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Complete Monster Proposal Thread

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Old Complete Monster cleanup thread

Welcome to the Complete Monster proposal thread! This is the thread where new Complete Monster examples are vetted, approved, and written up. If you're looking for the general cleanup thread (for cuts, rewrites, expansions, and the like), please go here

Important: Before suggesting any new examples, please read the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List; if you have any questions, the odds are high they are answered there. Additionally, please check here for the earliest date a work can be discussed (usually two weeks from the U.S. release date) and whether the work has already been reserved by another user.

Here is how the process works:

    Process 

  1. If you have a candidate to propose, you can simply come right in and propose them! If the character's run is brief, such as a single issue of a comic book, then a simple summary of their actions and any potential redeeming qualities will be enough; for longer-running candidates, an effortpost (EP) might be helpful for organizing the proposal. An EP is not outright required, but please be mindful that if a post becomes too clunky and unorganized, it can be very hard for other people to follow.

  2. After the proposal, there will be a 72-hour discussion and voting period, where people may ask questions and vote on the candidate. The number of upvotes must outnumber the downvotes by at least five for the character to be considered "approved".

  3. Three days after the proposal has been made, if the character has been approved, you may post the writeup (the text to be posted on the trope page itself) on the thread and send it to the drafts page. Your candidate will soon be added to the CM subpage. If the work has a page, you should add your candidate to the relevant YMMV page. Voila! It's that simple!

Outside of this process, we do have a few ground rules:

    Ground Rules 

  1. To keep the thread moving at a reasonable pace, there are some restrictions on when a proposal can be made. There should only be a maximum of four EPs posted both per page and per hour to ensure that nothing gets lost in the shuffle; additionally, each individual troper should only be proposing or writing up characters from a maximum of three works at a time (from initial proposals to end of their voting period). If your proposal would fall outside of either of these guidelines, we'd like to ask you to please wait until they would fit within; feel free to type them up on an outside document, and then when the time comes, you can just copy, paste, and post!

  2. No plagiarism of any kind. This is a very serious matter site-wide, as the website could get in actual legal trouble over this; as a result, this can very quickly lead to mod intervention. This can take many different forms:
    1. Direct plagiarism, i.e. wholesale copying. This is not only the easiest to find, but is also the most likely to warrant quick moderator intervention. To be clear, quoting in some places is perfectly acceptable, but it has to be very clear you're quoting from something else and it cannot be anything longer than a sentence or two - if you're quoting an entire work summary from Wikipedia, no one is going to believe you've actually consumed the work, so even if you cite your source, your candidate will be downvoted anyway.
    2. Self-plagiarism. Even if you can prove that you wrote the same text in both places, the site itself can't contain any of the duplicated text. If you already wrote something once before, it's not too hard to write it a second time.
    3. Using another site's work as a template for a proposal. Just because you don't copy and paste something directly doesn't mean it's any harder to detect if you're basing parts or all of your proposal on text someone else wrote. To be clear, this doesn't violate site rules and won't lead to mod intervention, but just like if you directly plagiarize, no one will believe you've consumed the work if you're clearly basing your proposal on something else. This thread largely operates on the honor system, and tweaking someone else's work to pass it off as your own is one of the fastest ways to lose trust.

  3. Don't delete an EP unless you intend to swiftly repost it. We know that there are reasons why you might want to delete an EP, especially if it's being downvoted - rejection is hard, even in a low-stakes environment like this. However, deleting it renders the current discussion null and void, makes it impossible to reference the discussion in the future and can confuse tropers who didn't read it before the deletion. If the issue is temporary (such as formatting problems or a post getting overlooked as the thread moves on), then deleting and quickly reposting the EP is a valid option, but to fully retract an EP, please use the [[strike:]] markup instead.

  4. Votes must be for specific candidates, meaning no blanket voting (i.e. "yes to everyone I missed").

  5. If you are the first person to downvote a candidate, please provide an explanation of why when you do so. We're here for discussions above all, and a hit-and-run downvote doesn't facilitate anything.

