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Complete Monster Cleanup

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Old Complete Monster cleanup thread

Welcome to the new Complete Monster (CM) cleanup thread! This thread is where we clean up or cut already-existing entries.

If you're looking to add new entries, please see the approval thread.

IMPORTANT: Before you begin any discussions on this thread, please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List. Here, you'll find explanations of the criteria for the trope as well as our rules/procedures for approving and cutting candidates.

What goes through this thread?

    Examples 
  • Cut requests. If you believe a CM has been approved and they do not count, this thread is where you propose their removal. To know how to go about this, please see the FAQ folder on the Administrivia page, where the process is explained in detail.
  • If we ever need to consider cutting multiple examples without individually reviewing them (e.g. if we discover widespread plagiarism with a particular troper's CMs), the initial discussion will be on this thread and we'll then escalate to the mod team (as described here) to get a formal consensus if we decide to recommend a mass cut.
  • If an entry was put on the wrong subpage/YMMV page, you may propose where they should be moved to.
  • Full rewrites of existing entries, including expansions, trims, and ground-up rewrites. If your rewrite is approved by the thread, feel free to add it to the drafts page so that other users can check grammar and the like before it is included with the rest of the weekly swaps.
  • If an entry on a work's YMMV page doesn't match the entry on the media subpage, you can bring it here to discuss which entry works better.

What does not go through this thread?

    Examples 
  • New candidate proposals - as stated before, those are done on this thread.
  • Unapproved wicks - if a Troper encounters either of these kinds of wicks, they can be cut with no approval.
    • Any CM link on a non-YMMV page - as a YMMV trope, it should not be linked on those pages regardless of any cleanup effort. The only exception is if the wick is being used within the definition of another trope.
    • If an CM link on a YMMV page refers to an unapproved character. If it refers to an approved character on any such page, the wick can stay. On the other hand, if the unapproved character being linked to sounds like they might have promise (and you don't feel like checking it out for yourself), feel free to mention it on the approval thread - someone may already know why they don't count, or it could invite a brand new discussion!
  • Proposals for images, quotes, and videos of already-approved CMs - quotes and images are proposed on the approval thread, while videos can be uploaded normally as they are screened for approval by the moderation.
  • Crosswicking examples to YMMV pages - if an example has already been approved and added to the main page, you do not require any special permission to add the example to a work's YMMV page (assuming the work has a page already). If a YMMV page doesn't exist yet, then you can make it yourself, but either way, feel free to just add the example without asking.
  • Small changes to existing entries - these can simply be done on a Troper's own prerogative with no approval.
    • Spelling and grammar fixes.
    • Pothole changes.
    • Minor rewordings.
    • Spoiler tags.

While these changes do not require any kind of approval, it is requested that should you make any of these changes, you do one of the following:

  1. Make the same changes on the relevant Sandbox page, then add the Sandbox to the list at the bottom of the drafts page. This will add the Sandbox to the weekly swaps and ensure that the edits end up on the relevant locked page. If the Sandbox is already listed, then once you make the edits, your job is already done!
  2. If you don't know how the Sandboxes work or simply don't have the time to find it, then you can simply post on the thread about the changes you made. Someone else can then make the edit on the relevant Sandbox and add it to the weekly swaps.
  3. Alternatively, you can simply request that the change be made directly to the locked page on the Locked Pages thread. Members of this thread keep track of that one, so we will ensure that the changes are made in the Sandbox so that it doesn't get deleted during the next swap.

Again, these changes don't require any approval, but we prefer to keep the entries on the YMMV pages and the locked pages the same in order to avoid any miscommunication or errors between entries, so if you do make the change, we would greatly appreciate it if you could ensure the change is made on the locked page as well.

As a final note, we do not care what other sites have to say regarding whether or not a character counts. We have our own criteria and they have theirs for their CM equivalents; while they are similar, they are not exactly the same and should not be treated as such. Another site removing a character from their equivalent should not be a reason why a cut is proposed here, and if this is the case, it will likely lead to mod intervention.

Other than this, once again, welcome to the cleanup thread, and we look forward to your contributions!


