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Complete Monster Proposal Thread

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Old Complete Monster cleanup thread

Welcome to the Complete Monster proposal thread! This is the thread where new Complete Monster examples are vetted, approved, and written up. If you're looking for the general cleanup thread (for cuts, rewrites, expansions, and the like), please go here

Important: Before suggesting any new examples, please read the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List; if you have any questions, the odds are high they are answered there. Additionally, please check here for the earliest date a work can be discussed (usually two weeks from the U.S. release date) and whether the work has already been reserved by another user.

Here is how the process works:

    Process 

  1. If you have a candidate to propose, you can simply come right in and propose them! If the character's run is brief, such as a single issue of a comic book, then a simple summary of their actions and any potential redeeming qualities will be enough; for longer-running candidates, an effortpost (EP) might be helpful for organizing the proposal. An EP is not outright required, but please be mindful that if a post becomes too clunky and unorganized, it can be very hard for other people to follow.

  2. After the proposal, there will be a 72-hour discussion and voting period, where people may ask questions and vote on the candidate. The number of upvotes must outnumber the downvotes by at least five for the character to be considered "approved".

  3. Three days after the proposal has been made, if the character has been approved, you may post the writeup (the text to be posted on the trope page itself) on the thread and send it to the drafts page. Your candidate will soon be added to the CM subpage. If the work has a page, you should add your candidate to the relevant YMMV page. Voila! It's that simple!

Outside of this process, we do have a few ground rules:

    Ground Rules 

  1. To keep the thread moving at a reasonable pace, there are some restrictions on when a proposal can be made. There should only be a maximum of four EPs posted both per page and per hour to ensure that nothing gets lost in the shuffle; additionally, each individual troper should only be proposing or writing up characters from a maximum of three works at a time (from initial proposals to end of their voting period). If your proposal would fall outside of either of these guidelines, we'd like to ask you to please wait until they would fit within; feel free to type them up on an outside document, and then when the time comes, you can just copy, paste, and post!

  2. No plagiarism of any kind. This is a very serious matter site-wide, as the website could get in actual legal trouble over this; as a result, this can very quickly lead to mod intervention. This can take many different forms:
    1. Direct plagiarism, i.e. wholesale copying. This is not only the easiest to find, but is also the most likely to warrant quick moderator intervention. To be clear, quoting in some places is perfectly acceptable, but it has to be very clear you're quoting from something else and it cannot be anything longer than a sentence or two - if you're quoting an entire work summary from Wikipedia, no one is going to believe you've actually consumed the work, so even if you cite your source, your candidate will be downvoted anyway.
    2. Self-plagiarism. Even if you can prove that you wrote the same text in both places, the site itself can't contain any of the duplicated text. If you already wrote something once before, it's not too hard to write it a second time.
    3. Using another site's work as a template for a proposal. Just because you don't copy and paste something directly doesn't mean it's any harder to detect if you're basing parts or all of your proposal on text someone else wrote. To be clear, this doesn't violate site rules and won't lead to mod intervention, but just like if you directly plagiarize, no one will believe you've consumed the work if you're clearly basing your proposal on something else. This thread largely operates on the honor system, and tweaking someone else's work to pass it off as your own is one of the fastest ways to lose trust.

  3. Don't delete an EP unless you intend to swiftly repost it. We know that there are reasons why you might want to delete an EP, especially if it's being downvoted - rejection is hard, even in a low-stakes environment like this. However, deleting it renders the current discussion null and void, makes it impossible to reference the discussion in the future and can confuse tropers who didn't read it before the deletion. If the issue is temporary (such as formatting problems or a post getting overlooked as the thread moves on), then deleting and quickly reposting the EP is a valid option, but to fully retract an EP, please use the [[strike:]] markup instead.

  4. Votes must be for specific candidates, meaning no blanket voting (i.e. "yes to everyone I missed").

  5. If you are the first person to downvote a candidate, please provide an explanation of why when you do so. We're here for discussions above all, and a hit-and-run downvote doesn't facilitate anything.

