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Complete Monster Proposal Thread

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Old Complete Monster cleanup thread

Welcome to the Complete Monster proposal thread! This is the thread where new Complete Monster examples are vetted, approved, and written up. If you're looking for the general cleanup thread (for cuts, rewrites, expansions, and the like), please go here

Important: Before suggesting any new examples, please read the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List; if you have any questions, the odds are high they are answered there. Additionally, please check here for the earliest date a work can be discussed (usually two weeks from the U.S. release date) and whether the work has already been reserved by another user.

Here is how the process works:

    Process 

  1. If you have a candidate to propose, you can simply come right in and propose them! If the character's run is brief, such as a single issue of a comic book, then a simple summary of their actions and any potential redeeming qualities will be enough; for longer-running candidates, an effortpost (EP) might be helpful for organizing the proposal. An EP is not outright required, but please be mindful that if a post becomes too clunky and unorganized, it can be very hard for other people to follow.

  2. After the proposal, there will be a 72-hour discussion and voting period, where people may ask questions and vote on the candidate. The number of upvotes must outnumber the downvotes by at least five for the character to be considered "approved".

  3. Three days after the proposal has been made, if the character has been approved, you may post the writeup (the text to be posted on the trope page itself) on the thread and send it to the drafts page. Your candidate will soon be added to the CM subpage. If the work has a page, you should add your candidate to the relevant YMMV page. Voila! It's that simple!

Outside of this process, we do have a few ground rules:

    Ground Rules 

  1. To keep the thread moving at a reasonable pace, there are some restrictions on when a proposal can be made. There should only be a maximum of four EPs posted both per page and per hour to ensure that nothing gets lost in the shuffle; additionally, each individual troper should only be proposing or writing up characters from a maximum of three works at a time (from initial proposals to end of their voting period). If your proposal would fall outside of either of these guidelines, we'd like to ask you to please wait until they would fit within; feel free to type them up on an outside document, and then when the time comes, you can just copy, paste, and post!

  2. No plagiarism of any kind. This is a very serious matter site-wide, as the website could get in actual legal trouble over this; as a result, this can very quickly lead to mod intervention. This can take many different forms:
    1. Direct plagiarism, i.e. wholesale copying. This is not only the easiest to find, but is also the most likely to warrant quick moderator intervention. To be clear, quoting in some places is perfectly acceptable, but it has to be very clear you're quoting from something else and it cannot be anything longer than a sentence or two - if you're quoting an entire work summary from Wikipedia, no one is going to believe you've actually consumed the work, so even if you cite your source, your candidate will be downvoted anyway.
    2. Self-plagiarism. Even if you can prove that you wrote the same text in both places, the site itself can't contain any of the duplicated text. If you already wrote something once before, it's not too hard to write it a second time.
    3. Using another site's work as a template for a proposal. Just because you don't copy and paste something directly doesn't mean it's any harder to detect if you're basing parts or all of your proposal on text someone else wrote. To be clear, this doesn't violate site rules and won't lead to mod intervention, but just like if you directly plagiarize, no one will believe you've consumed the work if you're clearly basing your proposal on something else. This thread largely operates on the honor system, and tweaking someone else's work to pass it off as your own is one of the fastest ways to lose trust.

  3. Don't delete an EP unless you intend to swiftly repost it. We know that there are reasons why you might want to delete an EP, especially if it's being downvoted - rejection is hard, even in a low-stakes environment like this. However, deleting it renders the current discussion null and void, makes it impossible to reference the discussion in the future and can confuse tropers who didn't read it before the deletion. If the issue is temporary (such as formatting problems or a post getting overlooked as the thread moves on), then deleting and quickly reposting the EP is a valid option, but to fully retract an EP, please use the [[strike:]] markup instead.

  4. Votes must be for specific candidates, meaning no blanket voting (i.e. "yes to everyone I missed").

  5. If you are the first person to downvote a candidate, please provide an explanation of why when you do so. We're here for discussions above all, and a hit-and-run downvote doesn't facilitate anything.

