Magnificent Bastard Cleanup

Surprisingly the universe stuff didn't bug me. I guess it was a mixture of how he goes throw a fair bit of Villain Decay (although he does bring it back in Survival I must admit but I'm not too sure it's enough?) and his CM writeup makes him seem far too vile for MB?

Yeah sorry about this one, it was stupid of me.

EDIT: Utopia was when the Yana Master regenerated into Harold Saxon, I think you meant Logopolis Mir?

Edited by WetFlannels on Dec 29th 2022 at 12:27:25 PM

I think the original discussion with both Classic Masters was they had copious amounts of charm, wit, and genuine respect/friendship with the Doctor to balance out being pure evil.

Granted my knowledge on Classic Who is fairly limited having only seen some of Jon Pertwee's run.

Edited by Snowy66 on Dec 29th 2022 at 9:57:29 AM

^ Roger Delgado's portrayal of The Master definitely fits the urbane bad guy with world-conquering plans. He didn't mind using allies (willing or otherwise) to accomplish his goals.

The cadvarous Master seen in the Fourth Doctor episode "The Deadly Assassin" is the bridge between the Delgado era and the Tremas version.

Anthony Ainley's incarnation was much the same, but perhaps a more cruel version of the evil Time Lord. After all, he stole a living body to regenerate himself!

Yes I meant Logopolis. Was writing that we'll like at 12 so I got confused.

Writeup for Connor in Ghostrunner YMMV page is a bit different and better written than the one on the main Video Games (A to L) page. Here is Ghostrunner YMMV page version:

Here is main Video Game page version:

I offer to replace the writeup on the main Video Game page with the one, that on Ghostrunner YMMV page.

Go for it Vile.

Also something i forgot. When i brought up grand Inquisitor as potential cut i mentioned that his apperance in second season was illusion created by Yoda , revelated thought Word of God, assuming it is enought of confrimation:

• Season 1 & 2: The Grand Inquisitor was once a Jedi Knight who turned to the Dark Side, becoming the leader of the Inquisitorius, a group dedicated to hunting Jedi who survived Order 66. The Inquisitor used the bones of a deceased Jedi to lure numerous Jedi for him to kill and nearly kills Kanan Jarrus and Ezra Bridger using this tactic. Pursuing the two afterwards, The Inquisitor gathers information on them before entrapping them again and planting a tracking device on their ship to follow them across the galaxy. With the help of Wilhuff Tarkin, the Inquisitor is able to capture Kanan and decides to use him to bait his allies after their attempts to break him fail. Eventually losing to Kanan in a duel, The Inquisitor decides to take his own life rather than suffer a worse punishment for his failures, facing death with complete dignity.

I just remove the last part.

Thoughts?

Edited by EmperorGeode on Dec 30th 2022 at 7:30:36 AM

the re-write looks good

Good!

Thoughts on this quote? Personally I'm torn.

I did add it to Professional Killer.

I'd like to take another look at one of the candidates I had proposed some time back. As, while the final paragraph does a good job at explaining the character's backstory and some of their actions, it doesn't really explain some of their manipulative tactics — which is vital to be an MB. I'd like to remedy that here.

It's not to cut anyone, it's just to make adjustments to the main paragraph.

This is my previous entry for an MB from Just Add Magic

• Season 2A: Charles Peizer, better known as Chuck Hankins is a former protector of the Cookbook from the 1860s. After losing his sister Rose in an attempt to gain immortality, Chuck dedicated every moment of his life to find a way to her back. He eventually met up with Becky Quinn, Ida Perez, and Gina Silvers during their protector era, ruining Ida's life, and indirectly causing the trio to break up and end their protectorship. An accident involving Becky caused Chuck to disappear in 1965 and not come back until 50 years later. From there, Chuck continued trying by masterfully planning various tactics and tricks against the trio and their loved ones. When his sister finally gets released from the book, Chuck instantly reforms himself and happily returns to his era, while also occasionally serve as an ally for the protectors.

But I'm thinking maybe I could add some links, make some clarifications to the context and do some touching up to this. Here's my revised paragraph so far.