Edited by Mrph1 on Jan 14th 2024 at 11:30:03 AM

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
Arawn999 Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
#7602: Jul 9th 2023 at 11:29:27 PM

So... now that Carnage (Vol. 3) has been done for a couple of weeks, would it be OK to examine it or should I wait until Web of Carnage — which seems to be a continuation/finale — comes out?

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
Arawn999 Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
WetFlannels Classy, Refined, Unstable from Nearby, on a cosmological scale. Since: Oct, 2021 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Classy, Refined, Unstable
#7605: Jul 11th 2023 at 8:27:38 AM

Am I good to do the next quote bundle? I'll remove the quotes that people voted cut or wasn't a strong vote to keep as I post this.

What's wrong D-16? Rise up!
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#7606: Jul 11th 2023 at 8:59:54 AM

Curious: If not enough people speak up, do you cut or keep?

EDIT: Also, I'm gonna wanna change the MCU Lit Novelizations section to something like this


Film Novelizations, folderized by film release date

Pre-Marvel Cinematic Universe films

    Examples 

Marvel Cinematic Universe films

    Peter David novelizations 

    Junior Novels 
  • Red Skull
  • Ronan

Then we can call the last section "Others".

Edited by ACW on Jul 11th 2023 at 12:08:34 PM

WetFlannels Classy, Refined, Unstable from Nearby, on a cosmological scale. Since: Oct, 2021 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Classy, Refined, Unstable
#7607: Jul 11th 2023 at 9:08:54 AM

@ACW If only vote person votes for a quote to stay when there's a general cut for most of them apart from quotes that multiple people are fine with staying, I've cut it.

What's wrong D-16? Rise up!
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#7608: Jul 11th 2023 at 10:05:03 AM

Also someone proposed a new trope for indirect serial killer on Trope Launch Pad which seems useful. Do you guys have any examples to share.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
WetFlannels Classy, Refined, Unstable from Nearby, on a cosmological scale. Since: Oct, 2021 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Classy, Refined, Unstable
#7609: Jul 11th 2023 at 10:06:23 AM

[up] Does the Psychiatrist CM from Hawaii-Five-0 and Mr X from Poirot count?

What's wrong D-16? Rise up!
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#7610: Jul 11th 2023 at 10:07:28 AM

Yeah. The second guy has already been given an entry.

Theirs also Johan Liebert and Shogo Makishima and Milverton

Edited by miraculous on Jul 11th 2023 at 10:08:33 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#7611: Jul 11th 2023 at 10:58:00 AM

[up][up]What if one person says keep, and nobody else really responds either way?

WetFlannels Classy, Refined, Unstable from Nearby, on a cosmological scale. Since: Oct, 2021 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Classy, Refined, Unstable
#7612: Jul 11th 2023 at 10:59:49 AM

The way people have voted seemed to be "keep X and Y", cut the rest. So I count that as a cut for the quotes not mentioned. (Unless it was just a query about one like the slur and the Talia one)

What's wrong D-16? Rise up!
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
Derv0sB2 Since: Apr, 2020
#7614: Jul 11th 2023 at 4:28:47 PM

If I might while I'm on CM threads today, I have a couple adjustments to existing CM entries propose:

  • The Mummy: Tomb of the Dragon Emperor: Qin Shi Huang, the titular Dragon Emperor, ferociously conquered China two millennia ago. Forcing his defeated enemies to build the Great Wall of China, burying thousands of the dead and exhausted within the foundation, the Emperor cursed their souls to hold up the Wall for eternity. Seeking immortality, the Emperor enlisted the help of sorceress Zi Yuan, but he became enraged that she slept with his oldest friend General Ming; forcing Zi Yuan to watch Ming's execution as he tried to kill them both, before being turned to clay. After his resurrection, the Emperor uses Shangri-La to become immortal, taunting Zi Yuan by intending to forcibly make her and Ming's daughter his bride, and he announces to his terracotta warriors his intent to put the planet under his totalitarian regime.note 
  • Amphibia: King Aldrich Leviathan, the previous ruler of Newtopia and the father of the current ruler King Andrias, is a megalomaniacal tyrant desiring to rule Amphibia for eternity. Having implicitly invaded other worlds during his kingship, Aldrich tasked his son with strip-mining a medieval Earth and exterminating mankind, expressing nothing but contempt for the "primitive species". Upon assimilating his consciousness into the Core, Aldrich groomed his son into becoming the ruthless monarch he was. In the present, Aldrich attempts to manipulate his twelve-year-old host Marcy Wu into permanently assimilating her consciousness into the Core, and when she resists, he spitefully threatens to lock her away in a blank void until her personality permanently fades into catatonia. After being defeated and losing his connection to Marcy, Aldrich activates his final gambit: setting an artificial moon on a collision course with Amphibia, just to deny the heroes their victory.note 

Thoughts?

