TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

Magnificent Bastard Cleanup

Go To

Old Magnificent Bastard thread

Welcome to the Magnificent Bastard (MB) cleanup thread! This thread is where we clean up or cut already-existing entries.

If you're looking to add new entries, please see the approval thread.

IMPORTANT: Before you begin any discussions on this thread, please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List

Here, you'll find explanations of the criteria for the trope as well as our rules/procedures for approving and cutting candidates.

What goes through this thread?

    Examples 
  • Cut requests. If you believe a MB has been approved and they do not count, this thread is where you propose their removal. To know how to go about this, please see the FAQ folder on the Administrivia page, where the process is explained in detail.
  • If we ever need to consider cutting multiple examples without individually reviewing them (e.g. if we discover widespread plagiarism with a particular troper's MBs), the initial discussion will be on this thread and we'll then escalate to the mod team (as described here) to get a formal consensus if we decide to recommend a mass cut.
  • If an entry was put on the wrong subpage/YMMV page, you may propose where they should be moved to.
  • Full rewrites of existing entries, including expansions, trims, and ground-up rewrites. If your rewrite is approved by the thread, feel free to add it to the drafts page so that other users can check grammar and the like before it is included with the rest of the weekly swaps.
  • If an entry on a work's YMMV page doesn't match the entry on the media subpage, you can bring it here to discuss which entry works better.

What does not go through this thread?

    Examples 
  • New candidate proposals - as stated before, those are done on this thread.
  • Unapproved wicks - if a Troper encounters either of these kinds of wicks, they can be cut with no approval.
    • Any MB link on a non-YMMV page - as a YMMV trope, it should not be linked on those pages regardless of any cleanup effort. The only exception is if the wick is being used within the definition of another trope.
    • If an MB link on a YMMV page refers to an unapproved character. If it refers to an approved character on any such page, the wick can stay. On the other hand, if the unapproved character being linked to sounds like they might have promise (and you don't feel like checking it out for yourself), feel free to mention it on the approval thread - someone may already know why they don't count, or it could invite a brand new discussion!
  • Proposals for images, quotes, and videos of already-approved MBs - quotes and images are proposed on the approval thread, while videos can be uploaded normally as they are screened for approval by the moderation.
  • Crosswicking examples to YMMV pages - if an example has already been approved and added to the main page, you do not require any special permission to add the example to a work's YMMV page (assuming the work has a page already). If a YMMV page doesn't exist yet, then you can make it yourself, but either way, feel free to just add the example without asking.
  • Small changes to existing entries - these can simply be done on a Troper's own prerogative with no approval.
    • Spelling and grammar fixes.
    • Pothole changes.
    • Minor rewordings.
    • Spoiler tags.

While these changes do not require any kind of approval, it is requested that should you make any of these changes, you do one of the following:

  1. Make the same changes on the relevant Sandbox page, then add the Sandbox to the list at the bottom of the drafts page. This will add the Sandbox to the weekly swaps and ensure that the edits end up on the relevant locked page. If the Sandbox is already listed, then once you make the edits, your job is already done!
  2. If you don't know how the Sandboxes work or simply don't have the time to find it, then you can simply post on the thread about the changes you made. Someone else can then make the edit on the relevant Sandbox and add it to the weekly swaps.
  3. Alternatively, you can simply request that the change be made directly to the locked page on the Locked Pages thread. Members of this thread keep track of that one, so we will ensure that the changes are made in the Sandbox so that it doesn't get deleted during the next swap.

Again, these changes don't require any approval, but we prefer to keep the entries on the YMMV pages and the locked pages the same in order to avoid any miscommunication or errors between entries, so if you do make the change, we would greatly appreciate it if you could ensure the change is made on the locked page as well.

As a final note, we do not care what other sites have to say regarding whether or not a character counts. We have our own criteria and they have theirs for their MB equivalents; while they are similar, they are not exactly the same and should not be treated as such. Another site removing a character from their equivalent should not be a reason why a cut is proposed here, and if this is the case, it will likely lead to mod intervention.

Other than this, once again, welcome to the cleanup thread, and we look forward to your contributions!


Edited by Mrph1 on Jan 14th 2024 at 11:36:43 AM

Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Enid Sinclair
#3601: May 25th 2024 at 6:10:49 PM

What potholes did we decide on for Amon and Zaheer?

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
TurlesTheVegan Xykon from The Darkest Pit of the Underworld Since: Dec, 2023 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Xykon
#3602: May 25th 2024 at 7:00:25 PM

Visionary Villain for Amon and Enlightened Antagonist for Zaheer.

Edited by TurlesTheVegan on May 25th 2024 at 10:00:33 AM

Power, it isn't something that you put on or take off like a jacket. It's just something you are.
PassingThrough Since: Feb, 2024
#3603: May 25th 2024 at 7:27:07 PM

Cool with those if they fit!

Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
EmeraldEmperor Lies and Violence! Since: Oct, 2020
Lies and Violence!
#3605: May 26th 2024 at 10:16:19 PM

Minor change for Soundwave from Transformers: Animated, just to emphasize his redeeming qualities.

  • "Sound and Fury" & "Human Error" two-parter: Soundwave, a walking music player intended to be upgraded into a new body for the crippled Megatron, instead gained self-awareness and set out to steal the AllSpark Key so as to uplift his fellow machines into the dominant species, even extending an offer to the Autobots to join his revolution. Returning after his apparent destruction with new robotic minions in tow, Soundwave drugs and captures the Autobots, placing their minds in a virtual world where they're human while he reprograms them to follow his commands. Upon being discovered by Sari, Soundwave takes advantage of the redistribution of his original toy model to brainwash every human in the city and impede her search for help. Adapting to complications in his plans with ease, Soundwave manages to escape even with his body once again destroyed, free to return for revenge another day.

LoadsAndLoadsOfFreeTime Raz (Season 2) Relationship Status: I love you for psychological reasons
taotruths Live Jet Reaction (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: I sleep in a big bed with my wife.
Live Jet Reaction
#3607: May 27th 2024 at 7:12:00 AM

So the YMMV.Neo The World Ends With You page currently has an entry that just says

I commented it out a little bit back, but until an actual proposal is written up for the character in Neo and not the original, it's safe to cut this off right?

Javertshark13 Since: Mar, 2011 Relationship Status: It's not my fault I'm not popular!
#3608: May 27th 2024 at 11:09:07 AM

After checking Marlfox I have some doubts on whether Mokkan holds up. He’s an intelligent schemer and shows some sense of honor, but as things progress he shows a more cowardly side as he has nightmares of being cornered by his enemies in which he begs for mercy, and when the Redwallers show up to confront him he tries to run away rather than face them (the way he's torn apart by pikes is rather undignified too). He definitely acts the part of an MB when things are going his way but I’m not sure he quite makes it.

Edited by Javertshark13 on May 27th 2024 at 4:46:25 AM

AutumnLeaves Since: Mar, 2014
#3609: May 27th 2024 at 11:20:26 AM

Checked up too — all that is true.

Plus, when the Redwallers attack, he feels himself in the continuation of his nightmare and panics, so it's not like his fleeing is a calculated retreat move.

Edited by AutumnLeaves on May 27th 2024 at 9:21:24 PM

jjjj2 from Arrakis Since: Jul, 2015
#3610: May 27th 2024 at 12:11:57 PM

This is lining up with my recollections of the character. Barring something else I'm not remembering, I'm a cut.

You can only write so much in your forum signature. It's not fair that I want to write a piece of writing yet it will cut me off in the mid
PassingThrough Since: Feb, 2024
#3611: May 27th 2024 at 12:36:13 PM

“Being torn apart by pikes” isn’t a reason to cut someone, it’s just a brutal death. If he panics and runs though, that’s an issue and really what the focus should be.

Edit: Talking this one aside with others, I’m gonna concur on the cut but the issue is he turns into a coward when his back’s against the wall. The dreams and violent death aren’t issues for an MB, so let’s just keep it focused on the bravery issue.

Edited by PassingThrough on May 27th 2024 at 3:42:28 PM

Zuxtron Berserk Button: misusing Nightmare Fuel from Node 03 (On A Trope Odyssey)
#3612: May 27th 2024 at 4:20:15 PM

Regarding Giorno, who was brought up a few pages back: All JoJo protagonists are Magnificent; they're smart, resourceful, quick-thinking, and charismatic. So what elevates Giorno to Magnificent Bastard status is that he's far more morally dubious than anyone else.

Joseph is an Anti-Hero in the sense that he has a few traits that go against an Ideal Hero: he's sometimes a bit lazy, sometimes a bit cowardly, sometimes a bit of a jerk, and oftentimes an underhanded Combat Pragmatist. But he's rarely portrayed as actually doing anything morally wrong, and the few times he DOES genuinely act like a Bastard (peeping on Lisa Lisa, cheating on his wife), it's in a way that's portrayed as detracting from his magnificence, rather than adding to it.

Giorno, meanwhile, is extremely morally gray all along. His mission is to rise through the ranks of the mafia, and while his goal is ultimately to protect kids from drug dealers, he's not shown having any objections to any of the other crimes (murder, extortion, etc.) he'd have to endorse once he reaches that point. At one time, he destroys the cars of dozens of strangers, without hesitation, in order to cover his tracks; in another incident, he plays along as his teammates attack some innocent security guards in order to steal a plane.