  6. 'If a work is already reserved by another user , please don't comment on the work or any potential characters worth discussion before the discussion date. We know how exciting it is when a work has a keeper that you're waiting to talk about, but it's not fair to the person who reserved the work who is just as excited to lead the discussion to see the discussion getting spoiled before they get to do it. On the other hand, if the reservation only has one name attached, shoot them a PM - they may be down for a collaboration, which will get you in on the fun as well!

  7. Please keep the thread on-topic. While discussing the trope is fun and we encourage people to enjoy it, questions like "who's your favorite CM" are off-topic and can lead to thumps. That's the kind of question to take to people's PMs if they're willing. Similarly, while we encourage friendliness and familiarity with other users, posts should always have some kind of thread-relevant purpose; for instance, if you want to wish someone a happy birthday, feel free to, but if it's the only thing in the post, it's off-topic and needs something else alongside it. Again, though, while we strive for a friendly atmosphere, this is not Facebook; life updates are fun, but unless they have some kind of impact on your thread participation, please do not bring it here - we have Yack Fest for that.

  8. Please refrain from asking anything along the lines of "How Did We Miss This One?" In almost every case, the answer is simply "No one thought about it before". This Is a Wiki where everyone has different interests, and the fact that people missed a particular candidate, even one that seems like a textbook example of a trope or a character who is particularly iconic in pop culture, means absolutely nothing. The question is disruptive, has a simple and consistent answer, and provides nothing to any discussion.

  9. If you are suspended from parts of the website, it is still possible to participate!
    1. For users who are suspended from editing the wiki, you still have full access to this thread. You can propose candidates and write them up with no issues whatsoever; while you will have to ask someone else to post the entry to the relevant pages once it is done, all write-ups are considered thread-approved - as in, done by consensus - and thus doing so does not violate any rules regarding meatpuppeting.
    2. If you are suspended from the forums, your participation is limited but not impossible. It is still possible for a forum-suspended user to assist in creating the write-up for a character who has already been approved; as previously mentioned, write-ups are inherently considered a consensus-based edit and thus not tied to any one particular user. However, you can not assist in the proposal of a character; as a proposal is based around the forum rather than the wiki, doing so with a forum suspension qualifies as meatpuppeting.

  10. Please keep all discussions "in-house".
    1. What other wikis use for CM equivalents is irrelevant here.
    2. Please be wary of using other wikis, Fandom or otherwise, as sources of information. They are just as fallible as a site like Wikipedia in regards to accuracy because they can be edited by any user, just as this site can.
    3. Do not attempt to force a communication with an author in an attempt to gather evidence or settle a debate; besides the fact that this is a YMMV trope and thus author intent has variable weight depending on the circumstance, doing so may cross the line into drama exportation, which is prohibited site-wide.

If you would like to use an EP for your candidate, here's the general format. This format does not have to be followed exactly, but these are the main topics that need to be covered:

    Effortpost Template 

What is the work?

This is a brief summary of the work you're going to discuss. We don't need a full plot summary here, just however much we need to understand going into the discussion — it can even be as simple as quoting the summary on the work's page.

Who is the candidate and what have they done?

This is essentially the character's biography — who they are, their story, the crimes they commit, and, preferably (though not required), what happens to the candidate at the end. It does not have to include every single thing they ever do — for some villains, we'd be here all day if that was the case — but it should include the highlights of their journey.

Any redeeming qualities? Freudian Excuse?

This is where any potential redeeming characteristics or tragic backstory should be discussed. Do they have a tragic past? Do they show that Even Evil Has Standards or Even Evil Has Loved Ones? Maybe a Pet the Dog moment or two? This is where these should be discussed in full. Not every potential redeeming moment is a clear-cut disqualifier, but we should hear of any potential issues to ensure the character is discussed in full.

