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Complete Monster Proposal Thread

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Old Complete Monster cleanup thread

Welcome to the Complete Monster proposal thread! This is the thread where new Complete Monster examples are vetted, approved, and written up. If you're looking for the general cleanup thread (for cuts, rewrites, expansions, and the like), please go here

Important: Before suggesting any new examples, please read the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List; if you have any questions, the odds are high they are answered there. Additionally, please check here for the earliest date a work can be discussed (usually two weeks from the U.S. release date) and whether the work has already been reserved by another user.

Here is how the process works:

    Process 

  1. If you have a candidate to propose, you can simply come right in and propose them! If the character's run is brief, such as a single issue of a comic book, then a simple summary of their actions and any potential redeeming qualities will be enough; for longer-running candidates, an effortpost (EP) might be helpful for organizing the proposal. An EP is not outright required, but please be mindful that if a post becomes too clunky and unorganized, it can be very hard for other people to follow.

  2. After the proposal, there will be a 72-hour discussion and voting period, where people may ask questions and vote on the candidate. The number of upvotes must outnumber the downvotes by at least five for the character to be considered "approved".

  3. Three days after the proposal has been made, if the character has been approved, you may post the writeup (the text to be posted on the trope page itself) on the thread and send it to the drafts page. Your candidate will soon be added to the CM subpage. If the work has a page, you should add your candidate to the relevant YMMV page. Voila! It's that simple!

Outside of this process, we do have a few ground rules:

    Ground Rules 

  1. To keep the thread moving at a reasonable pace, there are some restrictions on when a proposal can be made. There should only be a maximum of four EPs posted both per page and per hour to ensure that nothing gets lost in the shuffle; additionally, each individual troper should only be proposing or writing up characters from a maximum of three works at a time (from initial proposals to end of their voting period). If your proposal would fall outside of either of these guidelines, we'd like to ask you to please wait until they would fit within; feel free to type them up on an outside document, and then when the time comes, you can just copy, paste, and post!

  2. No plagiarism of any kind. This is a very serious matter site-wide, as the website could get in actual legal trouble over this; as a result, this can very quickly lead to mod intervention. This can take many different forms:
    1. Direct plagiarism, i.e. wholesale copying. This is not only the easiest to find, but is also the most likely to warrant quick moderator intervention. To be clear, quoting in some places is perfectly acceptable, but it has to be very clear you're quoting from something else and it cannot be anything longer than a sentence or two - if you're quoting an entire work summary from Wikipedia, no one is going to believe you've actually consumed the work, so even if you cite your source, your candidate will be downvoted anyway.
    2. Self-plagiarism. Even if you can prove that you wrote the same text in both places, the site itself can't contain any of the duplicated text. If you already wrote something once before, it's not too hard to write it a second time.
    3. Using another site's work as a template for a proposal. Just because you don't copy and paste something directly doesn't mean it's any harder to detect if you're basing parts or all of your proposal on text someone else wrote. To be clear, this doesn't violate site rules and won't lead to mod intervention, but just like if you directly plagiarize, no one will believe you've consumed the work if you're clearly basing your proposal on something else. This thread largely operates on the honor system, and tweaking someone else's work to pass it off as your own is one of the fastest ways to lose trust.

  3. Don't delete an EP unless you intend to swiftly repost it. We know that there are reasons why you might want to delete an EP, especially if it's being downvoted - rejection is hard, even in a low-stakes environment like this. However, deleting it renders the current discussion null and void, makes it impossible to reference the discussion in the future and can confuse tropers who didn't read it before the deletion. If the issue is temporary (such as formatting problems or a post getting overlooked as the thread moves on), then deleting and quickly reposting the EP is a valid option, but to fully retract an EP, please use the [[strike:]] markup instead.

  4. Votes must be for specific candidates, meaning no blanket voting (i.e. "yes to everyone I missed").

  5. If you are the first person to downvote a candidate, please provide an explanation of why when you do so. We're here for discussions above all, and a hit-and-run downvote doesn't facilitate anything.