• Season 2A: Charles Peizer, better known as Chuck Hankins is a former protector of the Cookbook from the 1860s. After losing his sister Rose in an attempt to make them the permanent owners, Chuck dedicated every moment of his life to find a way to her back. He eventually met up with Becky Quinn, Ida Perez, and Gina Silvers during their protector era, becoming friends with Gina, ruining Ida's life, and indirectly causing the trio to break up and end their protectorship. Disappearing in 1965 and returning 50 years later, he continued trying to bring Rose back by masterfully planning various tactics and tricks against the main girl trio and their close ones, including creating his own cookbook to steal pages from the main book, trapping the protectors in a Morton's Fork with a sleeping spell, taking over Jake's body and posing as him to deceive the heroes, and spelling Hannah into nearly being trapped in the book in Rose's place. When his sister finally gets released from the book, Chuck instantly reforms himself and happily returns to his era, while also occasionally serving as an ally for the protectors.

Is this too much? Any ideas for where trope links should go?

Edited by SpaceProtagonist on Jan 1st 2023 at 4:47:59 AM

This to cut someone? We can't add anyone until the Approval Thread opens. I myself was reminded when I asked about trying to reinstate Humpty.

Edited by futuremoviewriter on Jan 1st 2023 at 1:46:20 AM

I think that can be taken back more Space:

• Season 2A: Charles Peizer, aka Chuck Hankins, is a former protector of the Cookbook from the 1860s. Losing his sister Rose in an attempt to make them the permanent owners, Chuck dedicates his life to finding a way to her back. Meeting Becky Quinn, Ida Perez, and Gina Silvers during their protector era, Chuck becomes friends with Gina, ruins Ida's life, and indirectly causes the trio to break up and end their protectorship. Disappearing in 1965 and returning 50 years later, Chuck continues trying to bring Rose back by tricking the trio: creating his own cookbook to steal pages from the main book, trapping the protectors in a Morton's Fork with a sleeping spell, taking over Jake's body and posing as him to deceive the heroes, and spelling Hannah into nearly being trapped in the book in Rose's place, before reforming when his sister is finally freed from her prison.

Changing to present tense and fixing up some of the grammar too.

Rewrite looks good!

Not bad, but maybe be specific about the "trio" part. There's the OCs trio from the 1960s consisting of Becky, Ida and Gina, but there's also the main/current (at the time) cooking trio, consisting of Kelly, Hannah and Darbie. Perhaps that should be made specific in the EP.

Season 2A: Charles Peizer, aka Chuck Hankins, is a former protector of the Cookbook from the 1860s. Losing his sister Rose in an attempt to make them the permanent owners, Chuck dedicates his life to finding a way to her back. Meeting Becky Quinn, Ida Perez, and Gina Silvers during their protector era in the 1960s, Chuck becomes friends with Gina, ruins Ida's life, and indirectly causes the trio to break up and end their protectorship. Disappearing in 1965 and returning 50 years later, Chuck continues trying to bring Rose back by tricking the 1960s trio Becky, Ida and Gina, along with the current protector trio of Kelly, Hannah and Darbie. He'd create his own cookbook to steal pages from the main book, trap both trios in a Morton's Fork with a sleeping spell, take over Jake's body and pose as him to deceive the heroes, and spell Hannah into nearly being trapped in the book in Rose's place, before reforming when his sister is finally freed from her prison.

The bold text features the biggest change I made, which is the "trio" thing.

Edited by SpaceProtagonist on Jan 2nd 2023 at 4:31:55 AM

Having thought this over a lot, I'd like to contest Yusuf from Inception.

Here's his write-up for reference:

• Yusuf is a brilliant chemist recruited by Dominic Cobb to help with the inception of Robert Fischer. Yusuf developed a sedative powerful enough to allow for several layers of dreams, running a business where people come to be kept asleep for most of the day. Yusuf becomes the dreamer of the first layer of Fischer’s dream and when the team is attacked by militarized projections, he is left to protect them while they go into deeper layers. With his quick thinking Yusuf is able to fend off the projections long enough for the team to get the job done before he gives them the kick to wake them up, flipping off his attackers as he does so.

For discussions last time, there was a bit of contention over whether he does enough to stand out in a film already full of Magnificent Bastards. But ultimately he passed through on the basis of: his chemistry knowledge being crucial for the heist AND being a Badass Driver in how he escapes the projections in the first dream level.

Here's my problems with these points though.

First off his skills as a chemist. His running of the dreamer ring, while undoubtedly indicating he's smart, are largely offscreen. For the most, we don't get see any of that brilliance first hand. While we can hypothesize that he had to elude government officials to keep his illegal activities active, this kinda falls under Fridge Logic and we just don't know the full scope of the situation.