Edited by Derv0sB2 on Jul 11th 2023 at 4:36:28 AM

AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#7615: Jul 11th 2023 at 5:16:29 PM

Having written the original Aldrich entry, I don't really see the point of these revisions. I felt the original was pretty thorough with the explanation as to why he meets the trope's requirements without entry bloat since he is a minor antagonist. Like the tidbit of Aldrich leaving Marcy to fade away I felt was not entirely needed. Like sure it's bad, but that is debatably minor in comparison to his colonial attitude and being a terrible father.

It just reminds me of that instance of wanting to add that by Aldrich sending the moon to crash into Amphibia, he'd be killing his son when the notion that he was abusive and groomed him was already established.

Edited by AustinDR on Jul 11th 2023 at 5:42:09 AM

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#7616: Jul 11th 2023 at 5:56:58 PM

Likewise I think my Dragon Emperor writeup gets the point across just fine... we don't need every last detail and I'm pretty sure we've discussed the latter entry at least once before and concurred Austin's sums the villain up quite well.

WetFlannels Classy, Refined, Unstable from Nearby, on a cosmological scale. Since: Oct, 2021 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Classy, Refined, Unstable
#7617: Jul 11th 2023 at 6:07:44 PM

Won't comment on the Aldrich stuff since I haven't seen the show.

For the dragon Emperor I don't recall the taunting about the daughter being a major character trait? The current works fine enough for me. This is just me but the only bit I'd alter with the killing of Ming to be something like this:

  • Seeking immortality, the Emperor enlisted the help of sorceress Zi Yuan but became enraged with lustful envy with her for sleeping with one of his Generals and tried to kill them both before Zi Yuan's curse turned the Emperor and his armies to clay.

But the current is fine enough as it is for me to not make a big deal about it IMO.

What's wrong D-16? Rise up!
Libraryseraph uu~ from Canada (Handed A Sword) Relationship Status: Raising My Lily Rank With You
uu~
#7618: Jul 11th 2023 at 6:09:30 PM

I'm fine with adding Marcy's attempted fate to Aldrich's entry; he's consigning a young teen to a fate worse than death for his own ends

HAPPY HALLOWEEN FOR MARIA
AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#7619: Jul 11th 2023 at 6:19:44 PM

Personally, I just feel that is fluff there (like if anything in the OG entry was factually incorrect is one thing). If the consensus wants that, it's fine, but I don't see much reason to include it personally. Somewhat hard-pressed on revising old entries just because they don't include every single act in them.

Edited by AustinDR on Jul 11th 2023 at 6:40:16 AM

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#7620: Jul 11th 2023 at 6:43:41 PM

I do earnestly think the Emperor is good as is. He’s nasty but I don’t think we need the flourishes of personality in the writeup personally.

G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
The 47th President
#7621: Jul 11th 2023 at 7:28:39 PM

[tup] to Keeping both write-ups as is

My sandbox of EPs and other stuff
Siegfried1337 Calabash. from The Eastern Luminant Since: Sep, 2018 Relationship Status: Will you go out with me to the End?
Calabash.
#7622: Jul 11th 2023 at 7:43:00 PM

[tup] Both rewrites

Cut Masamune Dan

Eh, good enough.
LoreDeluxe Since: May, 2013
#7623: Jul 11th 2023 at 8:08:43 PM

Yes to Dan, but no to both rewrites.

Think you're tough because you made it through Lord of the Rings? Real men survive The Silmarillion.
ASghhrv6ub Best Smile from Second star to the right. Since: Jun, 2020 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Arawn999 Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
#7625: Jul 11th 2023 at 10:57:37 PM

[tup] Aldrich's rewrite, abstain on the Emperor's


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