  6. 'If a work is already reserved by another user , please don't comment on the work or any potential characters worth discussion before the discussion date. We know how exciting it is when a work has a keeper that you're waiting to talk about, but it's not fair to the person who reserved the work who is just as excited to lead the discussion to see the discussion getting spoiled before they get to do it. On the other hand, if the reservation only has one name attached, shoot them a PM - they may be down for a collaboration, which will get you in on the fun as well!

  7. Please keep the thread on-topic. While discussing the trope is fun and we encourage people to enjoy it, questions like "who's your favorite CM" are off-topic and can lead to thumps. That's the kind of question to take to people's PMs if they're willing. Similarly, while we encourage friendliness and familiarity with other users, posts should always have some kind of thread-relevant purpose; for instance, if you want to wish someone a happy birthday, feel free to, but if it's the only thing in the post, it's off-topic and needs something else alongside it. Again, though, while we strive for a friendly atmosphere, this is not Facebook; life updates are fun, but unless they have some kind of impact on your thread participation, please do not bring it here - we have Yack Fest for that.

  8. Please refrain from asking anything along the lines of "How Did We Miss This One?" In almost every case, the answer is simply "No one thought about it before". This Is a Wiki where everyone has different interests, and the fact that people missed a particular candidate, even one that seems like a textbook example of a trope or a character who is particularly iconic in pop culture, means absolutely nothing. The question is disruptive, has a simple and consistent answer, and provides nothing to any discussion.

  9. If you are suspended from parts of the website, it is still possible to participate!
    1. For users who are suspended from editing the wiki, you still have full access to this thread. You can propose candidates and write them up with no issues whatsoever; while you will have to ask someone else to post the entry to the relevant pages once it is done, all write-ups are considered thread-approved - as in, done by consensus - and thus doing so does not violate any rules regarding meatpuppeting.
    2. If you are suspended from the forums, your participation is limited but not impossible. It is still possible for a forum-suspended user to assist in creating the write-up for a character who has already been approved; as previously mentioned, write-ups are inherently considered a consensus-based edit and thus not tied to any one particular user. However, you can not assist in the proposal of a character; as a proposal is based around the forum rather than the wiki, doing so with a forum suspension qualifies as meatpuppeting.

  10. Please keep all discussions "in-house".
    1. What other wikis use for CM equivalents is irrelevant here.
    2. Please be wary of using other wikis, Fandom or otherwise, as sources of information. They are just as fallible as a site like Wikipedia in regards to accuracy because they can be edited by any user, just as this site can.
    3. Do not attempt to force a communication with an author in an attempt to gather evidence or settle a debate; besides the fact that this is a YMMV trope and thus author intent has variable weight depending on the circumstance, doing so may cross the line into drama exportation, which is prohibited site-wide.

If you would like to use an EP for your candidate, here's the general format. This format does not have to be followed exactly, but these are the main topics that need to be covered:

    Effortpost Template 

What is the work?

This is a brief summary of the work you're going to discuss. We don't need a full plot summary here, just however much we need to understand going into the discussion — it can even be as simple as quoting the summary on the work's page.

Who is the candidate and what have they done?

This is essentially the character's biography — who they are, their story, the crimes they commit, and, preferably (though not required), what happens to the candidate at the end. It does not have to include every single thing they ever do — for some villains, we'd be here all day if that was the case — but it should include the highlights of their journey.

Any redeeming qualities? Freudian Excuse?

This is where any potential redeeming characteristics or tragic backstory should be discussed. Do they have a tragic past? Do they show that Even Evil Has Standards or Even Evil Has Loved Ones? Maybe a Pet the Dog moment or two? This is where these should be discussed in full. Not every potential redeeming moment is a clear-cut disqualifier, but we should hear of any potential issues to ensure the character is discussed in full.

Are they bad enough?