  6. 'If a work is already reserved by another user , please don't comment on the work or any potential characters worth discussion before the discussion date. We know how exciting it is when a work has a keeper that you're waiting to talk about, but it's not fair to the person who reserved the work who is just as excited to lead the discussion to see the discussion getting spoiled before they get to do it. On the other hand, if the reservation only has one name attached, shoot them a PM - they may be down for a collaboration, which will get you in on the fun as well!

  7. Please keep the thread on-topic. While discussing the trope is fun and we encourage people to enjoy it, questions like "who's your favorite CM" are off-topic and can lead to thumps. That's the kind of question to take to people's PMs if they're willing. Similarly, while we encourage friendliness and familiarity with other users, posts should always have some kind of thread-relevant purpose; for instance, if you want to wish someone a happy birthday, feel free to, but if it's the only thing in the post, it's off-topic and needs something else alongside it. Again, though, while we strive for a friendly atmosphere, this is not Facebook; life updates are fun, but unless they have some kind of impact on your thread participation, please do not bring it here - we have Yack Fest for that.

  8. Please refrain from asking anything along the lines of "How Did We Miss This One?" In almost every case, the answer is simply "No one thought about it before". This Is a Wiki where everyone has different interests, and the fact that people missed a particular candidate, even one that seems like a textbook example of a trope or a character who is particularly iconic in pop culture, means absolutely nothing. The question is disruptive, has a simple and consistent answer, and provides nothing to any discussion.

  9. If you are suspended from parts of the website, it is still possible to participate!
    1. For users who are suspended from editing the wiki, you still have full access to this thread. You can propose candidates and write them up with no issues whatsoever; while you will have to ask someone else to post the entry to the relevant pages once it is done, all write-ups are considered thread-approved - as in, done by consensus - and thus doing so does not violate any rules regarding meatpuppeting.
    2. If you are suspended from the forums, your participation is limited but not impossible. It is still possible for a forum-suspended user to assist in creating the write-up for a character who has already been approved; as previously mentioned, write-ups are inherently considered a consensus-based edit and thus not tied to any one particular user. However, you can not assist in the proposal of a character; as a proposal is based around the forum rather than the wiki, doing so with a forum suspension qualifies as meatpuppeting.

  10. Please keep all discussions "in-house".
    1. What other wikis use for CM equivalents is irrelevant here.
    2. Please be wary of using other wikis, Fandom or otherwise, as sources of information. They are just as fallible as a site like Wikipedia in regards to accuracy because they can be edited by any user, just as this site can.
    3. Do not attempt to force a communication with an author in an attempt to gather evidence or settle a debate; besides the fact that this is a YMMV trope and thus author intent has variable weight depending on the circumstance, doing so may cross the line into drama exportation, which is prohibited site-wide.

If you would like to use an EP for your candidate, here's the general format. This format does not have to be followed exactly, but these are the main topics that need to be covered:

    Effortpost Template 

What is the work?

This is a brief summary of the work you're going to discuss. We don't need a full plot summary here, just however much we need to understand going into the discussion — it can even be as simple as quoting the summary on the work's page.

Who is the candidate and what have they done?

This is essentially the character's biography — who they are, their story, the crimes they commit, and, preferably (though not required), what happens to the candidate at the end. It does not have to include every single thing they ever do — for some villains, we'd be here all day if that was the case — but it should include the highlights of their journey.

Any redeeming qualities? Freudian Excuse?

This is where any potential redeeming characteristics or tragic backstory should be discussed. Do they have a tragic past? Do they show that Even Evil Has Standards or Even Evil Has Loved Ones? Maybe a Pet the Dog moment or two? This is where these should be discussed in full. Not every potential redeeming moment is a clear-cut disqualifier, but we should hear of any potential issues to ensure the character is discussed in full.

Are they bad enough?