Also, merely providing the stronger sedative for the heist is more of an "on paper smart" than an "in practice smart". It would be one thing if he is seen figuring out the chemical composition of the sedative, but he just had it on hand already. That's more passing over the plot device because you have resources than being magnificent.

His other main selling point, the Badass Driving. On closer inspection, this display isn't really unique among the cast, and not even close to the best. Arthur and Cobb demonstrate a much more impressive showing of trick driving in a more difficult situation at the start of the film. Yusuf for the most just reacts whilst being pressured rather than any definitive strategy, and some of his feats of evading his pursuers may or may not be luck based. There's also the fact that Eames specifically makes fun of "Yusuf's driving", implying he's really not that good at it. Not to mention, he was forced to do the kick early because he was pushed into a corner, and it made things much harder for the rest of the team.

In addition, I feel Yusuf is a bit lacking in charm and charisma, especially in regards to direct people manipulation. He does the least amount of talking out of the main cast so his personality is pretty basic.

I just feel overall that Yusuf just doesn't quite make the cut, largely due to being restricted by the narrative. Overall I'm not too bothered if he stays up, but just felt like I should bring this up.

Edited by Snowy66 on Jan 2nd 2023 at 1:30:57 AM

That's fine Space and I could be persuaded on Yusef but that's a fair point if he doesn't stand out much amongst the other, stronger keepers.

I'd say Yusuf having the technology and definitely knowing how to utilize it is enough to see that aspect without question of him running the ring; he's shown making the best of a bad situation throughout his entire part in the plan as far as I recall; the bit about his "bad driving" could be given context as a joke between friends and since he's the one the team turns to, his knowledge is shown to be impeccable and on an expert level. Also, his niche is different from the rest of the group too. I also could be persuaded otherwise, but for now, I lean to keeping.

Edited by futuremoviewriter on Jan 2nd 2023 at 10:04:36 AM

I was against Yusuf when he first came up and I still am now, the dude is surrounded by badass MBs—4 of them—and while yes, in any other film I could maybe be fine with his lack of dialogue/particularly impressive maneuvers? In a film built around characters being slick, smooth operators, Yusuf is just...kind of there as "the smart guy" who has developed some chemicals, knows how to use them, and drives around the van. And even if it's a bit of a joke, he also kiiiiind of makes the entire "inception" heist harder when he fails to pee before kicking off the first dream, leading to a downpour in the dream which other characters tease him over as it makes their job just the slightest bit harder.

I just think Yusuf is a bit too much of a backseat player in a film filled with in-your-face masterminds, and when he's got mistakes like the above that—though miniscule in any other film—make him look more like a joke in this one compared to his more badass compatriots? I just don't think he stands out. I'm good for cutting him, personally.

Edited by Ravok on Jan 2nd 2023 at 10:27:40 AM

I was against Yusuf as well for those exact reasons. Reiterating my .

Honestly fine cutting per above points. This trope requires you stand out from the others and Its a good point this isn't there?

I honestly forgot about the peeing thing.

Cut Yusuf, ironicaly that teams “smart guy” is only one who dosen’t count.

Something that i think is worth adressing:

• Black Krrsantan is a particularly vicious and dangerous Wookiee Bounty Hunter who started out as an unbeatable gladiator. Years ago ambushing and wiping out several slaver groups until he found one working for the Xonti, Krrsantan willingly joined their Gladiator Games to satisfy his brutality, and though he was enslaved by the Xonti, he eventually escaped and turned to mercenary work. Allying with everyone from Boba Fett himself to Dr. Aphra while always willing to turn on them for the right price, Krrsantan is so deadly that he faces down the likes of Ben Kenobi and Luke Skywalker's band with fierce near-victory. After hunting down and "repaying" the Xonti for their hand in his harsh enslavement, Krrsantan continues his career until rejoining Boba Fett's banner helping the new crime lord take control of Tattooine from the Pyke Syndicate.

Notably despite being listed under The Book of Boba Fett only last sentence covers his time on the show. I think it fits better with Boba under “general”.

Thoughts?

Krrsantan counts in other stuff? Heh. Never even realized.

You know what? I can actually acknowledge that Yusuf does indeed end up middling at best in the end and in comparison to the others in Inception of all things, it stands out even more in the way that it shouldn't. Sad to say, but I gotta agree and say to keeping after all.

Edited by futuremoviewriter on Jan 2nd 2023 at 11:00:47 AM

Cut Yusuf.

Cut Yusuf

Cut Yusuf.