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MasterN Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button from Florida- I mean Unova Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#2426: Oct 12th 2022 at 11:26:16 AM

There’s a reason why “Played Seriously” was recently added as a bullet point on the Administrivia list (we required it for a long time, but I realized we did not have it written on the actual list of qualifications and so I had it added).

One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.
Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#2427: Oct 12th 2022 at 11:29:29 AM

Parody or parody-like characters are very tricky though since you are pretty much always fighting an uphill battle to get them approved since the thread is somewhat understandably going to be very skeptical on them.

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#2428: Oct 12th 2022 at 11:33:02 AM

Like most things: balancing act. In regards to this thread I think the main takeaways are "Be open minded polite."

Klavice (Elder Troper)
#2429: Oct 12th 2022 at 11:48:18 AM

That's why I only proposed comical characters for MB. It's all about finding that sweet spot between darkly comical and horrible. Like a character that makes jests every now and then (Laughably Evil) but they don't detract from their awfulness (The Joker Depending on the Writer and Kefka are prime examples.) We wouldn't take down Kefka for simply saying "Son of a submariner!" during the Figaro escape in the Ted Woolsey translation. After all Beware the Silly Ones is a trope for a reason.

If it's something like... Scary Movie 3 or something, and the characters uses Black Comedy Rape, yeah that's a different story.

Edited by Klavice on Oct 12th 2022 at 11:52:58 AM

MinisterOfSinister From 'Ell's 'eart Oi stab at ye! from In the Hall of the Mountain King Since: Jan, 2014 Relationship Status: What is this thing you call love?
From 'Ell's 'eart Oi stab at ye!
#2430: Oct 12th 2022 at 11:52:31 AM

My personal pick for parody film CM is Sarris from Galaxy Quest. The film is an Affectionate Parody of Star Trek but Sarris not remotely Played for Laughs and the story is still serious enough.

Edited by MinisterOfSinister on Jan 31st 2023 at 9:42:20 AM

Klavice (Elder Troper)
#2431: Oct 12th 2022 at 11:55:51 AM

I think we should just trust in the troper to know the difference between Eats Babies and sings a goofy song, vs Eats Babies and sings a deadly sinister song about genocide or something. Judge Turpin from Sweeney Todd is an example of a singing CM that doesn't at all detract from his vileness. He's a monster any way you look at it.

Edited by Klavice on Oct 12th 2022 at 11:58:55 AM

WetFlannels Classy, Refined, Unstable from Nearby, on a cosmological scale. Since: Oct, 2021 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Classy, Refined, Unstable
#2432: Oct 12th 2022 at 11:57:19 AM

Films that are Affectionate Parody I'm much more lenient on since they take the narrative itself seriously while being somewhat humorous.

What's wrong D-16? Rise up!
Ravok Son of Liberty from Big Shell Since: Jun, 2015 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Son of Liberty
#2433: Oct 12th 2022 at 12:10:25 PM

I'm gonna reiterate that I feel like this kind of discussion is better suited for the restarted threads when they happen. This discussion is for changing thread behavior...not really for discussing the tropes and its facets.

No! That is NOT Solid Snake! Stop impersonating him!
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#2434: Oct 12th 2022 at 12:12:16 PM

100%, if we're reaching the point where we're discussing nuances of the trope and what we should/shouldn't be considering for a candidate to be viable I'd also argue we're into the grounds suited for the CM matters and discussion thread that's to be made.

EmperorGeode from A Galaxy far, far away Since: Oct, 2022 Relationship Status: On the prowl
#2435: Oct 12th 2022 at 12:48:14 PM

Just to check on restarted threads when we do eps we can do writeups whenever but they can go to drafts only after 3 days?

STARCRUSHER99 The Moron from one of my unhealthy obsessions (Captain) Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The Moron
#2436: Oct 12th 2022 at 1:52:10 PM

Yes, basically - you can write it whenever but it goes into the drafts after 72 hours at minimum.

Anyone wanna check out Thread Suggestions and see if there's any resolved discussions I forgot to add in there?

ErikModi Knight Bachelor from Where ComStar can't find me. Since: Mar, 2012 Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Knight Bachelor
#2437: Oct 12th 2022 at 2:26:02 PM

Looking at Thread Suggestions, and seems good. . . but I hit something I just have to ask about, because I can't rest until I get an answer.

What the hell is Van Zant Syndrome? The only "Van Zandt" I know of is in BattleTech, and I find it hard to believe that's relevant.

MasterJoseph Frolaytia X Qwenthur of Heavy Object from Not telling. Since: Mar, 2018 Relationship Status: All I Want for Christmas is a Girlfriend
Frolaytia X Qwenthur of Heavy Object
#2438: Oct 12th 2022 at 2:27:06 PM

It refers to Van Zant from Dragon Ball Z.

IPP Wick Check created.
WetFlannels Classy, Refined, Unstable from Nearby, on a cosmological scale. Since: Oct, 2021 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Classy, Refined, Unstable
#2439: Oct 12th 2022 at 2:28:15 PM

It was a term coined by the thread to describe a character that would pass normally in a normal heinous standard but is flunked because high scale forms of villainy is treated common.