A Complete Monster has to be particularly vile by the standard of the work they appear in. Therefore, you should look at what the character does compared to similar characters in the same work. This takes into account things like:

  • Their resource level (a human Serial Killer can't stand up to an alien Omnicidal Maniac, but they can be bad by the standard of other human serial killers)
  • The amount of time they have to work with (such as a one-shot character versus long-running antagonists)
  • The quantity vs. quality of their crimes compared to others (someone with a lower victim count but far more visceral and personal crimes could be considered as equally bad overall as someone with a higher body count but less horror involved)

Essentially, this section is an analysis of the kinds of villainy shown in the work and an explanation of why this particular character's villainy stands out within it.

Final verdict?

This is where you post your final conclusion on the character in question. You can continue elaborating on your reasons or even just say a simple "yes" or "no"; at this point, we've heard everything we need to hear.


IMPORTANT NOTICE: This thread tackles very serious and dark matters on a daily basis. We will be discussing things like murder, rape, torture, human trafficking, crimes against children, and in particularly dark cases, several of these issues at the same time. We keep a lighthearted air, but all candidates carry the general assumption that these are awful individuals committing disgusting crimes. We ask that if you participate, you do so with the requisite seriousness such dark topics require; exclamations of how gross something is, whether serious or sarcastic, are disrespectful to the topics at hand, and if you cannot handle such topics, please do not participate.

And that's everything you need to know. Welcome to the thread!


Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 12th 2024 at 3:13:36 PM

therealjackieboy from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
#39751: Mar 21st 2024 at 8:41:22 AM

[tup] Goth

What’s the Work?

(Mario) The Music Box is a very... fascinating fan game. It's basically what would happen if you made a game in the vein of Corpse Party, Mad Father, and The Witch's House... but have it star Mario and Luigi, with a very dark plot and little in the way of humor. While the game itself has a lot of effort behind it, and the creator made the game during a very dark time in her life, there are parts of the game unfortunately dripping with narm solely because of its premise. But I digress.

The game was followed up by an expansion known as ARC and the Wonderland DLC, where Mario is transported to a twisted version of Wonderland that he has to escape from. The first game also got a remake in 2021, but we're going to be talking about the original version.

The story involves Mario going to an abandoned mansion on the outskirts of the Mushroom Kingdom, which is said to be cursed, as many who enter it haven't returned. While there, Mario opens up a music box and unleashes a curse that prevents him from leaving. Now Mario, with the help of Luigi and the supposed inspector Riba, must find a way out of the mansion while uncovering all of its secrets. Oh, and while trying to avoid very gory deaths and game overs.

Later expansions shed more light on the mansion's residents, such as the fate of the nearby Evangeline Town that resides beside the mansion, and the reason why Mario and Luigi were drawn back to the mansion despite having no familiarity with it.

But most of the tragedies surrounding these games can all be traced back to one person.

Who is She?

Len Alwena Foska, taking the form of an innocent black cat, is later revealed to be the evil and sadistic Witch of Fate who is responsible for most of the events of the entire series.

What has she done?

Having given the witch hunter clergyman Marchionne Evangelisti a brooch that would grant him whatever wish he desired should he be on the brink of death, upon his eventual execution at the hands of Riba, Len predicted that Marchionne would use the brooch to reset the world to be with his loved ones once again. But Len had a condition for Marchionne: if he were to use it, he would be her test subject for her studies on human nature. Len knew that Marchionne’s reincarnation, Mario, would one day return to Evangeline Town centuries later, and that he would be the subject of her tests. Len also gave the newlyweds Alice and Riba a music box as a gift, which would set the stage for Alice’s cursing of the mansion and Evangeline, which would result in several deaths, and further set up the events of the series.

Revealing herself in ARC’s Missing Ending C/Continuance 4 Ending, Len reveals that she has witnessed Mario die several times in multiple different points in time, revealing that each new save is a new world where Mario learns from his previous mistakes and survives a little bit longer. Gleefully revealing to Mario that he’s died several times in the previous endings as part of her experiments, it turns out that every death the player suffers throughout these games is canon, and that no matter how hard Mario tries, he will never break the cycle. Mario will continue to die for as long as Len allows it to happen.