  6. 'If a work is already reserved by another user , please don't comment on the work or any potential characters worth discussion before the discussion date. We know how exciting it is when a work has a keeper that you're waiting to talk about, but it's not fair to the person who reserved the work who is just as excited to lead the discussion to see the discussion getting spoiled before they get to do it. On the other hand, if the reservation only has one name attached, shoot them a PM - they may be down for a collaboration, which will get you in on the fun as well!

  7. Please keep the thread on-topic. While discussing the trope is fun and we encourage people to enjoy it, questions like "who's your favorite CM" are off-topic and can lead to thumps. That's the kind of question to take to people's PMs if they're willing. Similarly, while we encourage friendliness and familiarity with other users, posts should always have some kind of thread-relevant purpose; for instance, if you want to wish someone a happy birthday, feel free to, but if it's the only thing in the post, it's off-topic and needs something else alongside it. Again, though, while we strive for a friendly atmosphere, this is not Facebook; life updates are fun, but unless they have some kind of impact on your thread participation, please do not bring it here - we have Yack Fest for that.

  8. Please refrain from asking anything along the lines of "How Did We Miss This One?" In almost every case, the answer is simply "No one thought about it before". This Is a Wiki where everyone has different interests, and the fact that people missed a particular candidate, even one that seems like a textbook example of a trope or a character who is particularly iconic in pop culture, means absolutely nothing. The question is disruptive, has a simple and consistent answer, and provides nothing to any discussion.

  9. If you are suspended from parts of the website, it is still possible to participate!
    1. For users who are suspended from editing the wiki, you still have full access to this thread. You can propose candidates and write them up with no issues whatsoever; while you will have to ask someone else to post the entry to the relevant pages once it is done, all write-ups are considered thread-approved - as in, done by consensus - and thus doing so does not violate any rules regarding meatpuppeting.
    2. If you are suspended from the forums, your participation is limited but not impossible. It is still possible for a forum-suspended user to assist in creating the write-up for a character who has already been approved; as previously mentioned, write-ups are inherently considered a consensus-based edit and thus not tied to any one particular user. However, you can not assist in the proposal of a character; as a proposal is based around the forum rather than the wiki, doing so with a forum suspension qualifies as meatpuppeting.

  10. Please keep all discussions "in-house".
    1. What other wikis use for CM equivalents is irrelevant here.
    2. Please be wary of using other wikis, Fandom or otherwise, as sources of information. They are just as fallible as a site like Wikipedia in regards to accuracy because they can be edited by any user, just as this site can.
    3. Do not attempt to force a communication with an author in an attempt to gather evidence or settle a debate; besides the fact that this is a YMMV trope and thus author intent has variable weight depending on the circumstance, doing so may cross the line into drama exportation, which is prohibited site-wide.

If you would like to use an EP for your candidate, here's the general format. This format does not have to be followed exactly, but these are the main topics that need to be covered:

    Effortpost Template 

What is the work?

This is a brief summary of the work you're going to discuss. We don't need a full plot summary here, just however much we need to understand going into the discussion — it can even be as simple as quoting the summary on the work's page.

Who is the candidate and what have they done?

This is essentially the character's biography — who they are, their story, the crimes they commit, and, preferably (though not required), what happens to the candidate at the end. It does not have to include every single thing they ever do — for some villains, we'd be here all day if that was the case — but it should include the highlights of their journey.

Any redeeming qualities? Freudian Excuse?

This is where any potential redeeming characteristics or tragic backstory should be discussed. Do they have a tragic past? Do they show that Even Evil Has Standards or Even Evil Has Loved Ones? Maybe a Pet the Dog moment or two? This is where these should be discussed in full. Not every potential redeeming moment is a clear-cut disqualifier, but we should hear of any potential issues to ensure the character is discussed in full.

Are they bad enough?