A Complete Monster has to be particularly vile by the standard of the work they appear in. Therefore, you should look at what the character does compared to similar characters in the same work. This takes into account things like:

  • Their resource level (a human Serial Killer can't stand up to an alien Omnicidal Maniac, but they can be bad by the standard of other human serial killers)
  • The amount of time they have to work with (such as a one-shot character versus long-running antagonists)
  • The quantity vs. quality of their crimes compared to others (someone with a lower victim count but far more visceral and personal crimes could be considered as equally bad overall as someone with a higher body count but less horror involved)

Essentially, this section is an analysis of the kinds of villainy shown in the work and an explanation of why this particular character's villainy stands out within it.

Final verdict?

This is where you post your final conclusion on the character in question. You can continue elaborating on your reasons or even just say a simple "yes" or "no"; at this point, we've heard everything we need to hear.


IMPORTANT NOTICE: This thread tackles very serious and dark matters on a daily basis. We will be discussing things like murder, rape, torture, human trafficking, crimes against children, and in particularly dark cases, several of these issues at the same time. We keep a lighthearted air, but all candidates carry the general assumption that these are awful individuals committing disgusting crimes. We ask that if you participate, you do so with the requisite seriousness such dark topics require; exclamations of how gross something is, whether serious or sarcastic, are disrespectful to the topics at hand, and if you cannot handle such topics, please do not participate.

And that's everything you need to know. Welcome to the thread!


Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 12th 2024 at 3:13:36 PM

MermaidEyes15 Since: Dec, 2021 Relationship Status: He makes me feel like I have a heart
#33352: Dec 25th 2023 at 12:20:06 PM

Merry Christmas everyone! Got three candidates from a movie right now to propose!

What’s The Work?

Changeling is an American drama film directed by the famous Clint Eastwood based on The Wineville Chicken Coop Murders but centers on the controversy of the mother of one of the victims.

Set in 1928, mother Christine Collins loses her son Walter and lobby’s for her to be found. The Los Angeles Police Department “finds” the boy and reunites her with her son but she quickly discovers that the boy is not her son. However, the police gaslight, victimizes and eventually throws the women in the psyche ward to cover up their corruption, meanwhile a police detective slowly unravels a series of children’s disappearances connected to Walter. Oh yeah btw, all of this is based on real events, so that’s wonderful.

Now the Big Bad himself, Captain J. J. Jones doesn’t count himself for reason I’ll get into later, and while I think the Serial Killer, Gordon Northcott counts, he has some issues that may be contentious. For now though, I’ll focus on two other very strong keepers. Starting with this one!

Who is Chief James E. Davis? What Does He Do?

  • The chief of the LAPD, James E. Davis is responsible for the entire corruption of the police department, described by Reverend Gustav Briegleb as “the most violent, corrupt and incompetent police department this side of the rocky mountains” who’s actions enables crime within the city, including enablement of the serial killer Gordon Northcott.
  • Creating a large criminal racket of gambling and prostitution that even Mayor Cryer is in on, Davis founded The Gun Squad, publicly to take care of criminals to clean the streets, but in reality to do away with competition. Getting 20 of the most violent cops and giving them clearance to shoot and kill anyone, Davis is responsible for deaths of multiple people without any arrests or trials, with their bodies being dumped on the side of the road, leaving piles of bodies in the way.
  • And whenever a woman challenges police authority? Those women are labeled as crazy and Gaslight, before being thrown into a psychopath ward where they are drugged and abused into submission in order to protect the image of the police. One of these being Christie, who lobbies a campaign against The LAPD due to them not finding her missing son and trying to replace him. Captain Jones, who gets orders by Davis to stop Christie from exposing the corruption, ends up throwing Christie into the ward after labeling her as a hysterical woman detached from reality.
  • However, Davis’ plan falls apart once Reverend Briegleb starts doing an entire campaign to save Christie and Police detective Ybarra finds and manages to get Northcott arrested, while finding the real identity of the imposter Walter, who Davis as to (begrudgingly) give the boy back to his real mother. The plan completely crumbles as Christie and the other women are let out of the mental ward and Christie sues the Police Department for their corruption, to which Davis attempts to throw Jones under the bus to try and save himself.
  • In the end, Northcott is hanged for his crimes and the police scandal is exposed, and Davis is force into demotion from his role, and he leaves the courtroom in a huff.