Are they bad enough?

A Complete Monster has to be particularly vile by the standard of the work they appear in. Therefore, you should look at what the character does compared to similar characters in the same work. This takes into account things like:

  • Their resource level (a human Serial Killer can't stand up to an alien Omnicidal Maniac, but they can be bad by the standard of other human serial killers)
  • The amount of time they have to work with (such as a one-shot character versus long-running antagonists)
  • The quantity vs. quality of their crimes compared to others (someone with a lower victim count but far more visceral and personal crimes could be considered as equally bad overall as someone with a higher body count but less horror involved)

Essentially, this section is an analysis of the kinds of villainy shown in the work and an explanation of why this particular character's villainy stands out within it.

Final verdict?

This is where you post your final conclusion on the character in question. You can continue elaborating on your reasons or even just say a simple "yes" or "no"; at this point, we've heard everything we need to hear.


IMPORTANT NOTICE: This thread tackles very serious and dark matters on a daily basis. We will be discussing things like murder, rape, torture, human trafficking, crimes against children, and in particularly dark cases, several of these issues at the same time. We keep a lighthearted air, but all candidates carry the general assumption that these are awful individuals committing disgusting crimes. We ask that if you participate, you do so with the requisite seriousness such dark topics require; exclamations of how gross something is, whether serious or sarcastic, are disrespectful to the topics at hand, and if you cannot handle such topics, please do not participate.

And that's everything you need to know. Welcome to the thread!


Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 12th 2024 at 3:13:36 PM

MemeMaster245 The Metal Reaper from Cornfield Since: Apr, 2022 Relationship Status: This is not my beautiful wife!
The Metal Reaper
#2726: Jan 29th 2023 at 2:50:28 AM

About Belos I doubt he'll be redeemed but I don't know if he can qualify as a CM, considering his deep down guilt for what he did.

Also [tup]Trunchbull.

Edited by MemeMaster245 on Jan 29th 2023 at 10:50:46 AM

Prepare for a bitter harvest...
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#2727: Jan 29th 2023 at 2:58:45 AM

Btw for Phibious. Could the last line be tweaked. It's a bit odd. "All kidnapping one of Matt's friends and two street kids so he could genetically modified them into monstrous fish creatures like him and serve him as slaves forever."

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Snoketrope Barb / Temporary Kylo from California Since: Oct, 2020 Relationship Status: Waiting for Prince Charming
Barb / Temporary Kylo
#2728: Jan 29th 2023 at 2:59:17 AM

That's not mitigating so far for other reasons. If someone wants to talk about Belos and the specifics as to why, they can DM. Or go to the Owl House forum to discuss it.

Edited by Snoketrope on Jan 29th 2023 at 3:13:41 AM

Bow to the Prototype
STARCRUSHER99 The Moron from one of my unhealthy obsessions (Captain) Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The Moron
#2729: Jan 29th 2023 at 6:20:53 AM

I’ll handle getting Turbo back on the list in a little bit, cause I agree this is getting a bit out of hand

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#2730: Jan 29th 2023 at 6:36:40 AM

I know he’s been downvoted a bunch of times already, but what’s the difference between him and say… Steele from Balto, in terms of villainy, I mean?

Extreme. They weren't building tiny coffins to represent Turbo's would-be victims. There's a significant difference in the weight of the atrocity being depicted that's not just "endangering masses"—any Saturday morning cartoon villain will "endanger masses." A Complete Monster will go the extra mile and it'll be portrayed as such.

This reminds me of when people tried to argue for Hades from Hercules because he was "endangering masses" with the Cyclops. Or Oogie Boogie, where someone somehow extrapolated attempted genocide from a bog-standard "destroy Halloween Town" plot (in one of the video games). You gotta extract the Fridge Horror from these situations, because these situations may be alike on paper but they'll never be the same in execution, particularly in family-friendly media where it's much harder to push the envelope.