A Complete Monster has to be particularly vile by the standard of the work they appear in. Therefore, you should look at what the character does compared to similar characters in the same work. This takes into account things like:

  • Their resource level (a human Serial Killer can't stand up to an alien Omnicidal Maniac, but they can be bad by the standard of other human serial killers)
  • The amount of time they have to work with (such as a one-shot character versus long-running antagonists)
  • The quantity vs. quality of their crimes compared to others (someone with a lower victim count but far more visceral and personal crimes could be considered as equally bad overall as someone with a higher body count but less horror involved)

Essentially, this section is an analysis of the kinds of villainy shown in the work and an explanation of why this particular character's villainy stands out within it.

Final verdict?

This is where you post your final conclusion on the character in question. You can continue elaborating on your reasons or even just say a simple "yes" or "no"; at this point, we've heard everything we need to hear.


IMPORTANT NOTICE: This thread tackles very serious and dark matters on a daily basis. We will be discussing things like murder, rape, torture, human trafficking, crimes against children, and in particularly dark cases, several of these issues at the same time. We keep a lighthearted air, but all candidates carry the general assumption that these are awful individuals committing disgusting crimes. We ask that if you participate, you do so with the requisite seriousness such dark topics require; exclamations of how gross something is, whether serious or sarcastic, are disrespectful to the topics at hand, and if you cannot handle such topics, please do not participate.

And that's everything you need to know. Welcome to the thread!


Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 12th 2024 at 3:13:36 PM

TotemGenitor Bye Since: Apr, 2021 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
MermaidEyes15 Since: Dec, 2021 Relationship Status: He makes me feel like I have a heart
#25677: Sep 11th 2023 at 1:49:29 PM

Well, let's do this one, I'm not....too sure on this guy but stranger things have happened.

What's The Work?

Fragments of a Soul is a created by Looperreallyreallyrocks centering around the teenager Adam Hemmensway struggling with his mother's cancer diagnosis as he faces his past abuse. Today we'll talk about the disgusting monster who’s actions caused the down spiral in Adam's life.

Who is he? What does he do?

Adam's Father, Mr. Hemmensway, is the Big Bad of the story despite being dead when it begins. A controlling psychopath, Adam's Father sexually abused his son ever since he was 6, making him strip in front of him, making him fondle him, molesting him and even gravitating to raping his son in his childhood, while frequently brutally beating Adam, leading to Adam anticipating every day. When he wasn't sexually abusing his son, Mr. Hemmensway was shown to be a callous father, daring Adam to swim in the big pool, almost causing him to almost drown if it wasn't for Adam's mother. Despite Adam's Father eventually dying of a car crash before the start of the story, the frequent abuse over the years completely broke Adam physiologically, sending him down a destructive lifestyle of Hookers and Blow, where Adam still has memories and nightmares of his father's horrific actions, and faces an hallucination of his father

Redeeming Qualities?

Hah. No. He is seen frequently in a few flashbacks and he's A completely evil man who control his son and sexually abuses him. While he tried to get someone to save his son from drowning, it was purely to keep his "toy".

Heinous Standard?

Ignoring the Show Within a Show which has the Emperor Gringold, Adrianna de le Santos and Morliss andf the high resourced queen April, There is still the serial child killer Johnathan Moore, and the the murder happy serial murderer turned right hand in wanting to commit genocide, Ryan Rhodes, who is the biggest factor here. However, with his lack screen time, only appearing in a few flashback and an hallucination, Mr. Hemmensway is particularly depraved, sexually and physically abusing his own son for over 6 years before his death, with his actions having a clear story effect with completely breaking Adam and leading him to a destructive lifestyle.

And also, while exploitative, the style has a clear message and focuses on Adam’s journey.

Verdict?

Yes to Adam’s father.

Siegfried1337 Calabash. from The Eastern Luminant Since: Sep, 2018 Relationship Status: Will you go out with me to the End?
Calabash.
#25678: Sep 11th 2023 at 2:11:19 PM

...Alright, now that the dust has somewhat settled, I'm here to announce that I will be doing an entry for Samurai Vandalism. Initially, I intended that to be an Bookends to my involvement in this thread, since my first EP here was Harold from Ideology in Friction, and Samurai Vandalism being a sequel of sorts to it, but an interesting turn of events has caused me to continue my involvement with this thread even after I make this entry. I just wanted to a give a heads-up for everyone.

