an effortpost (EP) might be helpful for organizing the proposal. An EP is not outright required, but please be mindful that if a post becomes too clunky and unorganized, it can be very hard for other people to follow.

  2. After the proposal, there will be a 72-hour discussion and voting period, where people may ask questions and vote on the candidate. The number of upvotes must outnumber the downvotes by at least five for the character to be considered "approved".

  3. Three days after the proposal has been made, if the character has been approved, you may post the writeup (the text to be posted on the trope page itself) on the thread and send it to the drafts page. Your candidate will soon be added to the CM subpage. If the work has a page, you should add your candidate to the relevant YMMV page. Voila! It's that simple!

Outside of this process, we do have a few ground rules:

    Ground Rules 

  1. To keep the thread moving at a reasonable pace, there are some restrictions on when a proposal can be made. There should only be a maximum of four EPs posted both per page and per hour to ensure that nothing gets lost in the shuffle; additionally, each individual troper should only be proposing or writing up characters from a maximum of three works at a time (from initial proposals to end of their voting period). If your proposal would fall outside of either of these guidelines, we'd like to ask you to please wait until they would fit within; feel free to type them up on an outside document, and then when the time comes, you can just copy, paste, and post!

  2. No plagiarism of any kind. This is a very serious matter site-wide, as the website could get in actual legal trouble over this; as a result, this can very quickly lead to mod intervention. This can take many different forms:
    1. Direct plagiarism, i.e. wholesale copying. This is not only the easiest to find, but is also the most likely to warrant quick moderator intervention. To be clear, quoting in some places is perfectly acceptable, but it has to be very clear you're quoting from something else and it cannot be anything longer than a sentence or two - if you're quoting an entire work summary from Wikipedia, no one is going to believe you've actually consumed the work, so even if you cite your source, your candidate will be downvoted anyway.
    2. Self-plagiarism. Even if you can prove that you wrote the same text in both places, the site itself can't contain any of the duplicated text. If you already wrote something once before, it's not too hard to write it a second time.
    3. Using another site's work as a template for a proposal. Just because you don't copy and paste something directly doesn't mean it's any harder to detect if you're basing parts or all of your proposal on text someone else wrote. To be clear, this doesn't violate site rules and won't lead to mod intervention, but just like if you directly plagiarize, no one will believe you've consumed the work if you're clearly basing your proposal on something else. This thread largely operates on the honor system, and tweaking someone else's work to pass it off as your own is one of the fastest ways to lose trust.

  3. Don't delete an EP unless you intend to swiftly repost it. We know that there are reasons why you might want to delete an EP, especially if it's being downvoted - rejection is hard, even in a low-stakes environment like this. However, deleting it renders the current discussion null and void, makes it impossible to reference the discussion in the future and can confuse tropers who didn't read it before the deletion. If the issue is temporary (such as formatting problems or a post getting overlooked as the thread moves on), then deleting and quickly reposting the EP is a valid option, but to fully retract an EP, please use the [[strike:]] markup instead.

  4. Votes must be for specific candidates, meaning no blanket voting (i.e. "yes to everyone I missed").

  5. If you are the first person to downvote a candidate, please provide an explanation of why when you do so. We're here for discussions above all, and a hit-and-run downvote doesn't facilitate anything.

  6. 'If a work is already reserved by another user , please don't comment on the work or any potential characters worth discussion before the discussion date. We know how exciting it is when a work has a keeper that you're waiting to talk about, but it's not fair to the person who reserved the work who is just as excited to lead the discussion to see the discussion getting spoiled before they get to do it. On the other hand, if the reservation only has one name attached, shoot them a PM - they may be down for a collaboration, which will get you in on the fun as well!