Mitigating Factors?

Nope. Just a greedy corrupt cop who only cares about himself.

Heinous Standard?

Captain Jones, despite being the main threat against Christie, is simply acting under the orders and is simply another corrupt cop in a large city of them, and besides him The Mayor, Cryer is barely seen and has little to do with the corruption. Captain Davis, meanwhile is responsible for the entire corruption of the police department, where people are murdered on the streets without trials to simply open up opportunities to crime for themselves (and flashbacks show these murders happen onscreen) and have women thrown in psyche wards to be abused and made insane through. Overall, a nasty piece of work who is in part responsible for much of the story.

Verdict?

Yes

Ravok Son of Liberty from Big Shell Since: Jun, 2015 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Son of Liberty
#33353: Dec 25th 2023 at 12:27:56 PM

Yes to Davis and Hector—"exploitation movie" has far more history and meaning to it than anything remotely close to movies like Serbian Film so I really don't see the point in bringing it up.

Merry Christmas, all!

No! That is NOT Solid Snake! Stop impersonating him!
EmperorGeode from A Galaxy far, far away Since: Oct, 2022 Relationship Status: On the prowl
Agentofchaos A God Am I from Somewhere in the Universe Since: Dec, 2021
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#33357: Dec 25th 2023 at 1:02:23 PM

[tup]chief Davis

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
MermaidEyes15 Since: Dec, 2021 Relationship Status: He makes me feel like I have a heart
#33358: Dec 25th 2023 at 1:17:19 PM

And the next guy and the other easy qualifier

Who is Dr. Jonathan Steele? What Does He Do?

  • A Composite Character of all the corrupt doctors that the real Christine Collins had to deal with, Dr. Steele runs the psychopath ward that the women who are placed there by code 12 (aka when the Police place them there to keep them quiet), where he pretty much runs the Ward like a gross and demoralizing prison, and has these women gaslight to made out to be insane, drugged by pills they don’t need and will eventually result in elector therapy and electrocute them, eventually driving some to mentally break.
  • When Christine is placed in the psychopath ward by Jones, Dr. Steele is quick to gaslight, twisting her reality in order to try and drive her into losing her mind before ordering her, like the other many women inside the ward, to be drugged with medicine. When Christine begs herself to be released, Dr. Steele agrees on one condition, signing a waiver which would claim the child is in fact Walter and that the police were correct the entire time. When Christine refuses, he simply sends her back to drugging, showing little more than glee doing so. When Carol Dexter, a Hooker with a Heart of Gold that was also placed there by police try and defend her, she is sent to be electrocuted.
  • When Christine has enough and calls out Dr. Steele for what he did, the smug doctor orders Christine to be put into “electrotherapy” to cure her. Luckily, Reverand Briegleb comes in and manages to get an warrant to take out Christine from the hospital. Dr. Steele attempts to convince Christine one final time to sign the waiver, but when she ultimately refuses, he is force to cave and, visibly frustrated, let’s her go. Despite eventually forcing to free all the women placed in the ward by the cops, the doctor received no punishment for his actions.

Mitigating Factors?

Hah. No.

Heinous Standard?

He runs the psychopath ward and is personally responsible for gaslighting, drugging, abusing and even electrocuting the women placed in there, sometimes driving them into losing their mind in which Christie was almost their next victim in.

Verdict?

Yes

Edited by MermaidEyes15 on Dec 25th 2023 at 4:17:36 AM

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#33359: Dec 25th 2023 at 1:18:09 PM

[tup]steele

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
EmperorGeode from A Galaxy far, far away Since: Oct, 2022 Relationship Status: On the prowl
Agentofchaos A God Am I from Somewhere in the Universe Since: Dec, 2021
Ravok Son of Liberty from Big Shell Since: Jun, 2015 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Son of Liberty
#33362: Dec 25th 2023 at 1:20:49 PM

Yes to Steele!