Eh, good enough.
NTG Since: Aug, 2014
#25679: Sep 11th 2023 at 2:14:15 PM

Unsure about Mr. Hemmensway. Just checked the other CM entries and the two other non-fictional humans have a body count in the double or triple digits. The only thing that makes me consider up voting him is that he abused his own son for years. But then we have Rhodes who’s also a rapist responsible for the gang-rape of a 14 year old, while still being a child himself.

So I'm going to Abstain for now.

AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#25680: Sep 11th 2023 at 2:18:48 PM

Yeah, the heinous standard seems too massive with some antagonists committing murders in the double and triple digits.

Will abstain for now.

Edited by AustinDR on Sep 11th 2023 at 2:26:40 AM

MermaidEyes15 Since: Dec, 2021 Relationship Status: He makes me feel like I have a heart
#25681: Sep 11th 2023 at 2:25:29 PM

[up][up] Considering the adverse affects Hemmensway has towards his own son is a pretty deplorable niche on its own, esp considering the years of him doing it

[down] all but the adventures of the sword which is an in-universe book

Edited by MermaidEyes15 on Sep 11th 2023 at 5:32:07 AM

AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#25682: Sep 11th 2023 at 2:27:16 PM

All these works are in the same universe? Like in a vacuum, you could make a case for the dad, but when you have so many other villains that go further in their cruelty, kind of iffy there.

Mmm... unsure of what to think there.

Edited by AustinDR on Sep 11th 2023 at 2:36:58 AM

Ravok Son of Liberty from Big Shell Since: Jun, 2015 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Son of Liberty
#25683: Sep 11th 2023 at 2:45:21 PM

  • The Adventures of Prince Achmed: The evil Magician, also known as the Sorcerer, is a lecherous, scheming manipulator who seeks to forcibly marry and bed Princess Dinarsade. After a failed attempt to fool the Caliph into giving the Magician Dinarsade as a prize, the Magician punishes him by having the Caliph's son Achmed flown to parts unknown by a magic horse. To further spite Achmed, the Magician kidnaps his love Pari Banu and sells her as a Sex Slave, before trapping Achmed underneath a boulder in the middle of a volcano to slowly die, mocking Achmed that he's going to take Dinarsade next. The Magician later fools Aladdin into traversing a dangerous pit to retrieve the magic lamp, and seals Aladdin in the pit to die when he fails. Even when Aladdin escapes with the lamp, the Magician steals it and kidnaps Dinarsade, framing Aladdin so he will be executed for it.

Edited by Ravok on Sep 11th 2023 at 3:33:16 AM

No! That is NOT Solid Snake! Stop impersonating him!
Tyk5919 Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin Since: Mar, 2011 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin
#25684: Sep 11th 2023 at 4:27:35 PM

I'm leaning for [tdown] with Mr. Hemmensway. If this wasn't a Shared Universe, I'd be more okay with him counting. But we already got up a teenager who committed gang-rape, multiple murders, and attempted mass extinction and a man who murdered dozens of children and his own family, amongst multiple other villains.

I write stories and shiz. You can read them here.
AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#25685: Sep 11th 2023 at 4:35:17 PM

Yeah, pretty much my issue there. If it was a standalone story that was not connected to a shared universe, I'd be more okay with. But ultimately there are too many villains in the universe like the aforementioned child murderer to compete with.

umaprasis Since: Jul, 2023
#25686: Sep 11th 2023 at 6:53:03 PM

[tup] Salacia

Edited by umaprasis on Sep 11th 2023 at 6:53:51 AM

TheGrayFox ....Phenomenal from A Lovecraftian fishing village Since: Sep, 2011
....Phenomenal
#25687: Sep 11th 2023 at 7:01:13 PM

Yeah, echoing what others have said, Hemmensway sounds like a terrible person, but the heinousness seems pretty high and he's not even the only rapist. Leaning [tdown].

