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Magnificent Bastard Cleanup

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Old Magnificent Bastard thread

Welcome to the Magnificent Bastard (MB) cleanup thread! This thread is where we clean up or cut already-existing entries.

If you're looking to add new entries, please see the approval thread.

IMPORTANT: Before you begin any discussions on this thread, please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List

Here, you'll find explanations of the criteria for the trope as well as our rules/procedures for approving and cutting candidates.

What goes through this thread?

    Examples 
  • Cut requests. If you believe a MB has been approved and they do not count, this thread is where you propose their removal. To know how to go about this, please see the FAQ folder on the Administrivia page, where the process is explained in detail.
  • If we ever need to consider cutting multiple examples without individually reviewing them (e.g. if we discover widespread plagiarism with a particular troper's MBs), the initial discussion will be on this thread and we'll then escalate to the mod team (as described here) to get a formal consensus if we decide to recommend a mass cut.
  • If an entry was put on the wrong subpage/YMMV page, you may propose where they should be moved to.
  • Full rewrites of existing entries, including expansions, trims, and ground-up rewrites. If your rewrite is approved by the thread, feel free to add it to the drafts page so that other users can check grammar and the like before it is included with the rest of the weekly swaps.
  • If an entry on a work's YMMV page doesn't match the entry on the media subpage, you can bring it here to discuss which entry works better.

What does not go through this thread?

    Examples 
  • New candidate proposals - as stated before, those are done on this thread.
  • Unapproved wicks - if a Troper encounters either of these kinds of wicks, they can be cut with no approval.
    • Any MB link on a non-YMMV page - as a YMMV trope, it should not be linked on those pages regardless of any cleanup effort. The only exception is if the wick is being used within the definition of another trope.
    • If an MB link on a YMMV page refers to an unapproved character. If it refers to an approved character on any such page, the wick can stay. On the other hand, if the unapproved character being linked to sounds like they might have promise (and you don't feel like checking it out for yourself), feel free to mention it on the approval thread - someone may already know why they don't count, or it could invite a brand new discussion!
  • Proposals for images, quotes, and videos of already-approved MBs - quotes and images are proposed on the approval thread, while videos can be uploaded normally as they are screened for approval by the moderation.
  • Crosswicking examples to YMMV pages - if an example has already been approved and added to the main page, you do not require any special permission to add the example to a work's YMMV page (assuming the work has a page already). If a YMMV page doesn't exist yet, then you can make it yourself, but either way, feel free to just add the example without asking.
  • Small changes to existing entries - these can simply be done on a Troper's own prerogative with no approval.
    • Spelling and grammar fixes.
    • Pothole changes.
    • Minor rewordings.
    • Spoiler tags.

While these changes do not require any kind of approval, it is requested that should you make any of these changes, you do one of the following:

  1. Make the same changes on the relevant Sandbox page, then add the Sandbox to the list at the bottom of the drafts page. This will add the Sandbox to the weekly swaps and ensure that the edits end up on the relevant locked page. If the Sandbox is already listed, then once you make the edits, your job is already done!
  2. If you don't know how the Sandboxes work or simply don't have the time to find it, then you can simply post on the thread about the changes you made. Someone else can then make the edit on the relevant Sandbox and add it to the weekly swaps.
  3. Alternatively, you can simply request that the change be made directly to the locked page on the Locked Pages thread. Members of this thread keep track of that one, so we will ensure that the changes are made in the Sandbox so that it doesn't get deleted during the next swap.

Again, these changes don't require any approval, but we prefer to keep the entries on the YMMV pages and the locked pages the same in order to avoid any miscommunication or errors between entries, so if you do make the change, we would greatly appreciate it if you could ensure the change is made on the locked page as well.

As a final note, we do not care what other sites have to say regarding whether or not a character counts. We have our own criteria and they have theirs for their MB equivalents; while they are similar, they are not exactly the same and should not be treated as such. Another site removing a character from their equivalent should not be a reason why a cut is proposed here, and if this is the case, it will likely lead to mod intervention.

Other than this, once again, welcome to the cleanup thread, and we look forward to your contributions!


Edited by Mrph1 on Jan 14th 2024 at 11:36:43 AM

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#2126: Aug 29th 2023 at 1:52:01 PM

Not entirely, I'd take it to the Get Help with English thread if you're unsure of what needs to be fixed.

Vrx04 Since: Jan, 2023
STARCRUSHER99 The Moron from one of my unhealthy obsessions (Captain) Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
LarryT Since: Aug, 2023
#2130: Aug 30th 2023 at 4:17:16 AM

So there’s a character I want to take a closer look at, she’s on the James Bond Page under the dynamite comics folder. Here’s the entry

Black Box: Selah Sax is a former member of Group 13, a British black-ops team that does the government's dirty work. After a mission accidentally results in several civilian casualties, including children, a guilt-ridden and disillusioned Sax fakes her death. To atone for her past actions, Sax becomes a freelancer who targets assassins and anyone who is a threat to her country. Crossing paths with James Bond after killing one of his targets, Sax teams up with him to track down a black box that contains compromising global secrets. Throughout their time together, Sax proves her guile and resourcefulness by saving Bond on two separate occasions. Sax later convinces Bond to destroy the black box rather than retrieve it for MI 6 and the British government, successfully averting a potential world war in the process.