Edited by Scraggle on Jan 29th 2023 at 7:43:53 AM

Agentofchaos A God Am I from Somewhere in the Universe Since: Dec, 2021
#2731: Jan 29th 2023 at 6:37:09 AM

[tup] Trunchbull

And I say sure to putting Turbo on the resolved list, it's been 2 weeks since this thread opened and he's already come up a couple of times. And the difference between Turbo and Steele is that Turbo isn't shown to actively cause games to get shut down, only on accident and it just makes the residents homeless, while Steele actively sabotages an attempt to bring sick children life saving medicine. Turbo is a guy I want to count but I have to admit he just doesn't pass the bar.

"We'll meet again" | 🏳️‍⚧️
TotemGenitor Bye Since: Apr, 2021 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Bye
#2732: Jan 29th 2023 at 6:37:57 AM

[tup] Trunchbull

Also agree with putting Turbo on the RI

EmperorGeode from A Galaxy far, far away Since: Oct, 2022 Relationship Status: On the prowl
#2733: Jan 29th 2023 at 6:43:30 AM

Purring Turbo on resolved items seems best

Echidna from Ontario, Canada (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Two-timing
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#2735: Jan 29th 2023 at 7:26:20 AM

I'm fine with re-adding Turbo to the resolved items list.

[down]Uh PM me ill tell you the reason why?

Edited by miraculous on Jan 29th 2023 at 7:46:11 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
DoodSlayer136 It's Him from SAGE (Snick Amateur Game Expo) (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
It's Him
#2736: Jan 29th 2023 at 7:33:20 AM

Slap Turbo back on the Resolved list. Strange how people are only now trying to vouch for the guy, when we first took him off nobody raised a fuss fro quite a while.

WatTambor Since: Oct, 2020
#2737: Jan 29th 2023 at 7:41:58 AM

[tup] to Truchbull

Write-up for Maegor:

  • King Maegor I Targaryen, aka "Maegor the Cruel", is one of the most brutal rulers to ever sit on the Iron Throne. Usurping his own nephew and then killing him in battle, Maegor would go on to usher in a reign of callous tyranny. His many atrocities include executing anyone who expresses an opinion he doesn't like, burning down a Sept with many people inside, starting a campaign across the Riverlands, the Westerlands, and the Reach which claims the lives of thousands of innocent people for him to collect their skulls and pass off as members of the Faith Militant, forcibly marrying three women who had been widowed because of the wars he had waged, executing his second wife and every single member of her family when she gives birth to a deformed and stillborn baby, slaughtering all the builders who had constructed the Red Keep to keep its secret passages for himself and, allegedly, having a hidden dungeon to brutally torture prisoners. Maegor's actions ravage the realm so badly, that his cruelty would be remembered even hundreds of years after his death.

Edited by WatTambor on Jan 29th 2023 at 6:47:36 PM

WetFlannels Classy, Refined, Unstable from Nearby, on a cosmological scale. Since: Oct, 2021 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Classy, Refined, Unstable
#2738: Jan 29th 2023 at 7:47:13 AM

[tup] Trunchbull

Maybe I'm just being blind but where is the new resolved items list?

What's wrong D-16? Rise up!
ForgoLight The Ultimate Lifeform Since: Oct, 2022 Relationship Status: In Lesbians with you
The Ultimate Lifeform
#2739: Jan 29th 2023 at 7:51:08 AM

I think it's probably in some sort of sandbox. Out of curiosity, would anyone be willing to link that for us please and thank you?

"Us weirdos have to stick together!"
STARCRUSHER99 The Moron from one of my unhealthy obsessions (Captain) Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The Moron
#2740: Jan 29th 2023 at 7:53:13 AM

Click on the link to “Frequently Asked Questions” in the OP and it’s at the bottom of the page

EmperorGeode from A Galaxy far, far away Since: Oct, 2022 Relationship Status: On the prowl
#2741: Jan 29th 2023 at 7:54:15 AM

Edit: What STAR has said

Edited by EmperorGeode on Jan 29th 2023 at 7:56:12 AM

Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Enid Sinclair
#2742: Jan 29th 2023 at 8:11:12 AM

Yeah I'm good with putting Turbo on the resolved items list.