Upon Mario surviving an onslaught of her attacks, Len still murders him, feeling that this version of him is no longer needed for her experiment, and sends him down a pit. But Mario wakes up to find that the pit is filled with the corpses of… himself, the previous experiments who all died from the numerous, numerous deaths one can encounter throughout these games.

Becoming the true villain of the Wonderland DLC, while also taking the place of the Chesire Cat, it’s revealed that Len worked with Marchionne to create the Wonderland dimension as a way to reincarnate his soul into his old world and gain ultimate power, despite the fact that it wasn't exactly what Marchionne wanted. Len has Marchionne remade into King Sündige Nacht, who's supposed death kickstarts the plot. Len uses Nacht to her liking, manipulating a series of tragedies such as driving the Mad Hatter to murderous insanity and allowing innocents to be executed for Nacht's supposed murder in order to further experiment on the population. For Marchionne to escape from this dimension, Mario would have to finish the game... which Len makes sure doesn't happen.

With many Marios dying during this entire time, which creates an endless cycle of Mario failing to succeed, in the Missing E Ending, Len removes Mario’s voice after he's been arrested for Nacht's "murder", thus preventing him from speaking out during his trial and facing execution. When Marchionne expresses his disapproval over yet another failed attempt, Len has him killed, despite having promised to let Marchionne live, solely because she feels she's allowed to terminate an experiment as she pleases. In the Missing F Ending, after Nacht is killed by Mario, Len, refusing to end her experiment, manipulates Mario into taking possession of his crown and wishing to rule Wonderland, stating her anticipation of waiting for the cycle to be broken, but ready to enjoy every tragic moment of it until that happens.

Redeeming Qualities?

Nope! Len is a vile witch who is willing to put many people through eternal suffering for the sake of experimenting on them, and is even willing to intervene in her own experiments if she feels they're not interesting enough.

The only somewhat nice thing she does is in an ending in ARC where, if the player doesn't save, the entire game's revealed to have been a coma dream Mario had after suffering a crash while karting. Len appears in her cat form to let Mario know that she doesn't need him for her experiments anymore, since he never had to save and thus never died once, thus she lets him go. But it's heavily implied through her dialogue that she only did this out of pure pragmatism; since she only values people as part of her experiments, plus the fact that she ominously says "So in other words... I don't need you" shows that this isn't meant to be an act of genuine altruism, and the story doesn't really treat it as such. Again, she doesn't see people as people, just test subjects in her labyrinth, so to her, letting Mario go means that he is just simply no longer needed for her experiments. It's a weird form of logic, but it lines up with the kind of person that she is.

Heinousness?

So the story, despite its weird premise, is played very straight, and is very dark. It's not edgelord dark or anything; this game has way more effort than that. And there are some nasty villains in this game, but none of them count. Let's go over our three big ones, shall we?

  • Alice Aduraice, despite being a psychopath responsible for cursing her mansion, behind several deaths out of either jealousy or an attempt to gain immortality, is abusive to her adopted daughter Anna with hopes of sacrificing her eventual child Serina, and has a plan that threatens the entire world, has had a pretty miserable childhood of being abused by her own horrible mother, she genuinely loves Riba despite being obsessive over him, and there's endings where she can pull a Heel–Face Turn after realizing the error of her ways, even showing regret for mistreating Anna.
  • Riba, despite being a demon who ruined Marchinonne's life by killing him and his family for the sake of greed, corrupting Alice into the monster we know her as today, and is a massive dickhead to boot, genuinely loved his previous wife Elizabeth and daughter Anna, realizes that he has genuine feelings for Marchionne, and also pulls a Heel–Face Turn in several of the endings.
  • Marchionne Evangelisti, despite being responsible for a series of witch hunts with intent to wipe them all out, and is the Big Bad of ARC's Insane Route, deeply cares for his brother Luciano, is a Well-Intentioned Extremist, and has had a miserable childhood under his abusive parents who made him the religious Knight Templar he is today.