To me she doesn’t sound like enough of a bastard because killing all those innocents was an accident, she immediately tried to make up for it and only takes out people who would be a threat to the security of her country. But I haven’t read the comic so if someone who’s read it has a good reason to keep her I’d be willing to change my mind.

[down] rewrite looks good

Edited by LarryT on Aug 30th 2023 at 3:35:49 AM

Vrx04 Since: Jan, 2023
#2131: Aug 30th 2023 at 9:03:51 AM

Alright, I now know all of the grammar mistakes I made in my writeup, so I will repost it with all the mistakes fixed.

  • The Great Ace Attorney: Ashley Graydon is a former telegraph operator turned very talented criminal who successfully carries out his crimes with little difficulty. Following a deal made with Magnus McGilded, Graydon steals and conceals government secrets on custom music box disks created by his father to disguise the Morse code as just music. After a deal gone wrong with McGilded that results in his father's death, Graydon seeks vengeance for his father's death and successfully has McGilded murdered, with no evidence tracing him to the crime. After avenging his father's death, Graydon moves on to the next part of his plan to retrieve both disks, repeatedly coming up with backup schemes whenever his previous ones go wrong. Planning everything with razor-sharp efficiency, Graydon proves that he is no one's pawn in their game of chess.

Edited by Vrx04 on Aug 30th 2023 at 9:04:15 AM

FernandoLemon Since: Aug, 2015
#2132: Aug 31st 2023 at 2:10:15 PM

I changed Sandbox.Magnificent Bastard Visual Novels to account for the fact that Gyakuten Kenji 2 now has its own page, as well as fixing a small typo.

VeryVileVillian Since: Dec, 2017
#2133: Sep 1st 2023 at 11:07:20 AM

I remember doing Lucian from a non canon Underworld comic a while ago, yet his entry is nowhere to be seen in MB comic pages. From what i remember he was approved. What happened?

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#2134: Sep 1st 2023 at 11:11:39 AM

Probably got missed. Do you still have the writeup?

Rhino8888 from Spain Since: Mar, 2020
#2135: Sep 1st 2023 at 11:28:24 AM

It's on the sandbox, it just hasn't been swapped yet.

WetFlannels Classy, Refined, Unstable from Nearby, on a cosmological scale. Since: Oct, 2021 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Classy, Refined, Unstable
#2136: Sep 1st 2023 at 2:49:45 PM

I'm not asking for a cut here but I've a question for Ian Howe. Now the guys charming, never pushes the line for being a dick but does anything so he's a comfortable sort of bastard, pulls of genius schemes but his defeat where I question.

His actual final scene shows him doing a scoff when he realised Ben set him up but the reason he got caught was because he was sent there by Ben who lied about the treasure with the intention of sending Ian there because he knew that there was still more to explore where they were. To give Ian credit he was smart enough to leave them behind with the ploy of, if he needs help he knows where to return to, but he basically got sent on a wild lead and then Ben threw him to the feds.

Mitch from the second one goes out in a Heroic Sacrifice so the protagonists can live and was credited with the discovery of the city of gold so he's perfectly fine IMO.

What's wrong D-16? Rise up!
papyru30 from Colorado for summer break Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
#2137: Sep 1st 2023 at 5:57:05 PM

Keep Ian, MBs can screw up and still count and he's a Graceful Loser about it which allows him to keep his magnificence (especially since he's an effective schemer everywhere else).

Sorry I missed you saying it wasn't a cut proposal. My point still stands

Edited by papyru30 on Sep 1st 2023 at 6:58:07 AM

LarryT Since: Aug, 2023
#2138: Sep 2nd 2023 at 3:50:38 AM

One screw up that causes your defeat isn’t isn’t enough to disqualify a candidate, in fact Mbs have small mistakes that cause their downfall all the time. A villain who can’t be defeated and never makes mistakes would be boring to the audience.

Edited by LarryT on Sep 2nd 2023 at 3:51:17 AM

Malginel Since: Aug, 2023
#2139: Sep 2nd 2023 at 2:12:08 PM

I have to apologize for how I handled the Makima discussion. I treated it as a debate that I simply had to win, when that is not how one should act on this thread. I will only bring her up again if something new is revealed about her character that is worthy of discussion in part 2, or any future part (and I will also wait until the part is over).

Besides that I have a change to suggest to the other Chainsaw Man MB

  • Kishibe is an incredibly intelligent Devil Hunter and the sole intellectual rival of Makima. Kishibe introduces himself having been tasked to train Denji and Power in unorthodox methods, proving his skill by repeatedly attacking and terrorizing Denji and Power, each much stronger than him, during their daily lives. Fighting off the allies of the assassin Quanxi, Kishibe deduces that Makima has nefarious plans for mankind, and plots against her, even trying to recruit outright assassins and enemies such as Quanxi. Organizing an "Anti-Makima" squad with a number of Devil Hunters and analyzing the powers that give her invulnerability, Kishibe recruits the Hell Devil to send Makima directly to hell and bypass them, even using sacrifice to empower its abilities. While it fails to defeat Makima due to her using exceptional means, Kishibe later helps Denji get back on his feet, eventually leading to Makima's defeat, and prevails in his goals.