No! That is NOT Solid Snake! Stop impersonating him!
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
EmeraldEmperor Lies and Violence! Since: Oct, 2020
Lies and Violence!
#33365: Dec 25th 2023 at 1:33:48 PM

Happy holidays, everyone! Yes to the Halloween quartet, Cook, the spirits, Yuri and Slick, Hector, Davis, and Steele.

I remember lodging a cut for the Halloween vote, but I admit I was likely adhering to the arbitrary limit. I'm fine with loosening the rule.

WetFlannels Classy, Refined, Unstable from Nearby, on a cosmological scale. Since: Oct, 2021 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Classy, Refined, Unstable
#33366: Dec 25th 2023 at 1:41:05 PM

[tup] Changeling pair.

Any feedback on my vid suggestion?

What's wrong D-16? Rise up!
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#33367: Dec 25th 2023 at 1:49:51 PM

[tup]vid suggestion

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
ASghhrv6ub Best Smile from Second star to the right. Since: Jun, 2020 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Best Smile
#33368: Dec 25th 2023 at 1:52:16 PM

[tup]King, Mercer, Maximus, Belos, Umaril, Grimm, Asset Joy, Circus Baby, Franco, Carnage, Hyacinth, Jael, Cook, Ancient Spirits, Davis, Steele, Yuri and Slick, child-torturer couples.

Out There (link): Judge Claude Frollo, cruel as the original, may be among the least powerful villains trapped in the Isle of the Lost but possibly is also the most evil. psychologically abusing his son Frank for years, Frollo sends him to Auradon with orders to steal Merlin's Staff in hopes of using its magic to not only wipe out the gypsies, but also to destroy most of Auradon. Frollo it's also revealed to have once violently escaped the Isle and then trying to use a curse to Quasimodo's young son Matt by burning in front of the former and send Matt's soul to Tartarus.

Happy holidays everybody.

I am the one, I am the one, the godlike terror train, superior artificial brain, feel free to call me Blaine
EmperorGeode from A Galaxy far, far away Since: Oct, 2022 Relationship Status: On the prowl
OctoSquid12 Since: Nov, 2022
#33370: Dec 25th 2023 at 2:30:30 PM

Edited by OctoSquid12 on Dec 25th 2023 at 3:10:23 AM

WetFlannels Classy, Refined, Unstable from Nearby, on a cosmological scale. Since: Oct, 2021 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Classy, Refined, Unstable
#33371: Dec 25th 2023 at 2:32:31 PM

[up] Turbo's been voted down multiple times unfortunately.

Edited by WetFlannels on Dec 25th 2023 at 10:32:53 AM

What's wrong D-16? Rise up!
ForgoLight The Ultimate Lifeform Since: Oct, 2022 Relationship Status: In Lesbians with you
The Ultimate Lifeform
#33372: Dec 25th 2023 at 2:33:22 PM

[up][up]Turbo is on the reserved items list and cannot be effort posted.

"Us weirdos have to stick together!"
Agentofchaos A God Am I from Somewhere in the Universe Since: Dec, 2021
#33373: Dec 25th 2023 at 2:34:46 PM

No, no, no to Turbo, we've been over him a million times, he's on the Resolved Items list as "Definitely not a Complete Monster", he's not bad enough and anything that would push him over is Fridge Horror and him being on the list means stop talking about him

"We'll meet again" | 🏳️‍⚧️
EmperorGeode from A Galaxy far, far away Since: Oct, 2022 Relationship Status: On the prowl
YorkobeShounen Since: Dec, 2022
#33375: Dec 25th 2023 at 2:41:02 PM

Isn’t he in the NA list? If so get rid of the EP, it isn’t allowed on here if i remember correctly


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