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#2743: Jan 29th 2023 at 8:14:30 AM

Okay, with no objections to either:

  • Willow (2022): The Crone, once known as Lili, is the chief servant of the Wyrm and the corrupter of Queen Bavmorda. Having kidnapped and brainwashed Bavmorda, the Crone was responsible for all the bloodshed and strife committed to kill baby Elora Danan. Surfacing as the true threat to the land, the Crone has the heroic guardsman Ballantine possessed to kill those near to him along with trying to kill Ballantine's adopted daughter Jade. Luring the heroes into aiding her with a disguise, the Crone then reveals herself with true plan: to summon the Wyrm and ravage the land with the deaths of every human being.
  • Hunters: Eva Braun, the "Colonel" of the Fourth Reich is the architect of Nazi plans in the Americas. Building a network of political influence and corruption, Eva has countless innocents murdered by her agents. Testing out deadly chemicals on children and other test subjects, Eva's plot is to place the virus in corn syrup to wipe out minorities in the US, kill millions and plunge the country into Chaos so the Nazis can take over and institute a new Holocaust. Disdaining her husband Adolf Hitler as nothing but a failure, Eva then tries to have him murdered so she can rule unchallenged.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#2744: Jan 29th 2023 at 8:18:54 AM

Scraggle, you wanna do Myndahl so that Sandbox can be swapped?

Also, he goes at the end of the Online tree?

G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
The 47th President
#2745: Jan 29th 2023 at 8:29:17 AM

Agree to put Turbo in resolve items

Okay I got a few candidates to discuss, two them being from the same work Black★★Rock Shooter: Dawn Fall so let's talk about it.

What’s The Work?

Black Rock Shooter Downfall is an anime series based on the Black★Rock Shooter franchise. The premise is that an automated workforce AI named Artemis decided to rebel against humanity and laid waste to the Earth while the main character Empress, aka Black Rock Shooter joins The Resistance fighting Artemis’s forces to save humanity. However there’s more to Artemis than it seems and the real mastermind behind Artemis and everything else bad is this gal, Lunatic aka Artemis mind aka my first candidate.

Who Is She? What Has She Done?

Lunatic was an Avatar created by scientist Luna Griffith to serve as Artemis’s mind, with Lunatic’s purpose being to find planets and terraform them for humans should Earth no longer be inhabitable for humans. However Lunatic was lazy to find different planets and curious on why humans humans can’t evolve decides to force humanity to evolve for her by causing their extinction sending her robot army stationed in the moon through the Orbital Elevator to exterminate them, with plans to restart her extinction on the newly evolved humans just because she can.

This led to a global war lasting 2 decades (20 years) between humanity and her forces, resulting in massive loss of human lives (around billions of casualties or more) and Earth becoming a global wasteland (air has become toxic for one), while Lunatic having personally slaughtered almost every single Hemiteos Units, robot girls made to protect humanity.

Lunatic also encouraged the cult leader and weird human/robot hybrid Smiley to find adolescent girls around the world to rape and impregnate and if Smiley found a suitable mate Lunatic would transform that girl into a Hemiteos Unit against her will where Smiley would then impregnate her to create what Lunatic deems an “evolved human”; Charolette was one of their victims where Lunatic transformed her into a Hemiteos Unit after she has been brainwashed by Smiley.

Upon learning that Empress, whom Lunatic thought to have killed, is still alive and his helping the human resistance, Lunatic sends her forces and the Educational Institution led by Smiley to her location for them to kill her, her allies, and everyone else at her location that is not part of Lunatic’s forces.