Len, meanwhile, doesn't have an excuse for her deeds. She's just a sadistic Mad Scientist who only values people as part of her experiments. She's responsible for a lot of tragedies, from Marchionne's actions in the Insane Route, to the curse surrounding the Aduraice Mansion and Evangeline Town that's resulted in numerous deaths, to the macabre state of Wonderland, to the hundreds of deaths Mario's been through across hundreds of timelines.

And while she makes a small cameo in the first game's remake, that is considered a separate timeline from this, and she doesn't really do anything in it to warrant another proposal.

Conclusion

An interesting keep from an interesting fan game.

Edited by therealjackieboy on Mar 21st 2024 at 8:43:04 AM

It's Spooky Month!
TurlesTheVegan Xykon from The Darkest Pit of the Underworld Since: Dec, 2023 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Xykon
#39752: Mar 21st 2024 at 8:50:26 AM

[tup] for Len Alwena Foska.

Power, it isn't something that you put on or take off like a jacket. It's just something you are.
EmperorGeode from A Galaxy far, far away Since: Oct, 2022 Relationship Status: On the prowl
#39753: Mar 21st 2024 at 8:52:13 AM

[tup] Len

  • What if Sauron Reclaimed the One Ring? (link): After the Nazgûl reclaim the One Ring for him, Sauron leads his army to slaughter the Free People at the Black Gate. He personally breaks Aragorn’s spirit before torturing and killing him, after which he makes his body into banner for his army. Sauron has his army to destroy Gondor. Setting his sights on Lothlórien. he carves a warpath across Middle Earth, conquering lands while enslaving or killing anybody he sees. Knowing that the Elves plan to set sail for Valinor and take their Rings of Power with them, Sauron marches to the Grey Havens to stop them, burning Fangorn Forest when sentient trees inhabiting it try to resist him. Sauron spends years ruling Middle Earth and enslaving all its people, including punishing Saruman for his betrayal, before being defeated by the forces of Valinor.
  • What if Saruman Took the One Ring? (link): Saruman sucessfully captures the hobbits and persuades Frodo to give the One Ring to him, becoming the greatest threat to Middle Earth. Saruman grows his power and knowledge, turning some of Sauron’s forces to his side and slowly enslaving Sauron himself. When Gandalf faces him and calls the sentient trees of Fangorn Forest for help, Saruman uses his powers to burn Fangorn forest down. He has the Nazgûl capture Gandalf, planning to torture both him and the hobbits until the end of the world. Saruman continues to use Wormtongue to weaken the kingdom of Rohan before his armies destroy it, getting rid of Wormtongue after he outlives his usefulness. He tries to convince Aragorn to ally with him with visions of peace and a renewed Númenor, only to have Aragorn and the Gray Company captured and tortured when it fails. Saruman manipulates the people of Gondor into making weapons for his conquest while continuing to spread industry across his territories. Saruman conquers all of Middle Earth, spreading his industry across it and enslaving its inhabitants for centuries while reducing Radagast the Brown, Sauron and eventually Gandalf to his servants. Ever hungry for more power and knowledge, Saruman is eventually manipulated by Sauron into releasing Melkor, foolishly believing that the first Dark Lord will be willing to ally himself with Saruman against the Valar.

Etrebamort Lord from Purgatory. Since: Mar, 2024 Relationship Status: At the center of everything that happens to me
Lord
#39754: Mar 21st 2024 at 8:54:45 AM

I’ve got two doozies for you here, both from The Whitby Witches saga which I’ve recently created an article for. They’re by Robin Jarvis, who is a Jamie Oliver of Complete Monsters. Let's start with the first to appear.