I think it's from DBZ where a character called Van Zant went on a murder spree with no resources and no redeeming qualities which would be prime CM material... except planet destroying in Dragon Ball is considered the norm.

What's wrong D-16? Rise up!
ErikModi Knight Bachelor from Where ComStar can't find me. Since: Mar, 2012 Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Knight Bachelor
#2440: Oct 12th 2022 at 2:30:22 PM

Ah, gotcha.

Yeah, never watched DBZ.

Misry6 Imperfect Disgrace from the Eternal Nothingness Since: Nov, 2021 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Imperfect Disgrace
#2441: Oct 12th 2022 at 2:30:22 PM

And what is Criminal Minds Syndrome?

Just an empty void…
WetFlannels Classy, Refined, Unstable from Nearby, on a cosmological scale. Since: Oct, 2021 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Classy, Refined, Unstable
#2442: Oct 12th 2022 at 2:31:39 PM

When the work's heinous standard is sufficiently fucked so you basically have to have both quality and quantity to stand out. There was a purge on Criminal Minds because some serial killers/rapists were deemed "not heinous" enough in the show.

What's wrong D-16? Rise up!
EmperorGeode from A Galaxy far, far away Since: Oct, 2022 Relationship Status: On the prowl
#2443: Oct 12th 2022 at 2:32:42 PM

[up][up] when there is so many heinous villain that one who would fit in most setting dosen’t land

[up] that is much better explanation

Edited by EmperorGeode on Oct 12th 2022 at 2:33:16 AM

Snowy66 Since: May, 2012
#2444: Oct 12th 2022 at 2:33:38 PM

I think Criminal Minds syndrome is when every villain present is so god awful that you can get away with almost anything and not be seen as too bad. Which is also relevant for Magnificent Bastard.

Edited by Snowy66 on Oct 12th 2022 at 2:34:16 AM

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#2445: Oct 12th 2022 at 3:09:20 PM

[up] Not QUITE. It's when a character who would EASILY count in a vacuum isn't heinous enough for the setting.

Now, as for the difference between that and Van Zant Syndrome...hell, I coined both, and can't really explain the difference [lol] I think what Snowy described may be more the latter though.

Ravok Son of Liberty from Big Shell Since: Jun, 2015 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Son of Liberty
#2446: Oct 12th 2022 at 3:14:12 PM

So, looking over Thread Suggestions, I think we've pretty much covered all the big issues and I love how far we've come and compromised. The one sole thing I kind of would like to note is that I don't think the "2 per namespace" on reservations is wholly needed. 5 per troper is already a pretty nice limit, so I don't think further locking it into "only 2 per medium" is really a necessary addition. I'm not even saying this as someone who necessarily wants more than 2 reservations per namespace, just that it feels like a needlessly strict addendum to a rule that will already leave plenty of works to go around. So if someone wants 3 video games or 4 books to be their snags, I personally don't think it's necessary to limit it when they're, by extension, leaving open more movies, TV, etc. for others to snag.

No! That is NOT Solid Snake! Stop impersonating him!
MasterN Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button from Florida- I mean Unova Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#2447: Oct 12th 2022 at 3:16:37 PM

Criminal Minds Syndrome- villain would be bad enough to qualify as CM in most stories, but the one they are in has so many other villains who are either equally as bad or worse, so they don’t stand out.

Van Zant Syndrome- variant of the above applied to villains who don’t have a lot of resources, like Van Zant himself, a normal human Spree Killer in a series full of planet-destroying baddies. Basically, when having lees resources is still not enough to make you stand out.

One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#2448: Oct 12th 2022 at 3:16:49 PM

I think it's to prevent situations where there's, say, a bunch of new movies announced at once and one person just scoops up all of them. It's not really an issue when it's just a bunch of random unrelated books or something though.

Edited by WarJay77 on Oct 12th 2022 at 6:17:26 AM

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
futuremoviewriter Since: Jun, 2014
#2449: Oct 12th 2022 at 3:18:46 PM

To prevent stepping on each other's toes with the EP limit, should we set a schedule so that each day and each hour is covered and we know what's coming?

Or at least we know which Tropers are scheduled for which hours of the day?

Edited by futuremoviewriter on Oct 12th 2022 at 3:21:01 AM

Ravok Son of Liberty from Big Shell Since: Jun, 2015 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Son of Liberty
#2450: Oct 12th 2022 at 3:22:07 PM

[up][up] True. But by, let's say, scooping all of those movies up, that's leaving the door open for other movies, tv, games, etc. out of their grasp and open for others. It basically just comes down to, for me, a matter of "if you want to use one of your valuable 5 reservations for 4 or 5 anime, literature, games, etc? Cool, now there's 3 or 4 things you could have grabbed in another category that now someone else might." 5 is already a pretty solid barrier against someone hogging reservations, and I just feel that if someone wants to use most of theirs for a particular media source that they enjoy over others, it shouldn't necessarily be hindered by "2 per namespace."

"You have 5, you can use those 5 how you wish, but you better be mindful of them", is how I would personally want to look at it.

No! That is NOT Solid Snake! Stop impersonating him!

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