Luckily Empress and Co. are able to survive Lunatic’s forces and go to the Orbital Elevator to destroy it to prevent anymore of Lunatic’s forces from invading Earth. However Lunatic decides to blowup the moon where the debris would crash on the Earth decimating it in her plan to cause humans to go extinct.

The moon debris would decimate earth and kill billions of lives throughout the globe while Lunatic takes sadistic joy killing Empress friends with her personally killing Dead Master and Strength while her forces kills off Colonel David. However watching her friends die causes Empress to activate her full power and kill off Lunatic and her forces, while stoping Lunatic’s secondary bombardment, destroying the Orbital Elevator and preventing anymore casualties, though at the cost of Empress own life.

Though of course Empress only killed off Lunatic’s current avatar as her mind inside Artemis is still alive, while Lunatic still satisfied that she has successfully wiped out 70 percent of all human life on Earth and plans to finish the rest off 200 years later when she fully regains her strength. Luckily the remaining humans would plan to prepare themselves should Lunatic return with Empress having been brought back from the dead to help the new generation of humanity.

Freudian Excuse? Redeeming Qualities?

Lunatic was created as Artemis's mind whose mission was to find planets and terraform planets for humans should Earth become uninhabitable. She was never made to cause humans to go extinct and force them to evolve; she made that decision entirely on her own and her reason why?

She didn’t feeling like searching throughout the universe to find planets and was curious to see what it was like to cause human’s extinction and see them evolved and after watching humans evolve a few million years she’ll just repeat the annihilate humanity process out of her own amusement.

So yeah Lunatic’s reasons for what she does is entirely selfish and to suffice her God Complex showing no remorse in committing her atrocities while possessing no well intentions and cares for no one but herself, her goals, and amusement.

Heinousness

As the Big Bad of Dawnfall, Lunatic sets the heinous standard with about everything bad occurring being traced back to her, with her rap sheet including causing a global war with humanity killing countless and turning Earth into a toxic wasteland, taking sadistic joy personally slaughtering her enemies, enable the goals of a monstrous Serial Rapist who I plan to EP later, converting adolescent girls into pseudo-Hemiteos Unit, successfully using the moons debris to wipe out 70 percent of all humans with plans to return 200 years later to finish her work, all while taking sadistic pleasure in the atrocities she has committed, she definitely stands out. Given that Dawnfall takes place in it's own continuity, it doesn't have to be compared with other works of the franchise makes Lunatic stand out all the more.

Final Verdict

I will leave it to you guys to decide

Edited by G-Editor on Jan 29th 2023 at 11:40:14 AM

My sandbox of EPs and other stuff
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
Agentofchaos A God Am I from Somewhere in the Universe Since: Dec, 2021
futuremoviewriter Since: Jun, 2014
#2748: Jan 29th 2023 at 9:09:35 AM

I'm for Turbo being back on the list too. Can't help that he'll keep being brought up if we don't.

EmperorGeode from A Galaxy far, far away Since: Oct, 2022 Relationship Status: On the prowl
therealjackieboy from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
#2750: Jan 29th 2023 at 10:10:01 AM

[tup]The Loon

  • Adolf Hitler himself, after faking his death with Eva Braun, resides in Argentina to plot out his plans of world domination. With visions of turning the world into the Fourth Reich, Hitler hopes to drop a nuke on a populated city in order to start a war and hopefully come out on top. Hitler allows Eva to enact her plan to unleash a virus that would wipe out all of America’s minorities, while having Hunters member Joe Mizushima tortuously brainwashed into becoming one of his agents. Behind one of the worst genocides in recent history, with the horrors of his concentration camps still haunting its survivors, age is shown to have not slowed Hitler’s childish wickedness down one bit.

I know I'm a day early, but considering it's Hitler, and he was unanimously voted as a keeper, I figured I'd just post his writeup and complete the Hunters tree, even if Travis might need a minor expansion.

Edited by therealjackieboy on Jan 29th 2023 at 10:15:36 AM

It's Spooky Month!

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