Nathaniel Crozier, High Priest of the Black Sceptre is described as “the most evil man in the world.”

Who is he and what has he done? He’s the leader of a polygamous cult called the Coven of the Black Sceptre, consisting mostly of middle-aged, unattractive women who were lonely and unloved before he married them and recruited them into his cult. Controlling them through dark magic and psychological manipulation, he is highly abusive and cruel to them, giving them the ability to turn into dogs or dog-human hybrids, which is pretty much a metaphor for how he treats them. His Brides worship him as a god, to the point of being willing to suffer and die for him but he treats them as nothing more than a means to an end and as pawns in his plans.

Power-hungry to a fault, in the first book he sends his wife Rosalyn, his High Priestess and second-in-command to the seaside town of Whitby to find some magical artifacts he is looking for. In the second book, he sends one of his Brides to poison Patricia Gunning, an old friend of the Big Good, Miss Boston, forcing her to leave Whitby and go to take care of her. With Boston out of the way, Crozier comes to Whitby himself, seeking the Guardians of Whitby, a set of amulets that were forged by the gods to imprison an demon dragon called Morgawrus. Crozier wants to release Morgawrus so that he can use his mind powers to enslave it and Take Over the World with its might. To this end, he forcibly moves into a house with a couple called the Gregsons, attacking Mr. Gregson with his mind powers to send him into a coma and forcing his wife to become his caretaker. He also hypnotises Jennet Laurenson, the twelve-year-old big sister of Ben, the main protagonist. He makes her fall in love with him so that he can use her as his pawn to learn more about Whitby and his wife’s failed mission there.

He gains control of a being called the fish-demon which he uses to murder numerous people, while his servant Judith continues to poison and abuse the elderly Patricia Gunning on his orders. Finding one of the Guardians, a talking rock, he tricks it into telling him all of its secrets before smashing it to pieces.

Having learned who the custodian of the other Guardian is, an elderly man named Mr. Roper, he goes to Roper’s house and tries to force him to give up the location of the Guardian. When Roper refuses, Crozier destroys his entire precious collection of cruet sets. This might not sound particularly bad but collecting rare cruet sets became Mr. Roper’s hobby after his mental breakdown following the death of his wife as a means of ordering his life and has become an obsessive compulsion to him, so these salt and pepper sellers are basically his dearest possession. Imagine someone smashing up your record collection to make you tell them where they can find an amulet that will let them set a demon dragon loose on the world. What a jerk! When this doesn’t work, he tries torturing Roper with his magical powers but Roper, a Badass Grandpa and Determinator to a fault manages to resist Crozier’s torture, after which Crozier painfully invades Roper’s mind and finds the location of the Guardian anyway, before mercilessly killing the elderly gentleman. Why didn’t he just do this in the first place you may well ask? Why waste all that time inflicting pain on him? Presumably because he thought it was good sport.

Jennet is completely infatuated with him by now, to the point that she ventures out into the storm he’s caused by releasing Morgawrus to look for him out of concern for his safety. When she encounters him at the cliff-edge, he tells her what he really thinks of her, whilst strangling Miss Boston, her guardian, in front of her.

"Will you never stop pestering me, you boring child? Your constant simpering grates on me. What does it take to be rid of your pathetic attentions – shall I throttle you as well?"

This massive Kick the Dog moment is probably the most virtuous moment he has in the entire series because thanks to that, we at least know that he’s not a paedophile.

After Miss Boston arrives to stop him, he taunts her over the deaths of her friends, including Mr. Roper whose murder she didn’t even know about until now. She fortunately distracts him long enough for Morgawrus to break free of his control. When Crozier attempts literally Bullying a Dragon, Morgawrus kills him, to our great satisfaction.