  7. Please keep the thread on-topic. While discussing the trope is fun and we encourage people to enjoy it, questions like "who's your favorite CM" are off-topic and can lead to thumps. That's the kind of question to take to people's PMs if they're willing. Similarly, while we encourage friendliness and familiarity with other users, posts should always have some kind of thread-relevant purpose; for instance, if you want to wish someone a happy birthday, feel free to, but if it's the only thing in the post, it's off-topic and needs something else alongside it. Again, though, while we strive for a friendly atmosphere, this is not Facebook; life updates are fun, but unless they have some kind of impact on your thread participation, please do not bring it here - we have Yack Fest for that.

  8. Please refrain from asking anything along the lines of "How Did We Miss This One?" In almost every case, the answer is simply "No one thought about it before". This Is a Wiki where everyone has different interests, and the fact that people missed a particular candidate, even one that seems like a textbook example of a trope or a character who is particularly iconic in pop culture, means absolutely nothing. The question is disruptive, has a simple and consistent answer, and provides nothing to any discussion.

  9. If you are suspended from parts of the website, it is still possible to participate!
    1. For users who are suspended from editing the wiki, you still have full access to this thread. You can propose candidates and write them up with no issues whatsoever; while you will have to ask someone else to post the entry to the relevant pages once it is done, all write-ups are considered thread-approved - as in, done by consensus - and thus doing so does not violate any rules regarding meatpuppeting.
    2. If you are suspended from the forums, your participation is limited but not impossible. It is still possible for a forum-suspended user to assist in creating the write-up for a character who has already been approved; as previously mentioned, write-ups are inherently considered a consensus-based edit and thus not tied to any one particular user. However, you can not assist in the proposal of a character; as a proposal is based around the forum rather than the wiki, doing so with a forum suspension qualifies as meatpuppeting.

  10. Please keep all discussions "in-house".
    1. What other wikis use for CM equivalents is irrelevant here.
    2. Please be wary of using other wikis, Fandom or otherwise, as sources of information. They are just as fallible as a site like Wikipedia in regards to accuracy because they can be edited by any user, just as this site can.
    3. Do not attempt to force a communication with an author in an attempt to gather evidence or settle a debate; besides the fact that this is a YMMV trope and thus author intent has variable weight depending on the circumstance, doing so may cross the line into drama exportation, which is prohibited site-wide.

If you would like to use an EP for your candidate, here's the general format. This format does not have to be followed exactly, but these are the main topics that need to be covered:

    Effortpost Template 

What is the work?

This is a brief summary of the work you're going to discuss. We don't need a full plot summary here, just however much we need to understand going into the discussion — it can even be as simple as quoting the summary on the work's page.

Who is the candidate and what have they done?

This is essentially the character's biography — who they are, their story, the crimes they commit, and, preferably (though not required), what happens to the candidate at the end. It does not have to include every single thing they ever do — for some villains, we'd be here all day if that was the case — but it should include the highlights of their journey.

Any redeeming qualities? Freudian Excuse?

This is where any potential redeeming characteristics or tragic backstory should be discussed. Do they have a tragic past? Do they show that Even Evil Has Standards or Even Evil Has Loved Ones? Maybe a Pet the Dog moment or two? This is where these should be discussed in full. Not every potential redeeming moment is a clear-cut disqualifier, but we should hear of any potential issues to ensure the character is discussed in full.

Are they bad enough?

A Complete Monster has to be particularly vile by the standard of the work they appear in. Therefore, you should look at what the character does compared to similar characters in the same work. This takes into account things like:

  • Their resource level (a human Serial Killer can't stand up to an alien Omnicidal Maniac, but they can be bad by the standard of other human serial killers)
  • The amount of time they have to work with (such as a one-shot character versus long-running antagonists)
  • The quantity vs. quality of their crimes compared to others (someone with a lower victim count but far more visceral and personal crimes could be considered as equally bad overall as someone with a higher body count but less horror involved)

Essentially, this section is an analysis of the kinds of villainy shown in the work and an explanation of why this particular character's villainy stands out within it.

Final verdict?

This is where you post your final conclusion on the character in question. You can continue elaborating on your reasons or even just say a simple "yes" or "no"; at this point, we've heard everything we need to hear.