LoadsAndLoadsOfFreeTime Raz (Season 2) Relationship Status: I love you for psychological reasons
TurlesTheVegan Xykon from The Darkest Pit of the Underworld Since: Dec, 2023 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Xykon
#3614: May 28th 2024 at 8:29:46 AM

Cut Mokkan, fine with the Soundwave rewrite. Also think the Sho note is find to stay?

Power, it isn't something that you put on or take off like a jacket. It's just something you are.
taotruths Live Jet Reaction (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: I sleep in a big bed with my wife.
Live Jet Reaction
#3615: May 28th 2024 at 11:01:08 AM

The issue I have with the note is that it doesn't describe Sho in relation to his actions in the current game, and is referring to the previous game in entry. My understanding is that it would need to describe how Sho is a MB in NEO and not just cause he was one in a previous game. Am I understanding that correctly?

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#3617: May 30th 2024 at 1:42:05 PM

Ah, I see Mr. Smith got approved. I was planning on doing it myself...eventually...but I procrastinated, so whatever. Anyone mind if I try to trim it (it's 325+ words) and, more importantly, add some potholes? One-Man Army for starters.

(And frankly, the fact that the entry doesn't mention his most magnificent moment—having sex with Monica Bellucci WHILE killing mooks—is a travesty [lol])

Not to mention, his unorthodox methods—setting traps at the gun factory and using his fingers as guns—should probably be mentioned.

The current writeup:

  • Magnificent Bastard: Mr. Smith is a mysterious drifter and possible military veteran with a keen sense of karmic justice. Witnessing a heavily pregnant woman in labor escaping from a hitman sent by Mr. Hertz, he saves her by impaling the hitman with a carrot and fends off additional assassins while helping the woman give birth. When the mother is killed in the process, he takes the baby with him and leaves it in a park, hoping for someone to adopt it. When a passerby looking at the baby is shot by Hertz, Smith realizes that the hitmen are also after the baby, takes it back, and with the help of prostitute Donna Quintano, decides to investigate why they're after it, fending off Hertz's goons the whole time. He learns that the baby was bred to be one of three bone marrow donors for Senator Rutledge, who needs them to treat his cancer so he can run for president, and the attempts on its life were part of a conspiracy by gun mogul Hammerson and Hertz to prevent Rutledge from becoming president and enacting more stringent gun control laws. Smith then tells Donna to leave town with the baby and requests a private meeting with Rutledge on his private jet, where he figures out that Rutledge made a deal with Hammerson and Hertz for a bone donor in exchange for looser future gun laws. He holds Rutledge hostage and shoots him in the head, hoping that the news of his assassination would trigger public outrage and immense support for his gun control proposals, and escapes the crashing jet. While he gets captured by Hertz and Hammerson afterwards and is tortured for the location of the baby, he breaks free and kills both of them in return. Smith tips off the FBI to the location of Rutledge's body and reunites with Donna and the baby at a diner, where he foils a robbery despite having his hands broken by Hertz.

PassingThrough Since: Feb, 2024
#3618: May 30th 2024 at 1:53:25 PM

Trim would be appreciate. I could have sworn OP was told to do so but maybe they just went ahead and posted without consensus and it got missed.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#3619: May 30th 2024 at 1:59:53 PM

And those additions also okay? I can make it "fending off Hertz's goons the whole time—including while in the middle of sex with DQ—and using unconventional tactics such as booby trapping a gun factory"

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#3621: May 31st 2024 at 5:14:53 PM

Also: Hal Jordan is getting merged back to Earth Lanterns, while the Sinestro Corps page is absorbing it's namesake. I'll take care of the YMMV and Sandboxes, and add to the swap list.

LoadsAndLoadsOfFreeTime Raz (Season 2) Relationship Status: I love you for psychological reasons
TurlesTheVegan Xykon from The Darkest Pit of the Underworld Since: Dec, 2023 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Xykon
#3623: Jun 1st 2024 at 12:44:23 PM

They were but they're certainly not written well, and I know we discussed cutting Karam, Myurr and Heydrich since they're really awful (with two of them being C Ms, even).

Power, it isn't something that you put on or take off like a jacket. It's just something you are.
LoreDeluxe Since: May, 2013
#3624: Jun 1st 2024 at 12:45:30 PM

We had a conversation on those a few pages back but it petered out. I personally only wanted to keep Jaxartes and the Dark Elf Sorcerer. Everyone else was just too godawful, or in Katarina's case made into a puppet by Heydrich.

Edited by LoreDeluxe on Jun 1st 2024 at 12:47:48 PM

Think you're tough because you made it through Lord of the Rings? Real men survive The Silmarillion.
TurlesTheVegan Xykon from The Darkest Pit of the Underworld Since: Dec, 2023 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Xykon
#3625: Jun 1st 2024 at 12:53:22 PM

I'd agree with that, yeah. Those two will definitely need rewrites though.

Power, it isn't something that you put on or take off like a jacket. It's just something you are.

Total posts: 5,072
Top