When Crozier is resurrected by the Lord of the Frozen Wastes in the third book, he uses his power on Jennet again to make her bow to him in order to demonstrate his power to the coven, and he then tries to make her kill herself for his amusement before Miss Boston again pulls a Big Damn Heroes When Crozier’s daughter, Pear, helps Miss Boston, Jennet and Ben escape, her mother reminds her of how Crozier punishes those who fail or disobey him and revels in torture, warning her that the fact that she is his daughter will not make him go any easier on her than on anyone else and Pear’s Heroic Sacrifice is arguably an attempt at avoiding a Fate Worse than Death. Having sent Meta and Pear to deal with Miss Boston and the children, he goes to the cliffs of Whitby to attempt to free Morgawrus again with intention of using him to destroy the god who brought him back to life in revenge for having used him as a pawn in his plan.

Heinousness Just in case you were still in any doubt that he’s a See You Next Tuesday, it’s mentioned repeatedly that before the events of the series, he and Rosalyn took over an African village and subjected its people to a hideous massacre from which not even the children and babies were spared. It’s never confirmed whether this act of depravity was in pursuit of a particular goal or if it was just his idea of a romantic evening with his wife. Given his personality, either is just as likely!

Mitigating factors None. He’s provided with no Freudian Excuse. At one point he says that people have called him insane ever since he was a child, which could suggest him being an Enfante Terrible as easily as it could an abusive childhood. Although a vile Hate Sink, he still definitely possesses some traits of Evil Is Cool, being an extremely powerful and intelligent Evil Sorcerer, a skilled Chessmaster and Manipulative Bastard and a Deadpan Snarker par excellence. But being cool doesn’t redeem you from being a CM. The Joker, Moriarty, Palpatine, Voldemort, Scar and Ozai are just a few of the names that spring to mind. And he’s certainly not meant to be liked. Although he clearly thinks he’s the most Magnificent Bastard ever to Bastard, he’s a Smug Snake to his core. His miscalculations, although few and far between, are still leviathan in scope (literally in the case of Morgawrus) and the author invites us to laugh at his failures. As the psychopath that he is, he never learns from his mistakes. Even after being brought back from the dead, having had his ass (literally) dusted by the demon god he decided to pick a fight with, such is the size of his ego that he then immediately goes to try and resurrect the said demon god and pick a fight with him again.

He has no redeeming traits, isn’t a Well-Intentioned Extremist or Knight Templar trying to conquer the world to make it a better place, he just wants to rule the damn thing and despite still being partially in love with him, Jennet tells Pear that he was “a cruel, vile man who cared for no-one but himself.” He’s clearly an allegory of real life abusers and cult leaders who take advantage of women with low self-esteem and traumatise them but who are unable to leave their sway and is even described in the narrative as “the most evil and callous outcast from virtuous humanity the world has ever known”, making both of his Karmic Deaths equally karmic and satisfying indeed.

Verdict?

Edited by Etrebamort on Mar 21st 2024 at 11:44:43 AM

Lord Etrabamort
Agentofchaos A God Am I from Somewhere in the Universe Since: Dec, 2021
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
Etrebamort Lord from Purgatory. Since: Mar, 2024 Relationship Status: At the center of everything that happens to me
Lord
#39757: Mar 21st 2024 at 11:44:29 AM

Thumbs up to Saruman.

Lord Etrabamort
therealjackieboy from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
#39758: Mar 21st 2024 at 12:12:34 PM

  • Chained Heat 2:
    • Stanley Goff is the secret financier of the brutal Razig Penitentiary, having turned the prison into his own criminal enterprise. Goff has countless women framed and sentenced to his prison, even participating in the trials himself, whereupon the prisoners are forced to partake in drug trafficking and prostitution to line his pockets. To get away with his crimes, Goff supplies his judge with plentiful women for him to torture to death.
    • The Judge is an associate in Goff and Warden Kassar’s criminal operation. Harboring a fetishistic love of torturing women to death, the Judge promised Goff to keep quiet of his crimes as long as he’s allowed to torture his prisoners. Having done this for many years, the Judge slowly kills Tina at a party, and tries to do the same to Carla.