IMPORTANT NOTICE: This thread tackles very serious and dark matters on a daily basis. We will be discussing things like murder, rape, torture, human trafficking, crimes against children, and in particularly dark cases, several of these issues at the same time. We keep a lighthearted air, but all candidates carry the general assumption that these are awful individuals committing disgusting crimes. We ask that if you participate, you do so with the requisite seriousness such dark topics require; exclamations of how gross something is, whether serious or sarcastic, are disrespectful to the topics at hand, and if you cannot handle such topics, please do not participate.

And that's everything you need to know. Welcome to the thread!


Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 12th 2024 at 3:13:36 PM

LoadsAndLoadsOfFreeTime Raz (Season 2) Relationship Status: I love you for psychological reasons
#47401: Jun 19th 2024 at 6:32:01 PM

[tup] Kwin and President Koopa.

I never thought I'd see the day we got an official(?) CM incarnation of the Koopa King, but here we are.

I don't want the world, I just want your half.
Beast from Ontario, Canada Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#47403: Jun 19th 2024 at 6:40:22 PM

[tup] "Behold, the President of the Koopa!"

"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
Snoketrope Barb / Temporary Kylo from California Since: Oct, 2020 Relationship Status: Waiting for Prince Charming
Barb / Temporary Kylo
#47404: Jun 19th 2024 at 6:41:37 PM

[tup] to President Koopa.

Happy B Day Scrags'!

Bow to the Prototype
AwarenessBringer Since: Sep, 2017 Relationship Status: Singularity
#47405: Jun 19th 2024 at 6:44:24 PM

Good to know about Script!Koopa! [tup]

Snowy66 Since: May, 2012
#47406: Jun 19th 2024 at 6:47:30 PM

[tup]To President Not-Bowser. Happy Birthday!

PassingThrough Since: Feb, 2024
#47407: Jun 19th 2024 at 6:48:54 PM

Gotta love the scripts for when all else fails! Yes to um... that one draft of Koopa!

DoodSlayer136 It's Him from SAGE (Snick Amateur Game Expo) (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
PassingThrough Since: Feb, 2024
#47409: Jun 19th 2024 at 6:59:06 PM

Lemme make some room for a pending.

  • Kite (2014):
    • Karl Aker is a crooked cop stealing guns to sell across his poverty-stricken country. Killing or intimidating fellow officers who discover his crimes, Karl uses the mind-wiping drug amp to turn Sawa, the daughter of one victim, into his personal assassin. Eliminating any rivals in the underworld through her, Karl tracks down and murders a former officer who tells Sawa the truth, then shoots Sawa full of amp and tries to convince her to stay as his hitwoman.
    • The Emir

Now, the book version of Abraham Lincoln: Vampire Hunter. Same story, Abe's out to fight Confederates backed by vampires and while the vamps are just a mass here, the leader of the conspiracy allying with them is very much an individual nasty. Some discussion will be needed about heinousness but he's worth a shake. Lemme bring you someone I'm surprised we don't have more incarnations of on this trope:

Who is Jefferson Davis? What has he done?

The first and only President of the Confederate States, Davis is an accomplished politician, military man... and complete coward who wants to secure his own safety by feeding "inferior" black slaves to the vampires. Fully aware of how their society picks slaves for consumption and aiming to use them to win the war, Davis is confronted by Lincoln after the hero and his allies are lured to Davis' home while attempting to assassinate him. Confronting Lincoln alongside his vampire bodyguards, he smugly (and racistly) gloats about being on the "right side" of history, acknowledging the superiority of vampires and happy to let them rule in the shadows while he gets to keep up the plantations of the South. When questioned by Lincoln as to what he intends to do when the vampires run out of slaves, he callously quips he'll live and die in wealth and security, uncaring for the fate of mankind and banking on the slaves providing enough food for them while he's alive.