There remains a foothold out of this mire — now climb.
Ravok Son of Liberty from Big Shell Since: Jun, 2015 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Son of Liberty
#25688: Sep 12th 2023 at 1:18:53 AM

Likewise have to lean No but good EP!

Ok, change of plans, Scrags is likely gonna handle the Mission Impossible baddie, so in the meantime? I've got another re-evaluation to head up. My first from this franchise, with new arguments to be made for a long-time near-miss who I think firmly lands now that all is taken into account...aw shit, here we go again.

What's the work?

Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas is one of the many entries in the popular Grand Theft Auto franchise, considered by many to be the best. It follows Carl "CJ" Johnson, a former member of the Grove Street Families gang who left his home of Los Santos years ago for brighter prospects across the country. Brought back to his hometown by the death of his mother, CJ finds himself in the middle of gang wars, personal betrayals, and all manner of epic criminal activity as he tries to bring Grove Street back into power.

Who is Frank Tenpenny? What has he done?

One of the greatest villains in video game history, performed by the ever-excellent Samuel L. Jackson, Officer Frank Tenpenny is CJ's Arch-Enemy and the ultimate Big Bad of the game.

  • For years, Tenpenny has headed up "C.R.A.S.H.", a specialized unit designed to patrol San Andreas and fight street-level crime and drug dealing. Of course, Tenpenny does anything but that—he uses his position of authority to dabble in all manner of criminal activity, lining his pockets as he plays all sides to his advantage. Tenpenny routinely pits the gangs of San Andreas against each other and instigates outright gang wars that leave many members of all sides slaughtered for both his own profit and amusement.
  • Tenpenny and his partner/lackey Pulaski are introduced in "The Introduction" short film, where they draft new C.R.A.S.H. member Hernandez into the fold. As a "test" that Tenpenny puts all his new recruits through, Tenpenny has Pulaski brutally beat fellow cop Pendelbury bloody, then forces a horrified Hernandez to execute Pendelbury as an "initiation". Pendelbury had planned to come forth with evidence of Tenpenny's corruption, so Tenpenny decided to silence him; Tenpenny indicates this kind of "initiation" is completely routine.
  • Now, though Tenpenny has long played all sides? He finally throws in primarily with the gang "the Ballas", setting out to make them the top dogs and rule San Andreas through them. Tenpenny uses C.R.A.S.H. to help begin to funnel crack cocaine to the Ballas that they start slinging throughout San Andreas, considered a special level of evil as it turns citizens and criminals alike into strung-out addicts that serve at the Ballas's whims. To further the Ballas' power, Tenpenny conspires to assassinate Grove Street's boss, Sweet, because he is vehemently against the dealing of cocaine and the Ballas' vicousness. Tenpenny has a drive-by carried out on the home of Sweet's mother in an attempt on his life, killing the elderly woman in the process.
  • Recognizing that Sweet's brother, CJ, will no doubt come to town in honor of his mother's death, Tenpenny swoops in and picks CJ up when he arrives, threatening to frame him for Pendelbury's death if CJ doesn't become his errand boy. Tenpenny throughout the first chunk of the game orchestrates more gang fighting between Grove Street and other gangs, whittling them down and even having the Ballas open fire at the funeral of CJ's mother in an attempt to kill more Grove Street members. Tenpenny also regularly sells out the Ballas' operations if it serves him, getting multiple Ballas killed by Grove Street.
  • Eventually, Tenpenny orchestrates a wholesale massacre of the Grove Street gang in an attempt to take them all out, and though Sweet and CJ survive, Sweet is thrown in prison. Tenpenny decides to use this to his advantage, tormenting CJ and forcing him to more dirty work lest Tenpenny get Sweet transferred to a cell block that is full of Ballas, threatening that Sweet will be raped and killed if CJ doesn't fall in line. Tenpenny uses CJ to, in no certain order:
    • Kill a witness to Tenpenny's villainy
    • Frame an attorney for drug use who is trying to investigate C.R.A.S.H.'s corruption
    • Murder a cop trying to inform a reporter about Tenpenny's rapsheet as well as the reporter receiving the intel
    • Assassinate a DEA agent with evidence on Tenpenny, as well as the FBI agent who is planning to use the evidence to expose him
  • In the midst of all this, Tenpenny sets up former Grove Street ally Big Smoke to be the new figurehead in San Andreas, using him and the Ballas to spread cocaine deeper and worse in the streets than ever, wiping out any minor gangs opposing them as countless people are turned into broken addicts. When CJ finally outlives his usefulness, Tenpenny murders C.R.A.S.H. officer Hernandez when he suspects Hernandez is planning to turn informant on him, and orders CJ to dig his grave while planning to have CJ killed. CJ survives and kills Pulaski instead, and swears to finish Tenpenny off.
  • Though Tenpenny is brought to trial for a litany of crimes including murder, drug dealing and rape, he gets away with them scot-free. His acquittal prompts riots across San Andreas by infuriated citizens tired of his tyranny, and Tenpenny decides to cut his losses, flee the city and let it tear itself apart in the riots. He heads over to Big Smoke's base and finds CJ, having just killed Smoke—Tenpenny praises CJ for killing Pulaski and Smoke for him so he won't have to, then sets off an explosion and fire that begins consuming the entire building in it, filled with Tenpenny's own Balla allies that he leaves to burn while he makes his escape.
  • Luckily, CJ and Sweet work together to escape the burning building, engage Tenpenny in a lengthy chase, and cause him to crash horribly off the side of a bridge. A fatally wounded Tenpenny sneers that he regrets nothing and was just "taking out the trash", before he succumbs to his injuries and dies, finally freeing San Andreas from his cruelty for good, and enabling Grove Street to usher in a more peaceful era of gang rule.