It's Spooky Month!
LarryT Since: Aug, 2023
#39759: Mar 21st 2024 at 12:13:24 PM

[tup] Len and Crozier, although you don’t need to make the mitigating factors section so long if he quite clearly doesn’t have any.

MasterN Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button from Florida- I mean Unova Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#39760: Mar 21st 2024 at 12:35:38 PM

Double posted by accident.

Edited by MasterN on Mar 21st 2024 at 12:42:26 PM

One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.
MasterN Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button from Florida- I mean Unova Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#39761: Mar 21st 2024 at 12:37:04 PM

[tup] Len, yet another character I was gonna propose myself. But you did a better job than I ever could, so thanks. By the way, Dimentio is apparently going to appear in ARC Remastered, so he’s looking like another candidate.

Edited by MasterN on Mar 21st 2024 at 12:50:06 PM

One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.
jlvs200s from The Netherlands (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: I miss my wife, Tails
#39762: Mar 21st 2024 at 12:41:24 PM

[tup] Len and Crozier

"The time has come for every last Shoppe... No! The time has come for the DREAM KINGDOM to bow down to me! Gotcha ! Hee-hee!" | He/Him
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#39763: Mar 21st 2024 at 12:49:12 PM

So Crozier...kills several people, mind rapes a guy, and is mentioned to have participated in a massacre—but which is offscreen? I...guess sure to him? How do the other villains compare?

Etrebamort Lord from Purgatory. Since: Mar, 2024 Relationship Status: At the center of everything that happens to me
Lord
#39764: Mar 21st 2024 at 1:16:17 PM

Sorry, I just wanted to be thorough.

Lord Etrabamort
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#39765: Mar 21st 2024 at 1:32:21 PM

How does he compare to the other villains? He seems bad, but nothing special.

Etrebamort Lord from Purgatory. Since: Mar, 2024 Relationship Status: At the center of everything that happens to me
Lord
#39766: Mar 21st 2024 at 1:32:43 PM

There’s only one other villain in the series who matches him in evil, whom I’m going to post tomorrow!

Lord Etrabamort
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#39767: Mar 21st 2024 at 2:06:42 PM

[tup]len and crozier

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
LarryT Since: Aug, 2023
#39768: Mar 21st 2024 at 2:08:45 PM

[up][up][up][up]Totally fine, it’s just a bit long, especially if he clearly has no redeeming features. But being thorough is completely fine.

Ghal-Sur Since: Dec, 2021
#39769: Mar 21st 2024 at 3:10:48 PM

[tup]Len and Crouzier.

Master N:Don't put yourself down, you've always made great posts and there's no doubt that you would have done at least as well as Jackie. Your work has always been high quality and very well done. So don't doubt yourself, you would have done just as well as Jackie.

MasterN Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button from Florida- I mean Unova Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#39770: Mar 21st 2024 at 3:20:34 PM

It was a joke. I wasn’t actually putting myself down, just saying that some people who have been here longer can do a better job articulating some things.

Edited by MasterN on Mar 21st 2024 at 3:20:59 AM

One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.
TheGrayFox ....Phenomenal from A Lovecraftian fishing village Since: Sep, 2011
....Phenomenal
#39771: Mar 21st 2024 at 3:43:57 PM

[tup] for Len and Crozier.

There remains a foothold out of this mire — now climb.
EmperorGeode from A Galaxy far, far away Since: Oct, 2022 Relationship Status: On the prowl
Starkrafty Since: Sep, 2017
TurlesTheVegan Xykon from The Darkest Pit of the Underworld Since: Dec, 2023 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Xykon
#39774: Mar 21st 2024 at 6:04:15 PM

[tup] for Nate Crozier.

Power, it isn't something that you put on or take off like a jacket. It's just something you are.
RobertTYL Since: Oct, 2019 Relationship Status: Holding out for a hero
#39775: Mar 21st 2024 at 6:54:37 PM

[tup] Len, Crozier

(I don't like being bottom-paged...)


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