Trying to kill Lincoln, the heroes are rescued by the good vampire Henry Sturges but the country falls into Civil War when a Confederate commander fires upon a Union base. Much like in the film, the Confederates bolster their ranks with vampires and use smokescreen tactics to feed on the helpless Union troops in combat, one battle literally seeing hundreds of Union men torn apart, including a poor drummer boy. The vampire forces also dispatch an assassin, who manages to kill Lincoln's son Willie before killing himself to avoid capture. The war itself is made even more ghastly by the Confederate practice of handing captured troops over to vampires for torture by a particularly nasty method involving a saw before letting them be devoured.

When Lincoln announces the Emancipation Proclamation and excited slaves begin rebelling against their masters, the vampires are brought in to quell them, violently devouring any slaves who dare revolt, though the number of resistors means some slaves are able to kill the vamps. The South loses the war and the vampires are reduced to scavenging while Davis is forced on the run. A plan to assassinate Lincoln to empower the government in exile by the moronic young vampire John Wilkes Booth fails and Booth himself is killed by Henry, Davis fading from importance and dying remembered much like he is in real life: a loser.

Heinousness?

He's a pawn to the vampires but one who knows he is and the highest ranking Confederate who personally wants to keep slavery going out of prejudice and lets them do as they please, torturing Union troops to death, devouring black slaves and the Confederate tactics are straight fear stuff, what with ruthlessly maiming Union men, including children, to intimidate. It's even stated he knows what the vampires are using him for and willingly keeps an alliance for his own safety.

The vampires of the novel themselves are a collective mass beyond Booth and comparatively, Booth actually remembers crying when he first devoured a slave girl, while Davis never shows anything but smug approval as "lesser" beings are eaten. Even with the villains of the sequel, we've got room for The Quisling helping vampires rule America because he loves slavery.

Mitigating factors?

As in real life he's said to have a wife and children but he never talks about them himself and the only time he's on page he just shows himself to be a racist coward hoping to live a long life under vampire-sponsored rule, maintaining the "right way of life", without a care for the chaos that'll ensue when the vampires finish eating all the slaves.

Verdict?

Thinking yes.

therealjackieboy from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
Beast from Ontario, Canada Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#47411: Jun 19th 2024 at 7:08:14 PM

[tup] Jefferson Davis.

"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
Agentofchaos A God Am I from Somewhere in the Universe Since: Dec, 2021
TurlesTheVegan Xykon from The Darkest Pit of the Underworld Since: Dec, 2023 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Xykon
#47413: Jun 19th 2024 at 7:12:51 PM

[tup] for Jefferson Davis.

Power, it isn't something that you put on or take off like a jacket. It's just something you are.
Ravok Son of Liberty from Big Shell Since: Jun, 2015 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Son of Liberty
#47415: Jun 19th 2024 at 8:02:17 PM

Yea to Davis!

  • Twin Peaks:
    • Northwest Passage extended film: BOB, though not an ancient, supernatural evil in this alternate pilot, remains a sadistic killer. On a spree of torture, rape and murder of teenage girls to use letters from their names to spell out "Robert", BOB has terrorized and killed many people over the years beforehand. His current selection of victims includes Teresa Banks and Laura Palmer, and though Ronette Pulaski escapes his clutches, the abuse BOB put her through leaves her comatose and traumatized. When tracked down by Special Agent Cooper, BOB happily promises that he can't be stopped, and that he will kill again.

No! That is NOT Solid Snake! Stop impersonating him!
Libraryseraph uu~ from Canada (Handed A Sword) Relationship Status: Raising My Lily Rank With You
uu~
#47416: Jun 19th 2024 at 8:15:48 PM

[tup] to President Koopa and Davies

HAPPY HALLOWEEN FOR MARIA
ForgoLight The Ultimate Lifeform Since: Oct, 2022 Relationship Status: In Lesbians with you
PeterVanHelsing Since: Sep, 2019
#47418: Jun 19th 2024 at 8:25:05 PM

[tup] President Koopa and President Davis.