Mitigating features?

Bwahaha, no, absolutely not. Tenpenny is a smug, sadistic Dirty Cop who cares about his own power and profit above all else. He doesn't care about fellow cops or even his own partners Pulaski and Hernandez, he values CJ as nothing but a pawn, and while he dies delivering a Motive Rant, it contains nothing redeeming within it:

" Come on, assholes! I'll take you all! You're mine! Mine! I run this town!...You assholes never understood what I did! Fifty of me and this town would be OK! I took the trash out! I DID! And I'd do it all again!"

He tries to justify his actions as "taking trash out", but he also repeatedly emphasizes that he "owns" the city, and throughout the game he shows himself to not care a single shit about "protecting the city"...he just wants power over it.

Heinousness?

Ok, so Tenpenny has been brought up and shot down before because of the high, high standard of GTA, which is completely valid. But thing to note? It's been made clear in recent years by the developer, Rockstar Games, that the GTA games do not all share a continuity. Multiple times they have reiterated that there are 3 "universes" or "timelines" to the games:

  • 2D universe, which comprises the first game and the second game
  • 3D universe, which comprises the third game, Vice City, Liberty City Stories, and San Andreas
  • And then the HD universe, which comprises the fourth game, the fifth game, and Online

So, right off the bat? This lowers the standard Tenpenny is up against by...a lot. No Russian traffickers from 4, no Trevor torturing people in 5, nothing to worry about from the first or second games...and while the standard is still high between III, Vice City, and Liberty City? Tenpenny stands out. He's a beat cop, not a powerful businessman like current CM Donald Love, and with his limited resources he turns Los Santos from an overall peaceful territory into one marred by gang wars and mass drug use, and he personally gets CJ's mother killed; threatens to have his brother raped and murdered in prison; turns on and kills his own cop partners repeatedly, even forcing rookies to kill for him; forces CJ to carry out a bevy of assasssinations; burns down Smoke's hideout while it's full of Tenpenny's own gangster allies...Tenpenny is bad enough with everything taken into account.

And while, yes, CJ is very much a Villain Protagonist who does shady shit (like burying a foreman alive because he sexually harassed CJ's sister, or killing a seemingly innocent music manager and his girlfriend as a favor to a friend), the game goes out of its way to establish CJ and Grove Street as A Lighter Shade of Black who try to run things in a professional, family-driven manner; while Tenpenny is a ruthless bastard with no standards or morals, who gets an old lady killed, instigates the gang wars that tear apart the city and introduces drugs into the streets, all actions that CJ and Grove Street are appalled by.