To this

  • Kishibe is an incredibly intelligent Devil Hunter and the sole intellectual rival of Makima. Kishibe introduces himself having been tasked to train Denji and Power, doing so by treating them as 'unbreakable toys' and brutalizing them, while challenging them to kill him. Effortlessly surviving their best attempts to ambush him, he creates a harsh, but ultimately successful training regimen. Fighting off the allies of the assassin Quanxi, Kishibe deduces that Makima has nefarious plans for mankind, and plots against her, even trying to recruit outright assassins and enemies such as Quanxi. Organizing an "Anti-Makima" squad with a number of Devil Hunters and analyzing the powers that give her invulnerability, Kishibe recruits the Hell Devil to send Makima directly to hell and bypass them, even using human sacrifices to empower its abilities. While it fails to defeat Makima due to her using exceptional means, Kishibe later helps Denji get back on his feet, eventually leading to Makima's defeat, and prevails in his goals.

His training with Denji and Power doesn't have them return to their daily lives, its effectively a series of fights to the death. I also thought that the 'unbreakable toys' bit should be mentioned. The human sacrifices edit is just making it more clear what he did.

Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Enid Sinclair
#2140: Sep 2nd 2023 at 2:15:18 PM

For Ian. To me his reaction at the end is what saves him and keeps him on this trope.

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
LarryT Since: Aug, 2023
#2141: Sep 2nd 2023 at 5:21:50 PM

[tup] To the rewrite

Any thoughts on my James Bond post?

PurpleEyedGuma Since: Apr, 2020
#2142: Sep 2nd 2023 at 6:11:16 PM

A note about one of mine, Kaptain Skurvy. Not a cut—on the contrary, his writeup’s fine as is. But I put it in Music when I probably should’ve put it in Web Original. Fan songs do go in Music, but this is an unofficial fan animation set to an existing song (a cover of a song from the source material), and the things that make him count are in the animation and not the song itself.

Riley1sCool Since: Dec, 2014
#2143: Sep 2nd 2023 at 8:15:12 PM

I don't think that change is necessary, I feel the original writeup gets that information across.

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#2144: Sep 3rd 2023 at 6:32:35 AM

Gonna agree the current Kishibe gets the point across.

Malginel Since: Aug, 2023
#2145: Sep 3rd 2023 at 8:45:58 AM

Going to note that after rereading that section of the manga, the training begins when Makima introduces Denji and Power to Kishibe, and subsequent train sessions explictly have them going to that spot, so unless there is a later scene I'm missing he doesn't attack them in their daily lives. Also Denji and Power note that he's too strong and that they need to attack smarter against him, so it doesn't seem like Denji and Power and stronger than him as the write up says. The human sacrifice bit is just clarification, since just 'sacrifice' seems vague. How about this:

  • Kishibe is an incredibly intelligent Devil Hunter and the sole intellectual rival of Makima. Kishibe introduces himself having been tasked to train Denji and Power in unorthodox methods, proving his skill by repeatedly attacking and terrorizing Denji and Power, and effortlessly surviving their attempts to kill him. Fighting off the allies of the assassin Quanxi, Kishibe deduces that Makima has nefarious plans for mankind, and plots against her, even trying to recruit outright assassins and enemies such as Quanxi. Organizing an "Anti-Makima" squad with a number of Devil Hunters and analyzing the powers that give her invulnerability, Kishibe recruits the Hell Devil to send Makima directly to hell and bypass them, even using human sacrifice to empower its abilities. While it fails to defeat Makima due to her using exceptional means, Kishibe later helps Denji get back on his feet, eventually leading to Makima's defeat, and prevails in his goals.

AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#2146: Sep 3rd 2023 at 8:59:51 AM

Like I think Riley did a thorough job on Kishibe's entry.

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#2147: Sep 3rd 2023 at 9:05:55 AM

If there's a factual inaccuracy I don't mind an alteration but for substance I think the current still stands fine.

Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Enid Sinclair
#2148: Sep 3rd 2023 at 1:01:54 PM

I have a question about the in progress Magnificent Bastard Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. It includes the power rangers crossover but I didn't think we included the crossovers on the pages like how we don't include it on the MagnificentBastard.Power Rangers page.

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#2149: Sep 3rd 2023 at 1:03:19 PM

Tbh if we'd rather ax the crossover section and list on both I'm fine with that. I avoided it for ease of use and not missing things that had to be added to multiple locked pages but with Rav taking up the unofficial curator role I'd like to ask for his thoughts on the matter?

Mrph1 he/him from Mercia (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: This is not my beautiful wife!
he/him
#2150: Sep 4th 2023 at 7:38:08 AM

Cutting this from Characters.Drop The Dead Donkey as it's clearly not gone via the approval thread:

Roy Merchant Jr.

  • Magnificent Bastard: Finally manages to overcome his fear of his father with a successful scheme to sell Globelink just as stocks have temporarily risen again.

(Notifier sent)


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