ThereAintNoMountain Professional Yapper (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Professional Yapper
#47419: Jun 19th 2024 at 8:33:59 PM

[tup] to Koopa

Those rewrites sound wild lmao

TheGrayFox ....Phenomenal from A Lovecraftian fishing village Since: Sep, 2011
....Phenomenal
#47420: Jun 19th 2024 at 8:37:36 PM

[tup] for Koopa and Davis.

There remains a foothold out of this mire — now climb.
Overlord Since: Mar, 2013
#47421: Jun 19th 2024 at 9:13:05 PM

Yes to Koopa and Davis.

I just finished Star Trek Titan: Fortunes of War by David Mack on Audible.

It's about various factions trying obtain Husnock technology, with the Husnock species having been destroyed by a god being 20 years ago,but their technology remained.

The main villain, Breen Commander Thot Tren seemed to have some redeeming qualities. Loyalty to the Breen Confederacy, care for some of his men, although he did execute his first officer for failure, disgust over the destruction of the Husnock and grudging respect for the Titan crew.

Quark's cousin Galia shows up and that guy is a scumbag. In Deep Space 9 he tried to sell virus that will kill 28 million people to a genocidal dictator and there is a short story where he caused a genocidal war on a planet so he could sell both sides weapons. He tries to sell the Breen deadly Husnock weapons in this story and threatens torture and enslave a Pakled crew for crossing him.

The novel verse would be a seperate timeline from the Prime timeline at this point, so I could just propose Galia based on his actions in Deep Space 9, but I think his actions in Deep Space 9 and the various novels would make for a more fun proposal. He has appeared in a few other novels I have never read though, so I would have to track those down.

TheMadCr0w (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Get out of here, STALKER
#47422: Jun 19th 2024 at 9:47:09 PM

  • In the Mouth of Madness: Sutter Cane is a bestselling horror author who made a pact with the Old Ones to unleash them upon the world. Given the power to reshape reality with his books, Cane appeases the Old Ones by letting them use his books as a conduit to influence Cane's readers, instigating riots and murders with his latest book Hobb's End Horror. By writing his masterpiece, In the Mouth of Madness, Cane intends to create a new reality where the Old Ones are the dominant species while Cane himself ascends to godhood. To complete the book, Cane flees to Hobb's End, having turned the fictional town into a real Pocket Dimension ruled by Cane himself. Inside the reality of Hobb's End, Cane has a cyclist trapped in an eternal time loop; a desperate father commit suicide; and most of the town turned into monsters, starting with the children. All too happy to sacrifice everyone for power, the release of not only the book but also the film adaptation of In the Mouth of Madness leads to the collapse of society, the entire world turned into a horror story where humanity loses.
  • I Saw the TV Glow: The Man in the Moon, Mr. Melancholy, is the Big Bad of The Pink Opaque. The Arch-Enemy of Isabel and Tara, Mr. Melancholy is on a quest to steal the hearts of 100 children in order to power eternal night time, sending lackeys to cause trouble in his attempts to trap the two girls in the Midnight Realm. Revealed to be much more than just the villain of a TV show, Mr. Melancholy is in fact a very real monster who has trapped Isabel and Tara in a false reality where they are Owen and Maddy, two outcasts obsessed with The Pink Opaque, while their actual bodies are slowly suffocating to death beneath the ground, leaving Mr. Melancholy free to Take Over the World in their absence.

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#47423: Jun 19th 2024 at 9:58:46 PM

[tup]koopa and Davis

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Dude-of-Wealth-And-Taste (Apprentice) Relationship Status: Become a part of me!
#47424: Jun 19th 2024 at 10:11:25 PM

[tup] to script!King Koopa and Jefferson Davis

Till all are one.
jlvs200s from The Netherlands (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: I miss my wife, Tails
#47425: Jun 19th 2024 at 10:24:25 PM

[tup] President Koopa, Jefferson Davis.

Also a (late?) happy birthday Scrags!

"The time has come for every last Shoppe... No! The time has come for the DREAM KINGDOM to bow down to me! Gotcha ! Hee-hee!" | He/Him

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