Final Verdict?

Taking the alternate continuities + full scope of Tenpenny's actions into account? I say he lands pretty easily. Firm Yes to him from me.

Edited by Ravok on Sep 12th 2023 at 2:02:26 AM

No! That is NOT Solid Snake! Stop impersonating him!
VeryVileVillian Since: Dec, 2017
EmperorGeode from A Galaxy far, far away Since: Oct, 2022 Relationship Status: On the prowl
NTG Since: Aug, 2014
#25692: Sep 12th 2023 at 2:34:15 AM

The GTA franchise is full of horrible criminals even in the GTA 3D universe. You made very convicing arguments in favor of him Ravok and I can’t think of any character from GTA 3, Vice City or San Andreas who’s as bad except maybe Tommy himself from Vice City.

That said, his line about "Fifty of me and this town would be OK!" makes me hesitate. Sounds like he geniuenly believed that he had to do what he did to save the town from criminals. Pretty hypocritcal considering all the things he has done, but still.

Edited by NTG on Sep 12th 2023 at 2:35:00 AM

Ravok Son of Liberty from Big Shell Since: Jun, 2015 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Son of Liberty
#25693: Sep 12th 2023 at 2:44:50 AM

If Tenpenny presented any genuine belief in protecting the city, that would be one thing. But he...doesn't. He runs it into the ground on a regular basis by instigating gang shootouts that drag innocents into the mix, he floods the streets with dangerous crack cocaine that harms civilians and criminals alike, and at the end, when his actions indirectly lead to city-wide rioting? His only concern is robbing Smoke's safe and fleeing the city to save his own ass, uncaring if it tears itself apart. He's, at absolute best, a Knight Templar sneering that "50 of me and this city would be ok", when just one of him is proven to be a power hungry asshole who actively makes the city worse (with CJ openly opining that Tenpenny's scheming has devastated San Andreas), and his only concern when the city is rioting and burning is "welp, time to load my pockets up and get outta town."

No! That is NOT Solid Snake! Stop impersonating him!
NTG Since: Aug, 2014
#25694: Sep 12th 2023 at 2:57:43 AM

Good point. So [tup] for Tenpenny. Never expected GTA to get another CM anytime soon.

Klavice (Elder Troper)
#25695: Sep 12th 2023 at 3:05:40 AM

A long overdue yes to Tenpenny. And I think the Metapocalypse (sp?) Villain is taken seriously enough. For reference sake, every rejected comedy candidate has been shot down for good reason. If someone nukes a planet for fun or is too much of a buffoon (like all the Simpsons candidates) or is a Black Comedic Sociopath, that's where the line is drawn. HOWEVER, Sal does stuff worse than the protagonists, is not a buffoon, and is taken extremely seriously. You want a comedic series with Complete Monsters that feels like what we want from an adult animated sitcom? Try Ace Attorney it's got the right balance of knowing when to take itself seriously while still being series where someone was killed by slipping on a puddle of water (yes this actually happened).

Edited by Klavice on Sep 12th 2023 at 3:06:59 AM

Mr-ex777 Since: Apr, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#25696: Sep 12th 2023 at 3:15:32 AM

[tup] to Tenpenny


[up] Ace Attorney has nothing to do with this.

Klavice (Elder Troper)
#25697: Sep 12th 2023 at 3:17:32 AM

My point was that it was a comedic series that is geared towards older teens and adults without the issues that keeps most adult comedies off this trope.

Evanpotter09 Since: Sep, 2023 Relationship Status: It was only a kiss
#25698: Sep 12th 2023 at 3:20:46 AM

I wasn't expecting this, like at all, but [tup] to Tenpenny.

What, like it's hard?
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#25699: Sep 12th 2023 at 3:23:11 AM

Sure to Tenpenny.

Those Russian traffickers count?

CapitanoNox Lord of Space from Italy Since: Oct, 2018 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder

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